I was expecting Lucid to announce two new vehicles here at the Lucid Investor Day. Now there’s three. While these are all based on the same platform, it’s not yet obvious how similar the vehicles are to one another. The biggest news, I think, is that the company is giving them mechanical doors.
There were literally cheers in the room when it was announced that the annoying electrical doors are on the way out, which is probably given smart that they’re already being banned in China, with the United States and Europe probably not far behind.
The first two vehicles will be named Cosmos and Earth, as I mentioned in the liveblog this morning. These will almost certainly be some sort of crossover/SUV vehicle that’ll slot up against the Rivian R2 and Tesla Model Y.
As a way of telling us about the vehicles without actually showing us the vehicles, was for SVP of Design Derek Jenkins showing us a chart with who these drivers might be:
This probably means that whatever the third thing is, probably is some sort of off-road-oriented vehicle.
Here’s another hint at it based on some images provided in today’s presentation:
It’s like a Gravity, but smaller, maybe? While this might be a prototype, the implication here is that this is basically what it’s supposed to look like. I’m just assuming this is Cosmos based on the order.
Here’s a view of the vehicle in profile, which is an interesting silhouette and feels fairly Lucid. A bigger change, though, is that the vehicles have moved from two screens in the Gravity and Air into one screen. Theoretically, I like this better, although given the distance from the wheel to the screen I wonder how much the company will skew the experience to be focused on voice control.
Also, because Lucid is learning from the rest of the market, they announced redundant physical controls below the dash. So, yes, there’s a big screen, but there are also some buttons as well.
The part of the presentation that I was a little less interested in is Lucid’s AI assistant, which is something that plays well in China but hasn’t been fully adopted here yet. It’s possible that this will change at some point in the future. Because of poor connectivity, the live presentation in the building didn’t work, but they had a pre-recorded video just in case and it seems similar to other existing systems.
There are going to be more updates coming this morning from various engineers about the ways the vehicle has been made light, efficient, and affordable. Given that the Lucid Air is extraordinarily efficient, this is probably the team that can pull this off. As I learn more I’ll update this post.
It’s All About ‘Radical Efficiency’
One of the biggest points that Lucid has made this morning is that “radical efficiency” is key. This means pulling ECUs out of the system to just three, and lowering the number of wires, for instance, to just 1,100 wires.
The new Atlas drive unit is much smaller to compared to what is in the current Air and Gravity. Even better, if I understood, those drive units are identical up front and to power the rear.
While efficiency is key, what’s interesting is that chief engineer Zach Walker says “we are not Gigacasting” as there are places that are better for steel stampings, aluminum extrusion, and aluminum casting. This makes building the vehicles cheaper and, according to Walker, it’ll lower the cost of insurance by about $1,000 per year for consumers. This is obviously an issue as at least one Rivian R1 cost $40,000 to repair due to a large casting.
When it comes to the differentiation, the vehicles will share parts (95% it says above), but CEO Marc Winthehoff says “They’ll look very different.”
While pricing remains to be seen, and will probably vary by model, at least one of the vehicles will start at “Under $50,000,” which is to say maybe lower than the average transaction price for a new car in the United States.
I’m expecting unprofitable cars with extremely competent mechanical and electrical engineering but a subpar software experience – for their sake I hope I’m wrong.
Also, those segment marketing terms are awful
You don’t want to be Nurtured in an Upscale way? Clearly you’re not a Trendsetting Achiever.
I will not be taking you with me on my Active Explorations!!!
COTD
This.
If they would just put driver controls and y’know, *doors*, on that “driverless prototype”, I’d be WAY more interested. That’s the size of EV that I want, especially if it gets anything close to the efficiency numbers Lucid is touting. A GTI-sized EV with 350+ miles of range is certainly what I want, especially if they can get the cost down to around $40K.
An announcement about a future announcement. The timing is probably due to Rivian launching the R2, the actual vehicle, today.
I generally like Lucid and even own some of their stock (which, last I checked, is now worth approximately 12 cents, if you round up). My main thoughts on this:
Will these move the needle for the company? No idea. We won’t know until they show us something more meaningful than “Upscale Nurturers” *hurk*.
It’s down under 10 cents now, because I call nonsense on the reverse split they did.
Lucid is so hosed.
I don’t know who in fuck an “upscale nurturer” is supposed to be but I don’t want to own any car designed for this person.
I think it’s referring to high-priced wet nurses.
I believe that’s called an Au Pair?
I read “soccer mom” + “80th percentile household income”.
What if the upscale nurturer had large boobs? Would that change your mind?
:-p
The top shot brings out my cloud yelling. Who thinks no side wall tires makes any sense for the real world?
Marketing people, rappers and lazy car designers.
“Because of poor connectivity, the live presentation in the building didn’t work, ”
So what happens when you get someplace without connectivity. Does the car still work? Does it just lose the stupid features that nobody will use more than once? Will you be trapped in a parking garage because it needs to call home and can’t?
Not everywhere has good internet.
Well I think that it he said that it caused the AI demonstration to fail. If the AI failing is all, then no problem.
I want to like Lucid’s products, but up until now, they have royally screwed up in two extremely important areas:
There is a reason I bought an Ioniq 5 – while every EV-specific reviewer out there complains about Hyundai’s “outdated” and “boring” software, I like having a car with software that actually works and has freaking buttons for mirrors seats, air vents, etc. Look at Jason Fenske’s videos on Lucid – his Air is borderline unusable due to software glitches, and Lucid basically admitted that there was no fix for some of his issues. The Gravity has been marginally better but is still plagued with problems like the vehicle not recognizing the car key. Come on! My Mercedes from 2010 literally never failed to recognize the key in my pocket.
Lucid and other startup automakers would do well to take the Bernie Sander’s approach to software – no one cares how innovative and equitable your political ideas are if the roads don’t get plowed and the trash doesn’t get picked up. I don’t need all this fancy software that’s infinitely configurable. I just want to get in my car and drive, and have a nice experience doing so.
Furthermore, although I personally quite like the way the Air looks, if the Cosmos and Earth take styling cues from the Gravity, they will be dead in the water when buyers look at them next to an R2, iX3, EX60, etc. Buyers will happily sacrifice a few miles of range for a shape that looks cool, even if it isn’t 100% optimized for airflow.
Lucid is so innovative and forward thinking in so many areas, and their vehicles would be wonderful if they could just sort these two areas. It boggles my mind that the new R2 is still on a 400v architecture, but if the R2 has decent software, I’d buy it over a finicky, unreliable Lucid in a heartbeat. I also love Lucid’s focus on efficiency. While Polestar is stuffing massive 100 kWh battery packs into the P4 and somehow barely getting 280 miles of range, the Gravity gets nearly double the range with a battery pack only 19% larger.
Having battery chemistry optimized for space and ultra-fast charging and motors optimized for efficiency is exactly what every EV automaker needs to be laser focused on, but ultimately, the cars still need to work as cars, and that is where Lucid has been a letdown thus far. Hopefully, their upcoming vehicles break that trend.
“Buyers will happily sacrifice a few miles of range for a shape that looks cool, even if it isn’t 100% optimized for airflow.”
“I also love Lucid’s focus on efficiency. While Polestar is stuffing massive 100 kWh battery packs into the P4 and somehow barely getting 280 miles of range, the Gravity gets nearly double the range with a battery pack only 19% larger.”
You just contradicted yourself here.
Besides the motors – How do you think Lucid gets that level of efficiency?
It’s literally the difference between pushing a barn and a wedge thru the air.
I could have been clearer. Although aerodynamics are part of how Lucid gets their vehicles to be more efficient, another huge aspect is their motor/drivetrain development. They have the most efficient drive units in the industry, and the technology behind how they work is fascinating. Lucid is laser-focused on making efficiency gains everywhere, not just low-hanging fruit like aerodynamics.
In my view, that should give them some wiggle room to be a little more free with design so their cars stand out next to Teslas blobs. Like, I’d be way more interested in a Gravity that looks cool and has a 450 mile range rather than the current minivan that has a 500 mile range.
Unless confined to a low speed urban setting, aerodynamics has a far greater effect on efficiency than the small difference in EV motors, components known for their efficiency industry-wide.
If the first two models are Earth and then Cosmos, then the third model has to be… Quantum Multiverse?
Air, Gravity, Earth, Cosmos, …. Energy? At this point they need to sell stock at least as much as cars, so something buzz worthy and aspirational.
“Air, Gravity, Earth, Cosmos, …. Energy?”
Fire!
Like the band Earth Wind and Fire.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XIMuUBVuWM
Pretty sure Fire, Water, Carbon, and Vacuum are on a marketing says no list.
They’ll eventually expand to five total so they can do a crossover with the Captain Planet and Transformers franchises. /s
Heck, Cosmos is already the name of a friendly Autobot.
“Lucid Dream” would be a terrific model for them to put out.
They already have the Lucid Gravity Dream Edition… but the “Dream” model name has already been used by the Chinese company Voyah.
What’s the “Social Experience” with a car to mean?
Are they piping garbage into my HMI?
The marketing mumbo jumbo is crazy on this.
I have a “dynamic and emotionally expressive gesture” for this…
Yes, I’m an upscale nurturer looking for a trendsetting achiever to optimize investments and leverage scale by creating a synergistic relationship together. Hopefully if things go right, we can use some dynamically and emotionally expressive gestures to get to know each other even better. I hope to form a captivating bond…
So you’re seeking a 6’5″ guy with blue eyes in finance with a trust fund….
Love that song. ????
You left out the part about acting with intention to live a meaningful and fulfilling life aligned with your core beliefs and purposeful values.
LinkedIn started a dating app?
Its time for another round of Buzzword Bingo!!!!!
Did they, at least, hand out bullshitbingo cards at the start?
When I’m driving, I don’t want anyone driving near me to be having a “social experience” behind the wheel. How about designing cars that are so good people want to *drive* them, instead of finding myriad ways of distracting from the tasks at hand?
If they don’t use this in the commercial for the Cosmos, the advertising firm needs to be fired.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JE1H5FymBaw
Title correction: “Lucid is launching a PR campaign in a last ditch push to investors”
I want Lucid to succeed, but they just don’t have the cash to see this through
But do they have all the cards?
From the screen image:
Let me stop you right there, Lucid. If you’re talking about socializing with the people in the car, the screen is not helping with that. If you’re talking about socializing with people not in the car, 1) at most you need a microphone and speaker, not a giant screen and 2) I think we’ve pretty fully proven that aspiring to have all your “social” interactions through a screen is bad for people.
On one hand….something to cross shop the R2 I want against
On the other….fuck giving the Saudis my money
I like certain principles of Lucid–mainly their interior packaging and their thinking to minimize weight to minimize necessary battery size–but I generally like everything else about Rivian more.
I’m excitedly awaiting more information on the R2 today after yesterday’s leak. I’m certainly not waiting for whatever Lucid may have coming down the road, if they last that long.
I too appreciate the Rivian ethos…and that premium trim for under $54,000 with *only* 450 horsepower? Thats as much as you’ll spend on a loaded Passport or moderately well equipped 4Runner….I keep telling all of the EV haters that are doing their victory laps right now, this thing is going to sell well on its merits alone. The fact that it’s an EV is secondary to the fact that it’s a really neat truck.
$58k for the launch package also seems like a steal. 200 extra (completely unnecessary) horsepower, comes with the tow package, you get lifetime Autonomy+, full active suspension…
Plus, getting the R2 over a Passport, means you are saving like $1,000~$1,500 per year in fuel costs if you charge at home 100% of the time (I’m using R1S numbers here, which surely the R2 will be more efficient due to it’s smaller size, and newer components).
The Passport chugs gas! It’s pretty much perfect otherwise but woof is the mileage a compromise
I sure hope you’re right. Assuming those prices hold, the R2 will make any regular ICE SUV in this segment look like a terrible deal. Unfortunately, so many people are still convinced that EVs can never work for them because once a year they go on a road trip.
I am literally going to trade in my wife’s 5th gen 4Runner for the 450hp R2 as fast as I possibly can.
I had originally planned on buying a 4Runner or Passport as my dad car in the next 2 years or so. I’d also have looked at a Bronco and Grand Cherokee. Due to the absolutely ghastly economic conditions we’re all suffering through that’s been pushed back a few years and we’re gonna ride the Kona N into the ground…but now?
I’m just getting an R2. I’d resigned myself to putting up with miserable fuel economy…and then I realized I don’t have to do that! I can run a cool off roader that I’m never actually taking off road on electrons instead! Neato.
dude, yup. It makes a lot of sense. Really glad I waited for this instead of just getting the R1 from the jump. It’s just a little too big for her to daily.
I agree. Rivian is quite far behind Lucid when it comes to efficiency and battery configuration, but the R2 looks amazing, is affordable, and hopefully will have software that works. I’m also a little more confident that Rivian will be around for the long run.
Dark backlit image looks suspiciously like Torch’s preview image of the Highlander…
I really wish that one of these was a medium-sized sedan or wagon instead of another gods-damned crossover.
Ditto
That chart of potential buyers is oddly disturbing.
Upscale care givers
Wolf of Wall Streeters
People who get lost all the time
As a car designer I can decipher the bs for you:
Marin County Trophy wives
Y Combinator Cofounders
Boba drinking, rock climbing tech bros
I like it!
I think they should workshop the name on the latter.
Hey, I can’t wait to buy a Lucid Stay Tuned!
Are owners going to abbreviate Cosmos as The Coz, the way people do with Vette, Stang, and Cuda?
Mos def..initly.
Perhaps not, but look for a Lucid-branded cocktail mix in the future…
After seeing that giant dash screen, I can at least save time in the future by never having to click an article about anything this company offers. That’s just me though. If others like it, then fine, I guess.
Lucid Earth, Wind & Fire
Do you remember
The 12th morning of March?
Love was changin’ the minds of pretenders
While chasin’ the clouds away
If they waited until Sunday; we could have made Shakespeare & Caesar jokes
If the Earth is near 40K you have my attention.
So you’re saying the Earth… pulls you.
Only if reasonably priced, otherwise I’ll be forced to obey the laws of Gravity.
Nice.
I have the equal and opposite reaction.
Soundtracked by Carole King.
The Lucid Stay Tuned, for all the active explorers out there!
Who’s on first?
Let’s start with the Third One.
The what?
Stay tuned.
And the unfortunately rare variety of guitar player.
Hey, they chose that tuning to stand out and it only sounds bad because you just don’t appreciate good music. At least, that’s what they’re going to tell you when you call them out on it.
“Hey, forget the tuning. Listen to the what I played!”
”That’s what I was doing. Unfortunately.”