Earlier this year I went on a trip to see the cars of Hagerty’s vaunted Bull Market list. The editors went out of their way to establish that this isn’t about finding a cheap investment car that’ll be worth something someday. Instead, the premise is that the cars they listed were relatively undervalued and therefore more approachable for enthusiasts at different price points.
A vintage car’s value, like the value of most non-essential items, is based on what people will pay and not some sort of inherent worth. If the ability to perform the task of moving people, which is a car’s core purpose, was the main arbiter of merit then Bring A Trailer would be overwhelmed with 15-year-old Toyota Sienna minivans and not finicky Alfa Romeos.
The valuableness of a vintage car isn’t entirely arbitrary, of course. Old Alfa Romeos look and sound heavenly, in a way that’s almost objective. A Jaguar E-Type without a roof is more valuable than a Jaguar E-Type with a roof because it’s the iconic version of that particular car. But it does start to get a little random as you get deeper into the hobby.
Another car on that list was the DeLorean DMC-12, a vehicle that’s not great in a lot of ways. It’s a sports car that won’t sports. It’s not that quick, being way heavier than originally conceived. It’s part of a brand that no longer exists, so it doesn’t have the lineage of a Porsche or a Ferrari. It’s got an unloved French-conceived V6 behind the driver, they break all the time, and are best enjoyed at about 35 miles per hour.
And, yet, they’re valuable. Sure, they look cool, but so does a Saab Sonnett, which shares many traits with the DMC-12. A Sonnett is also, in a way, probably more fun to drive. But it wasn’t in a movie and it doesn’t have those doors [Ed note: don’t sleep on the Sonnett’s manual pop-ups, though– Pete]. A more modern example is the BMW i8. This is a car that looks cool, has fun doors, and does almost nothing particularly well. It looks like a supercar and doesn’t really perform like one. This is why they’ve depreciated so quickly.
Will those values ever come back? David tends to think the answer is “no” and he’s crazy for his similar i3 so I’d listen to him. I think the same is true of the Saab Sonnett, which will always be a great deal. They’re not alone. There are plenty of cool classic cars that might never cost that much. Is this a bad thing? Nope. I agree with Hagerty that it’s great that there are still affordable ways to do this hobby.
Image: Curb Your Enthusiasm
My dad had a good friend when I was a kid that went 0 for 3 on cool cars when it comes to becoming more valuable. His collection was
1962 Avanti R1 with a great history
1964 Rambler Station Wagon with a new innovative rear gate that was copied by others.
1965 Corvair Corsa Convertible
All three were in perfect condition and absolutely factory. Sort of. The Avanti was actually an uber Rare R3 that had been lowered and equipped with a roll cage for a record run on the Salt Flats. As a backup, it was sent back to the factory and the original engine and the cage were removed. It was exactly as it left the factory, but not exactly like originally built as a result.
The Avanti is worth $30k today if you accept it is a R1 and $60k if was accepted as an R3.
The Rambler is worth $10k at best
The Corvair is worth $20k at best
Inflation adjusted from when I was a kid, these things are actually worth less than they were in the 1980s.
(All this dude’s bad luck was offset by another friend that got obsessed with E-types in the 70s when people sold them cheap because they were hard to work on and didn’t like unleaded gas. Dude filled a giant warehouse with them. Had something like 200 of them.)
Your dad’s friend IS/WAS cool, regardless of what shape his retirement nest-egg was in. Those are interesting cars!
Triumph Spitfire and MG B from late sixties to early eighties:
There are just too many of them around!
Alot of fun, fast cars have been brought up… counterpoint… slowish, terrible handing, rough ride, but 100% fun…I’ve always thought Jeeps CJ-7s hit a fun sweet spot. May take a bit to find one not rusted out but can still find clean examples from $8-15k for a fun, convertible, analog experience. Seems like a bargin when compared to vintage broncos, blazers, etc. Hardest part is just avoiding the weird duck people!
Example: https://www.facebook.com/share/15PuMuwFX6/
I fear the Jaguar XK8 or the XJS will never be valuable. The old XJS never really started ticking up the depreciation curve after they got cheap. Probably because they’re almost ugly
The pre-facelift XK8 is one of the most beautiful cars of all time. And the early ones often grenade themselves if the timing chain tensioners aren’t upgraded, so they’ll even become rare. But after nearly 30 years on the market, you’d think they would have started to appreciate by now. But at the end of the day, I think buyers are just too afraid of an old Jag, and I don’t blame them. It’s super expensive to keep running
XJS is made of rust problems, thus most are priced as needing a repaint and thousands as bad repairs are common. Buy a db7 if a better xjs is desired.
I had an XJS for a while, and I just wasn’t willing or able to work on it myself. It’s getting harder and harder to find a mechanic that knows how to work on them. The knowledge isn’t going to be passed on, which makes sense as fewer of these cars survive and their popularity isn’t increasing. My mechanic was in very poor health and I doubt he’s still able to work and was the only trusted mechanic in a major metropolitan area that focused on 15-40 year old Jaguars. The rest of them only wanted to work on E Types or 21st century models. There’s a guy in Europe with a FaceBook page that’s doing amazing stuff, but I didn’t have mine long enough to start upgrading. I hope he’ll be around for a while.
Got one of these (the XK8), I love it. Been bulletproof reliable until I decided to fuck with it, now the top isn’t lowering properly. Thankfully I have a great Euro shop who’s done work for me in the past and who I trust to get things back in order.
As far as the “super expensive to keep running” – hard disagree – the only exception is the coolant bottle, which runs $75. Why is that expensive? Because the motherfucker LOVES TO CHEW THEM UP AND SLOWLY LEAK COOLANT. A $75 coolant reservoir isn’t expensive. A $75 coolant reservoir that lasts 14 months? I’d argue that’s expensive.
I also have the XK8 and have had terrible luck. I think it’s mostly deferred maintenance causing issues in my case. I had to upgrade the timing chain tensioners, the hydraulics for the top puked out on me (common problem, if yours isn’t going up you may have a $1,200 repair bill in your near future), the car went into limp home mode because the TPS crapped out, then did it AGAIN because the new one had a wire clip that broke off so the wire had a loose connection, and the AC wouldn’t stay charged because the heat shield came off one of the lines and it developed a pin-hole leak, plus the Schrader valve was leaking. And the thermostat was leaking onto the top of the engine so I had coolant end up destroying one of the spark plugs and a coil. $600 for new coils and another couple hundred for plugs.
It was a rough year for the old bird. It spent months in the shop.
I *think* I have it in good shape now that I’m so sick of fixing it I want to sell it. I’m now hearing a whine out of the rear when I turn left, I have a feeling I’m about to shell out for a differential
’66 through ’72 MGB-GT. Stylish design, super entertaining to drive with quick handling and super satisfying gear shift. They are a useable, driveaable classic. Simple and fun for home mechanical upkeep and improvement. But it will forever languish in the basement of collector values.
I’ve been wanting a saab sonett since I drove two different versions of model years back in the 90s.
C4 Corvette ZR-1
Yugo GVX, with the rear window defroster option. Seriously, these cars were priced to be throwaway toys and not alot of good examples remain. But for many in the 80s, it was a NEW car that anyone could afford. There’s really nothing quite like it these days. Even an el-cheapo (to use a Barker euphemism) Nissan Versa or Mitsu Mirage just doesn’t give off the same vibe.
I think another will be the Geo Metro convertible. Again, you have an economy car, but with a drop top – that’s a formula that almost no longer exists – the closest car to that today is a Miata… but the Miata is well-balanced, sporty and had decent engines. The Metro was none of these, but could be had with that coveted soft-top. There’s really not many of those left, and of the few that remain road-worthy, many have had their tops age poorly and need alot of work.
Will you ever see any of these pull six figs at Mecum? Nope. But for some, these cars gave people great times and great memories, and that, my friends, is priceless.
as I have often said, only new car I would spend real money on
I don’t know if it’s old enough yet to be a classic, but you can find 2013 Scion FR-S/BRZ/86 for as low as $5-10k, looking online I don’t think I’ve ever seen one go for over $30k since they were new, even the special editions. It’s a sports car bargain at those prices, it feels like a car that will go up in value one day but so far they seem to keep getting cheaper.
At some point I’ll start keeping an eye on used 2nd gens. I think it’ll take a while for them to gain value (20 years?) but can see that happening at some point.
That’s because I own one. I’ve had it six years, and nothing newer is as much fun, so I’m keeping it at least another six years.
So expect them to go up in price around 2031/32.
I own a 2013 Scion FRS, I absolutely love that car and I do hope values go up one day but currently it’s a great sports car bargain!
The Polish FSO Syrena!
DKW-style 2-stroke FWD, neat curvy styling, but very rare outside of Poland and they were seen (Trabant-style) as being very dated and the cheapest option for the time, so not many have survived and parts are relatively hard to find…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FSO_Syrena
Any cool classic I actually own will be worth nothing.
I’ve had Silvias, RX7s, Lotuseseses, MR2s, loads of cool old cars. The only one that ever went up in price was the S1 Elise (her real name), and even that doubled in value in the two years after I sold it.
Same thing with bikes. You know the only 90’s 750 race rep that’s still worth nothing? It’s the ZX7R. I’ve had mine for 21 years now. I’m selling it later this year, so expect values to rocket after that.
Even when I buy something that’s a dead cert appreciating classic, like my RVF400, the values immediately stagnate, then the OEMs decide to start building sporty 400s again after a 20 year break.
I swear you could plot out my car history just based on which cars seem weirdly cheap, then suddenly expensive.
BMW e38 7 series, e39 5 series and e46 3 series
They won’t ever be valuable aside from rare optioned pristine garage queens never driven, maybe in 40 more years after all the M variants are priced out of reach.
But there’s so many out there, you can buy a fixer for chump change or hunt down a well maintained car/lower mileage for a bargain.
And the upside is the cars, when in good running order, are just peak BMW driving and handling. They set the bar for every “this is how far BMW has fallen” criticism.
I think the Chrysler Crossfire is a candidate for a car that is loved by some that will probably never achieve collector status. Although you never know! Let’s ask S.W. Gossin to weigh in on this!
The SRT6’s seem to be slightly more expensive than I expected, but seems to be more convertibles than coupes (at least what I found on Autotrader and eBay real quick).
Opel GTs. actually any opel is cheap. Actually most orphaned brand cars are cheap. Saabs.
I inherited my dad’s 95 Riviera, supercharged… it has 99k on it, been stored inside it’s whole life, annndddddd it’s worth like nothing lol.
I just took it on a road trip and it is a spectacular highway car; 85-90mph is just… pleasant.
i8s are cool still, and I’d like to have a go in one, but they start at A$150K down here.
The first downsized GM full-size broughams. I loved our ’88 Ninety-Eight and ’89 Sedan de Ville. Really sharp designs, and still definitely broughamy. Those were really the last gasps of the brougham era before the more rounded early ’90s cars came in. Underrated as hell.
(Also, that art-deco-ish final Ninety-Eight was pretty cool, too.)
“best enjoyed at about 35 miles per hour.”
You mean 88 mph?
I bet they are ok at 88mph, if you’ve got the time.
All the G-Bodies that aren’t the ’87 Grand National or GNX.
I have two in my garage right now. ‘66 tbird and a ‘75 Spitfire. I don’t expect either will ever be worth much more than they are right now; both can be had for pretty cheap.
1990-1998 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
I always wanted one. They’re worth basically nothing now. Quick little sporty coupe that I always thought looked better than the Eclipse and had a way cooler name.
I’ve always had a thing for the Plymouth Laser of that generation. Loved its clean, non-fussy shape devoid of spoilers, etc. And the dashboard on the first gen of the DSM cars still ranks among my favorites for its industrial-future look.
Bought a ’90 back when they were new. Great fun on wet roads.
These are at the very top of my “attainable childhood dream car” list but as the years go by they’re getting harder and harder to find and they’re starting to vary wildly in price.
I sometimes see non-running / unfinished projects listed for ~$3k, and then occasionally find one that’s been chopped up into 3 or 4 different racecars in its lifetime listed for like $18k.
The more I learn about the reliability/availability of DSM parts (or lack thereof), the more it feels like the Talon of my dreams will always be just a dream
Somebody already said my first choice, the Corvair. 60’s Ford Thunderbirds are super cool, and surprisingly cheap as well.
I’m going to toss out the 94-95 Mustang. All the performance of a fox body Mustang with the looks of a late 90s Pontiac Grand Am.
Mod motor is so much better. If you really need head flow and okish intake manifold, the 4v exists. Nevermind how much it loves a turbo.
Aston lagonda. 76-89 versions. Newer is rare enough to be expensive even if it has minimal buyers
Agreed, which always surprises me – these were special cars. I guess everyone is afraid the digital screens will die.
Semi affordable last I checked, buy price was low but I’d expect it’s not cheap past that. But do you want the same car as a guy who owns a nation?
VW Type IIIs ( and Type 4s as well) of any version except the Type 34s (those are already expensive). Fastbacks, squarebacks, notchbacks, in that order of least likely to rise high in value. Way back when I had to decide which to keep, I knew that VW busses would be worth more in the future, I sold my ’64 Deluxe sunroof bus (which I still miss) but I kept the second car I ever bought, a ’67 squareback. It is due to be stripped down, get bodywork, and painted, and I have all the bits and pieces to put it back together. I know that whatever $ I put into having someone do the bodywork and paint will end up being more than that the entire car will be worth after I get it all back together. Ah well.
True of most cars though. I fixed the air conditioner and put new leather on the seats and door cards of my MR2. And with those two jobs I probably made selling it a break-even proposition.