Good morning! I’m writing this from the bedroom of an Airbnb in Portland, Oregon, and we’re back in town for a wedding because my brother is finally marrying his partner of twelve years. It’s going to be a hectic weekend, and it doesn’t stop there: Right after we get back to Maryland, we’re off to see The Warning in concert in Baltimore. All very cool stuff, but it doesn’t leave me much time to write. However, I know I owe it to you, faithful readers, to keep providing you with a steady stream of poor automotive life choices, so we’re going to do things a little differently this week. I’ll explain in a minute.
On Friday, we finished up a week of exploring the Facebook “Underappreciated Survivors” group, and I asked you to choose which car out of the four winners was most deserving of more attention and appreciation than it gets. And you chose the Audi A6. I can’t disagree with that; it always bothered me how 60 Minutes did Audi dirty, especially right before it built some of its best cars. This A6 is at least as nice of a car as the contemporary BMW 5 Series, but because of the scandal, hardly anybody bothered to find that out.
Though considering that the Fiat 850 came in a strong second, I think some of you ignored the brief and just picked your favorite. And if that’s the case, then I still choose the Audi. That’s a hell of a lot of car for $4,500, and while it might not be as set-and-forget reliable as an Accord or Camry, it’s nowhere near as fragile or finicky as the Audis of a few years later.
All right. Since I’m going to be all over the place for the next few days, I won’t be able to check results and then write the next day’s Showdown like I usually do. Hell, I might not even have time to read comments. I’ll just have to squeeze in writing whenever I can, like now. So I’m going to front-load most of the week, without any analysis of the results at the top, and then on Thursday evening, from the comfort of my own sofa, I’ll check all the comments and results from the week, and we’ll do a four-way shootout. Sound good? We’ll start off with this pair of Little Dead Corvettes.
1979 Chevrolet Corvette – $2,200
Engine/drivetrain: 350 cubic inch OHV V8, three-speed automatic, RWD
Location: Urbana, IL
Odometer reading: 76,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and… drives? Not clear
The fourteen-year run of the C3 Corvette could be called “The Decline And Fall Of The Corvette Empire.” Its wild “Coke-bottle” shape, based on the Mako Shark II show car, caused a huge stir in 1968. It looked like a rocketship, which is fitting, because it was the Earthbound ride of choice for Apollo astronauts. And it was no slouch in the performance department either, with a variety of small- and big-block V8s propelling it to ill-advised speeds. But as the 1970s wore on, new regulations and requirements had their way with the Corvette, as they did with all cars, and… let’s just say Chevy engineers did the best they could.
Horsepower in this 1979 model was actually up from its low a few years earlier, and the Corvette was still one of the quickest cars you could get that year, but these days you’ll be embarrassed by pretty much any minivan. Its 350 V8 was available with either a four-speed manual or a three-speed TH400 automatic; this one has the automatic, as did most ’79 Corvettes. The ad’s description is terse, but if I’m reading it right, this car starts and runs, and just had new brakes installed, which I guess means it’s drivable? It’s hard to say.
A lot of old Corvettes with low miles have been babied, and are kept meticulously clean by owners who hardly ever take them out of the garage. But late C3s are nearly always the exception to that rule. You see some nice clean ones, certainly, but you also see a lot of them in various stages of dereliction. This one looks like no one has cared about it in a very long time. It’s filthy inside, the dash is cracked, the horn button is missing, and I don’t even want to know what that pile of stuff in the passenger’s seat is. Best not to dwell on it, I think; just shop-vac it up, unbolt the seats, burn them, and replace them with something else.
The paint is toast, and it seems to ride on a hodgepodge of wheels and tires, but it’s undamaged. Obviously the fiberglass body isn’t going to rust, but the steel frame can, so it’s worth an inspection to make sure everything is up to snuff. It looks like it’s missing some trim: the emblems are gone, and it’s missing the rocker panel trim strips (probably removed to repaint it, then lost), but Corvette restoration outlets sell those.
1984 Chevrolet Corvette – $1,000
Engine/drivetrain: 350 cubic inch OHV V8, four-speed automatic, RWD
Location: Reno, NV
Odometer reading: 94,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and drives – but has no title
The all-new-for-1984 Corvette appeared to huge fanfare as well, after Chevy skipped the 1983 model year. This car, along with the third-generation Camaro and Firebird, and the revived Mustang GT, heralded the end of the malaise era, at least when it came to performance cars. Finally some real horsepower was back on the menu, along with high-tech gadgets and a chassis that actually liked to go around corners. Us 80s kids knew this car marked the end of something and the start of something better, and we snapped up posters and model kits and toys of it like there was no tomorrow. This is still the “new Corvette” in my mind, forty-one years after the fact.
The engine and transmission were actually carryovers from the final-year C3, a 350 V8 with “Cross-Fire” dual-throttle-body fuel injection and the new TH-700R4 four-speed automatic. The famous Doug Nash 4+3 manual was also available, but not until later in the year. The Cross-Fire fuel injection system has a bad reputation – some wags call it “Cease-Fire Injection” – but this one runs and drives fine, according to the seller. So why the low price? It has no title. There are a few ways around that problem: you can find out what Nevada’s rules for applying for a lost title are, you can take it to another state that doesn’t issue titles for cars this old, or you can use it as the basis for a track-only race car, which rarely have titles anyway.
The interior of this one is pretty trashed as well, though it’s nowhere near as gross as the C3 inside. The seats could use reupholstering, and the dash has some cracks – and once again, the horn button is missing. What’s with that? Do horn buttons fall off old Corvettes, or do people steal them out of derelict cars for the emblem? Inquiring minds want to know.
Outside, the paint is chipped, and it has one mismatched wheel, but it’s not in terrible shape. In fact, if you can get the title sorted out, this could be a good way to experience Corvette ownership on the cheap. These early C4s are only a step above late C3s in the minds of most Corvette people, so you needn’t worry about restoring it. It will never really be worth all that much. It could be a lot of fun for a little while, though.
The world of old Corvette ownership seems like a strange place. Too many people take them way too seriously, which is why it’s refreshing to see a couple of cheap running examples like these. They’re supposed to be accessible; “America’s Sports Car” and all that. They were never meant to sit in garages while old men fawn over them. They’re meant to drive. And with a little work, these could both be back on the road. Which one would you rather put the effort into?
C3 for me. No title on the C4 is concerning but the Cross-fire seals it’s fate. Even though the C3 is bad, I’ve owned, and salvaged, far worse projects.
the titleless cheapo thing kind of makes me think I could probably part it out for maybe a few dollars more, but do I really want to spend time doing that? The 79 is pretty much a Gian pile of dung and it has just about every red flag you can think of….but if I were to maybe try my hand at the revival type Youtube video’s that one would be a humdinger of a start. I suppose for that sake I might have to go tetanus/hanta Vette.
On the ’79, my doctor says “no”.
As for the ’84, well, no title means no sale. The whole point of a title is so that I know you are the rightful owner I’m buying it from.
Plenty of decent beater ‘Vettes out there in the 5 grand range. I’d wait for one of those.
Obviously, a cheap bike picked out of a ditch would be a far less embarrassing option than spending money on either of these cars. But if forced to choose (which has to be assumed for this exercise), I would go for the C4 and part it out to get my money back.
Bus pass.
Fiberglass may not rust but UV (among other things like some.chemicals) degrades it to the point that it can soak water up,.delaminate and/or get soft. I bet that C3 has a lot of that going on.
This is a very common problem in old boats. It’s less common, but still a problem for old Corvettes. I wouldn’t consider one that’s been without a topcoat for more than a few years. You might be cutting out and patching soft spots for the next twenty years.
The C4 is way better, but the C3 was driven by award winning acting legend Dirk Diggler, so there’s only one choice for me.
I absolutely cannot stand the looks of the C3, never have, so I’ll take the C4.
Really? As a kid it was the hottest-looking car on the road for most of the ’70s. But I get it, the exaggerated fenders can be off-putting.
Nope, never liked them. Hate them even more with the side pipes.
I’m not a fan of side pipes on any car. They ruin the line at the rocker panel.
The C4 is superior to the C3 in every single way except looks.
I’ll take the C3 and resto-mod the bejeezus out of it, after talking the owner down to half what they are asking based on the passenger seat alone.
Resto-mod would be the way. Especially with a stick shift, this car is screaming for one.
C3. At least you KNOW at some point you can put it back on the road. Probably. The whole “clean and open title” phrase in the ad makes me a little nervous. Less nervous than no title at all, tho.
We wanted shitbox showdown we got it.
Keep up the good work.
The ’84, because the ’79 screams “kill it with fire”. Seriously, I get what Mark said here about the C4, and I was absolutely in that generation when it hit the scene. Hell…C3 started the year I was born and C4 came out the year I could drive.
C4 at least does not look like a biohazard and should be solid. Cross-fire would not be my choice, but something better could be dropped in.
My vote is for the C4 as it’s less trashed and is half the cost.
That cost will more than be exceeded in money and hassle getting a title.
I’m thinking that I would either part out that heap or use it as an autoX vehicle. Or maybe use it as a 24 hours of lemons vehicle.
If I wanted a vehicle for on-road use, I wouldn’t want either of these.
Oof, this is skimming the bottom of the barrel. Well done, Mark! Enjoy those celebrations, you’ve earned them after wading through those ads!
I’ll take the C4 because racecar. That C3 is too far gone for my liking.
C4. It’s Nevada, so I assume you could paperclip some extra cash to your title application and walk out with a new one. I’ll take this even with the cross fire engine.
C3 is peak malaise. Interior color is the same as a Caprice Classic station wagon from the same year that I had. I assume the switchgear is the same, and the engine is probably strangled by the same red-hot old-school catalytic converter.
I don’t know where this was stored, but they managed to get a fiberglass car to appear rusted. I don’t have much hope for the steel parts. The 5.7 V8 makes less than 200hp from an engine with a compression ratio that would be incredibly low even for a forced induction car today.
The C4 posting has been deleted by its author, but we’ll pretend it’s still there.
BOTH, please!
Swap the drivetrain and anything else that will fit from the C4 into the C3.
Sell/donate the C4 husk to a charity sledgehammer event.
Rattle can the C3 in bedliner – extra points for a harlequin design – and go hoon.
They both need a manual trans. But the C3 will look good side-piped, and the C4 needs the crossfire engine removed and put in something more modern.
The C3 has potential for fun. It’s a fiberglass car that as long as the chasis is good you can put the modern stuff into it and just trash what is there. You are buying the frame and the engine and trans for th 2k.
C4 Vette Kart!
I can’t believe I just voted C3 over C4 as a big C4 fan, but the lack of a title is a no-go for me. At that price, the C4 will sadly become a parts car. Plus that crapfire injection would need to go anyway.
I’ve cleaned up way worse than than C3 interior – but how did that happen? It’s got to be missing a side window if the top is still there?
See I’d much rather figure out the title mess than be anywhere near that C3 interior. The passenger window is down in the pics, so it might be missing or otherwise broken. Regardless, no thanks. But once you get it cleaned up I’d love to take a ride!
You can’t even use either of these for parts for better versions of their respective generation.
I keep eying a (much nicer) C4 convertible near me. But my partner says no to me having a second car (and then clarified no second vehicle when I suggested one car and one pickup again). I’ll always have a soft spot for the C4 because I was impressionable when pop-up headlights were popular.
That said, I would have voted for the C4 no matter what. I needed decontamination after just looking at the interior photos of that C3.
Never seek a more specific ‘no.’
Correct move would have been to leave it at ‘no second car’ and then shop for and purchase a truck / motorcycle / motorhome / backhoe.
+1 vote for backhoe acquisition
I’m not sure what a backhoe is, but I’m certain that offends hoes everywhere!
It’s obviously the other end of a front loader.
I dunno, I don’t really want to find a place when she kicks me out. So I guess if I’m getting a second vehicle, the motorhome is the one. Which is too bad. I really want to daily a backhoe, now that you mention it.
I did consider finding a storage unit I could park in so that the biggest problem with multiple vehicles would be solved. Makes it harder for her to say no.
These are two of the worst examples of a car that I don’t care much for. I don’t mind the early C3, but the later ones just don’t do it for me. And the C4 will always be the worst generation to me. Having said that, in this case I’ll save a bit of money and go for the car that doesn’t have an interior that should come with a biohazard warning label. Reluctant C4 vote.
NO
I hear that, but if I may propose an alternative… Hear me out now, what if instead of no, we went a slightly different direction, and said YES!!
No.
Yes!
lol I don’t mind changing the rules sometimes…. like going to bed 15 min later then normal.
So… You changed your vote to both, got it! Thanks!