Good morning! This week, we are sticking with sticks – every car will have a traditional three-pedal manual, what used to be called a “standard” transmission. Don’t know how to drive one? That’s all right; it’s never too late to learn.
Last week, I asked you to pick one project car and one daily driver from our four finalists. A few of you were upset that you couldn’t choose the Impala as a daily driver, but come on – do you really want to manuever that sucker around in parking lots all the time? Or put up with ten miles to the gallon just to get to work? I mean, I guess if you’re okay with that, you do you – but it wasn’t the assignment.
The rest of us couldn’t form much of a consensus among the other pairings. The Mirage paired with the big red Impala ended up winning, but not by much. I think that’s the way I would go, too; that Focus would bore the hell out of me, and the only reason I would want the Jaguar is to rescue it from someone who wants to pull out its good-running V12 and stuff in a Chevy V8. But actually, that’s a pretty good reason.
Now then: Manual transmissions are a funny thing on here. If I feature one, I usually try to make sure the other car has one as well, because it is rare that an automatic will beat a manual in the votes. The manual has to be really dull or undesirable, or the automatic has to be really cool and special, otherwise the voting is a foregone conclusion.
So this week, I’m only searching for manuals, and I’m trying to find some cars that you don’t often see with a third pedal. Today’s cars are rare enough, being two-door variants of popular four-door sedans, but on top of that, they both have stickshifts. Let’s check them out.
2004 Toyota Camry Solara SE – $5,000
Engine/drivetrain: 2.4-liter dual overhead cam inline 4, five-speed manual, FWD
Location: Austin, TX
Odometer reading: 223,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and drives great
If, like me, you’ve ever worked anywhere that brought in an efficiency expert, you’ve probably heard the term “Kaizen,” probably in the context of an incredibly boring PowerPoint presentation. But regardless of the involvement of thirty-something dudes in polo shirts, the concept is sound: make small improvements, all the time, instead of making grand sweeping changes or resting on your laurels. And if you’re looking for a concrete example, there’s likely not a better one than the Toyota Camry – at least until Toyota discontinued the manual transmission option. I can’t in good conscience call that an “improvement.”
The best Camrys paired that manual transmission with a series of four-cylinder engines; yes, the V6 option was available with a manual for a while, but it’s so crowded in the engine bay that repairs and maintenance will make you regret going for the extra power. In this 2004 model, the four-cylinder engine displaces 2.4 liters and has variable valve timing. It also, critically, uses a timing chain rather than a belt, eliminating one of the more odious maintenance tasks of earlier Camry engines. This one has cleared 200,000 miles and is not letting up; the seller says it runs and drives great.
The two-door Solara is a bit of an odd duck: it’s too big and soft to be a sports coupe, and not nice enough to be considered a personal luxury coupe. It’s basically just a Camry with worse access to the rear seats. As you would expect from the high mileage, it’s worn and grubby inside, but nothing looks damaged. It’s an SE model, with all the options, and everything works including the air conditioning.
Outside, it’s in good condition, but I could never call this a good-looking car. It looks simultaneously inflated and melted, and good grief does it have a huge ass. But at least it’s clean and shiny.
2009 Nissan Altima 2.5S Coupe – $3,500
Engine/drivetrain: 2.5-liter overhead cam inline 4, six-speed manual, FWD
Location: Rochester, NY
Odometer reading: 181,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and drives great
The Nissan Altima has a terrible reputation that is in no way the fault of the car itself. In fact, when you consider the neglect and abuse that the stereotypical Altima driver heaps on the car, I would say it’s something of a hero. What other car could do 90 MPH on a donut spare, with half its front bumper missing and probably fifteen-thousand-mile-old oil? It stands to reason, then, that a well-maintained Altima should last just about forever.
In 2009, the Altima was available with two engines: a QR25DE 2.5-liter four and Nissan’s ever-present VQ35DE V6. Either one could be had with either a CVT automatic or a six-speed manual. This one has the manual and the four-cylinder. This engine had some serious oil consumption issues in earlier model years, but Nissan had taken care of it by this point. It runs and drives great, according to the seller, and has been “treated with love.”
I gotta say, I love this car’s interior. When so many other cars are available in nothing but black or gray inside, these oxblood-red seats and door inserts really stand out. It’s such a little thing to add a splash of color, but it makes such a huge difference. I don’t know why manufacturers don’t do it more often. It’s in really good condition, too. With an interior this clean, I’m inclined to believe that the seller took proper care of everything else.
These Altima coupes are uncommon; I think I’ve only seen a handful of them in person, and nearly always black like this. The photos in this ad are terrible, but as far as I can tell, it’s not rusty. Earlier Altimas had a propensity to rust, but these don’t have the same reputation. Still, since it’s an upstate New York car, you’d be wise to peek underneath.
Two-door coupes are disappearing from the market, and I guess you could say these two are good examples of why. Neither one of them has anything to recommend it over the four-door sedan version of the same car, except for the novelty of being a coupe. But they are a bit more interesting to look at than their four-door counterparts, so I’m glad that Toyota and Nissan decided to offer them. Even more so because they were available with manual transmissions. They’re both getting up there in mileage, but both look like they’ve been well-kept. So what’s your strategy: pay the Toyota tax, or save a little and go for the lower-mileage Nissan?
Having a hard time deciding between the two. That Altima indeed looks to be in pretty nice shape with a great interior color but I do not care for leather upholstery at all, plus it’s a Nissan, you know, Nissan Is Still Sadly A Nissan (ha.)
As for the Solara, the photo of its rear end shows it with a temporary plate dated August 1, 2024 (nearly a full year ago) which gives one pause…
Less money for the Altima seems like a no-brainer!
For 5k I notice an empty coolant bottle and pair of vice grips holding the prop strut open on the Solara. It looks clean but seems beat. I’ll take the Altima.
2nd gen Solaras used the 2AZ-FE. That engine was notorious for oil consumption issues. I’m not saying this particular sample suffers from that problem but it’s not what I’d associate with Toyota’s finest
I never would have thought the seats would have made a decision so hard.
This is sort of like seeing a couple of dating profiles online: the first one is posted on Christian Mingle. She looks alright in a bland way, but dressed very conservatively. You’ll have a nice little date, but it’s not going to be scintillating. You could probably date for awhile, and have a nice reliable partner.
The other is posted on a normal dating site. She too seems reasonably normal, looks alright, but there might be a red flag or two if you read between the lines. But it could be nothing. Except this: In one of her photos, she’s wearing red leather pants.
Does the Altima still have the same soul if it lacks a Jatco Xtronic CVT? Gotta roll the dice with the red leather…..seats….today.
It feels so empty without me.
The Solara was always an odd-looking car, although the two-tone paint job that some came with was very nice.
This Altima represents one of the few Nissans made later than 2006 that I wouldn’t kick out of bed. The QR25DE’s teething troubles were worked out by ’05 based on my experience with a Sentra SE-R Spec V from that year.
An Altima SE-R would be a no brainer, but those were only made in ’05-’06, and maintaining an older transverse VQ is not a game I want to play anyway. So the manual 2.5 Altima is probably the best way to go.
I’d still rather have the same engine on the lighter Sentra SE-R, even if that storied model was on its last legs by 2009.
The Altima coupe is a particularly ugly thing. Plus, it is an Altima. The Toyota by default.
Somebody should grab the Altima. The next Altima 600 is coming up and all the good ones in Florida are bought up already.
I can’t believe I just voted for an Altima from Rochester, but I actually did. I guess the overall presentation tipped the scale, which is something considering the photos. I’m having a hard time picturing this thing being owned by anyone who wasn’t slightly fanatical about keeping it rinsed during the goddawful winter months up there. To that end, I’m thinking that it probably was imported to the Empire State for the last few years, rather than spending its life there…I don’t know how it would have possibly fared that well otherwise.
I loved living in Rochester and then Cleveland but wow… the rust on cars I grew up with, out west. Hondas with rusting seams. Volvos with rusted out floorboards. It blew my mind. Happy to be in Washington, where we just assault your bodywork and windshield with sand and gravel when it snows.
I am team No Altima in all circumstances. A coupe removes practicality while offering nothing. Nice interior, but that doesn’t do enough.
The Solaras always reminded me of a throwback to Malaise-era ‘personal luxury coupes’ with not so much luxury.
Solara, and only because it’s a Texas car compared to the Rust Belt Altima; also a better color than black. If that Altima was a southern car initially that was transported to New York after a long life in the south, I might change my vote as it’s better looking and a better handling vehicle.
I think the concerns about rust on the Altima are overblown. Modern-ish cars don’t rust out if you take care of them (i.e. wash them). I wouldn’t want a 1980s car from region that uses salt, but I’m far less concerned about newer cars, particularly those that look well maintained. I have seen many 15+ year old cars in the upper midwest that don’t have significant rust. Upstate New York is probably worse for salt than Minnesota, but it isn’t much worse.
Plus, at this price range, these aren’t cars you are looking at driving for the long term. Even if the car has some rust, I’m not overly concerned as long as it is safe to drive.
Rust is inevitable. My 12 year old ST is starting to show spots of rust, even though it’s been pretty well taken care of and only driven in the summer the past 5 years. Plus, the majority of people who are in the market for these cheap cars need them to last as long as possible because it’s probably all the money they have.
I guess from my experience I don’t see rust as inevitable. I had a Civic I drove for 11 years and sold to a relative who drove it 5 more years before it was totaled. That car had no identifiable rust despite spending its entire existence in Minnesota and Wisconsin. My brother had a Focus that was similarly rust free when he sold it, despite spending its 12 or so years in Minnesota. Both of these vehicles were washed regularly in the winter, but that was all the effort that went into preventing rust.
Obviously, not all cars will fare as well as those two, but I don’t think they were outliers. I don’t see any reason to believe the Altima is severely rusty just because of where it is currently located. Similarly, I wouldn’t assume the Toyota isn’t rusty just because of where it is currently located.
My ’10 Focus had zero rust whatsoever when I sold it 3 months ago. I don’t live in the rust-belt (“DMV” region) but we have winter, and there is salt on the roads annually. I did basic suspension work (links, packaged struts, shocks) and no issues at all with rusty bolts or pieces.
Newer cars tend to have plastic stuff that can hide rust from a normal human-eye view. Slide under there and check out those subframe bolts and you’ll be singing a different tune.
I did the maintenance, repairs, and a few modifications to the Civic myself (the vehicle I was referring to in my reply above, in case you didn’t see that), so I was underneath that car a lot. It might have had some rust in hidden areas, but anything visible was good.
Cars from up north are not all rusty heaps. That is a hill I’m willing to die on.
Although, I will acknowledge a lot of northern cars are terrible – I owned a few rusty shitboxes when I lived up north.
I can see one staying clean if the owner is really on task. No winter storms, frequent car washes (with underbody extra), and a nice dry heated garage can make the difference. A lot of Northern convertibles stay very clean because they NEVER leave the garage between October and April.
I’m a simple man. 3 Pedals? Red leather seats? It doesn’t take much
Torn between my “Nissan is Never the Answer” policy and wanting to drive a 6 speed manual.
Cheaper, newer, less miles, slightly better looking for me please.
I’m with you. Even the convertible version of the Solara is ugly.
I’ll take the Altima. It’s in better condition, has a groovy interior, looks vaguely like an Infiniti G35 coupe, and isn’t boring as fuck like the Solara.
I’ve actually ridden in one of these Altima coupes, and it’s quite the story. I was in NYC back in 2010/11 to celebrate New Year’s Eve with one of my friends I was in college with at the time. Everyone assumed we were dating but it was completely platonic, she was kind of like a little sister to me and we liked partying together.
Anyway little did I know she was from a mob family. Like…an actual mob family, I could identify the New York syndicate most of her family was affiliated with but I’d rather not. Unfortunately she got too drunk on NYE because she decided to slam rum while on antibiotics. We wound up getting separated downtown, which was as much of a nightmare you’d think it is.
Her phone died and I eventually gave up trying to find her and took the train back to her mom’s house. I was picked up by her uncle, who was a Robert De Niro doppelgänger and the vibe he gave off was that of an enforcer. Anyway he dropped me off at a hotel, told me he’d kill me if she didn’t show up by morning, and sped off.
Fortunately she found her way home. Anyway I got a very stern talking to the next day (they just refused to believe we weren’t dating) from her uncle who was walking around the house with firearms. After that I was on the verge of a panic attack, so my friend called her friend to pick us up and take us to their weed dealer so I could smoke up to try to calm my nerves. Her friend showed up in…you guessed it! An Altima coupe.
Anyway we weren’t friends for much longer. One of my buddies eventually dated her and came back so scarred from his New York visit that he wouldn’t talk about it for years. She’s currently incarcerated for embezzling tens of thousands of dollars from one of the family businesses that I assume was for money laundering. I had to have a conversation with an FBI agent about that arrest because she thought it was clever to put me down as her therapist.
It’s best to avoid the mob at all costs. Hollywood glamorizes it but these are literally the worst people you’ll ever encounter. I still voted for the Altima because it secured me weed, her friend was cool and attractive, and we got to listen to Modest Mouse during the drive.
Holy crap, dude. I mean, I’ve got some college stories, but…
As I’ve said a few times, I was totally fine quitting drinking 5 years ago in my late 20s because I’d partied enough for one lifetime….back in the era of this tale I was convinced that Hunter S Thompson had laid out the blueprint for how to live and acted accordingly. Suffice to say there are a handful of situations in my early and mid 20s that I consider myself fortunate to have walked away from relatively unscathed, and this one is at the top of the list haha.
I just read and envisioned that story with Meadow Soprano as a stand-in. You were the cute nerdy mixed-race guy she was interested in, but his parents smartly told him to keep away. The uncle could have been either Paulie, Christopher, or Richie Aprille. Richie terrified me.
Good assessment, I love the Sopranos. Greatest TV show of all time IMHO. I’d say her uncle was kind of like a younger Paulie (but like I said, looked and sounded like earlier career De Niro. Think Jimmy in Goodfellas). There was just that antisocial, “gives you the heebie jeebies” even though he’s talking and presenting very normally type of vibe. Even before the incident I’d had a conversation with him and IMMEDIATELY could tell he was bad news even as a shithead 20 year old.
Something about him was just profoundly unsettling. My brain and nervous system were screaming DANGER at me even though I’d just shaken his hand and was shooting the breeze with him. In entirely predictable fashion, when I asked him what he did for a living he got even more intimidating and said…you guessed it! Sanitation.
Without getting too detailed, I grew up on the east coast, not in the NY metro area proper, but on the fringes. My teenage and early college years were practically priest-like by comparison, but yeah there’s a few times I could have legit gotten killed or killed myself. My college had a lot of NJ & NY types. So many stories, probably true, or partly true. A good one, not NY/NJ but a guy I knew from Rhode Island. He was like 12, walking outside some store or deli or something. Guy grabs him & shoves a baseball bat in his hand. “hey kid, stand outside this door and don’t let nobody in till I come back.” He’s in and out in seconds, takes the bat back, says “good job thanks kid” gives him a $10 bill and drives off in a Cadillac.
> Something about him was just profoundly unsettling. My brain and nervous system were screaming DANGER at me even though I’d just shaken his hand and was shooting the breeze with him.
It is wild to run into one of these folks – it’s only happened to me once, but yeah, exactly that experience – my whole system lit up the moment this dude looked at me. Colleague of a friend of mine, couldn’t even tell you what it was, but my brain started screaming “PREDATOR!” the moment we locked eyes. Those old instincts don’t get used much in the modern world, but man, when they kick on, it’s a trip.
Oh man. I have been in a bizarrely similar situation, except we were actually dating and it was a Chicago family, not New York. Yes. It’s best to avoid the mob at all costs. That “welcome to da family” feels so cool when you meet her parents and they welcome you in. It stops feeling cool when it gets real.
Yeah once you realize what the people that are being buddy buddy with you are actually capable of it’s a lot less fun….
Having driven a Solara before, it’s the ultimate daily commuter. So comfy.
Yup, it’s a Camry for one (or two), and the SLE interior is indistinguishable from a Lexus.
I still get compliments regarding my 07 Solara Convertible. I think the Solara is better looking than the Altima, especially with that nice blue paint.
It’s also worth mentioning that an upstate New York car will always have corrosion, no matter how nicely you treat it.
I would pay the price difference between these two, not for the Toyota tax, but for a Texas underbody and chassis. If the Altima was the older, more expensive Texas car, I would have chosen it.
That’s my thinking. The Altima has definitely seen some road salt in Rochester. The only salt the Toyota has seen in Austin is on the rim of a passenger’s margarita glass.
I’m not sure I was consciously aware Toyota produced a Solara that wasn’t a convertible. Frankly, I don’t know why this car needs to exist. A hardtop Solara is an inconvenient and uglier Camry – what’s the point? The price is also too high. I know Toyotas have a good reputation, but this is an undesirable 21 year old high mileage Toyota… $5k is nuts.
In contrast, I think the Altima actually looks better as a coupe than a sedan. I also like the red seats and red accents in the door panels. This car also looks like it is in better condition than the Toyota. This seems like a solid deal for $3,500. The owner also specifically states he is ready to negotiate, so I presume this can be bought for closer to $3,000.
The Nissan is nicer, newer, lower mileage, and cheaper. Aside from anti-Altima bias or a fanatical enthusiasm for Toyotas, I don’t see any reason to choose the Toyota. The Nissan should win in a landslide.
Rust. Upstate New York versus Texas.
These cars are old enough I wouldn’t assume they have spent their entire existences in their current locations (especially the Toyota – Austin has grown so rapidly I’m not sure anyone who currently lives there is actually from there). Obviously, I would check for rust on both of these cars.
If I owned a car as ugly as that Solara, I would find a way to get it to rust out. The Solara may be reliable, but that is a liability. I can’t imagine having to look at that thing for years to come.
The only positive feelings I have on either of these is the interior color of the Altima.
I have to pick, I guess it’s the Altima.
Same here. Reluctantly.
Damn you Mark, I cannot BELIEVE you got me to vote for an Altima. If it was a first-gen Solara the result would be totally different, but the second-gen is awful. That rear 3/4 with that bulbous badonk and the shopping-cart wheels tucked waaay up in the arches like frightened turtles… eww.
Hey, in order to get busy with maximum efficiency, I need a girl with a 400-ton booty. Which the second-gen Solara has.
You’d change your tune if you ever had to load the trunk, it’s as big as my old LeSabre.
You’re right about the rims, though. 18s and an inch wider would look waaay better.
The Altima gets an easy win here I think between it lacking the horrible cvt and being a reasonable price.
Team Solara here. The Altima coupes are still semi-common in these parts, but I don’t think I’ve seen a Solara Coupe in a decade. When you’re comparing two commonplace vehicles, I do value rarity more than normal. Plus, you know, Toyota’s reputation.
I still think $5k is overinflated, but worth the Toyota Tax here.
That big ass was supposed to be a nod to the Lexus SC430 of the same era, which the designer said was inspired by a fancy yacht. Sure, I guess.
Ever since I got one, I see them everywhere. A guy who works around the block from my work has a red convert with Polish eagles all over it. And my neighbor- just two doors down and across the street- has a blue convert with Wisco plates parked in the driveway for the last month.
It’s Big Altima Energy time!
The real question here is: “Do you prefer going 30mph in the left lane with your blinker on; or 120 in the shoulder with your hazards on?”
I think you know which car is which.
I clicked on this article a second time just so I could read this comment again.
I’ll take the Altima. One of us has to save it from it’s inevitable fate.