Should it matter where a car comes from, if it’s something you really want? Say, for example, you find a cool sporty coupe, something you don’t see very often anymore, in seemingly good condition. Do you care that it’s being sold by one of the seedy, sketchy dealerships that invade Craigslist like a plague of locusts? That’s what we’re finding out today.
The vote tally on yesterday’s Japanese sedans surprised me. It was about the same 2:1 difference in votes as the difference in horsepower between the two cars, but in the opposite direction. The slowpoke Mazda 626’s clean-as-a-whistle presentation and low mileage were enough to overcome the Nissan Maxima’s horsepower advantage. I honestly didn’t think the Mazda stood a chance.
I know I’d take the Mazda, because there is no way I’m going to voluntarily subject myself to a transversely-mounted VG30E. The one in our old Pathfinder was hard enough to work on. Besides, as I’ve gotten older, I’ve developed an appreciation for comfy, slow cars like that 626. And hey, it’s faster than a 240D; what more do you want?
I hate buying cars from dealerships. It’s not necessarily their fault; we’re just speaking two different languages, and it’s often hard to get them to shut up enough about their end to get a word in edgewise. They’re concerned about the sale, and I’m concerned about the car. I don’t want to hear them blather about its features, or its book value; I’m trying to listen to that funny growl and figure out where it’s coming from, and how much it’s going to cost to fix. I’ve gotten some good deals from dealerships before, even some really seedy-looking ones, but I’ve gotten burned plenty of times too, so I tend to favor private sellers. Sure, they’re still trying to make a sale, but at least they have a vested interest in that particular car. To a dealer, it’s just an inventory item.
That’s what makes it so frustrating when I find cars like the two I’m about to show you, that look cool and fun, but have the kind of ads that just make me recoil in horror. It could be worth an hour or so of frustration dealing with some jackass with an office in a trailer to drive off in one of these, or it could be a costly mistake. Let’s take a close look at them and see which one looks less sketchy.
1995 Eagle Talon TSi AWD – $3,995
Engine/drivetrain: Turbocharged 2.0-liter DOHC inline 4, five-speed manual, AWD
Location: Burlington, NJ
Odometer reading: 180,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and drives well
For a car built in a town called Normal, this car is anything but. Starting in 1990, the Diamond-Star Motors factory in Normal, Illinois, became synonymous with sporty, fun-to-drive cars that almost anyone could afford, available in a wide variety of flavors: Mitsubishi Eclipse, Plymouth Laser, and Eagle Talon. The Laser didn’t stick around for the second generation, when the DSMs (as they came to be commonly known) got sleeker, wilder, and faster. This Talon TSi is the top-of-the-line DSM, a car coveted by enthusiasts, which makes me a little suspicious of its asking price.
For the twelve people out there who don’t know, what makes this car so special is its drivetrain. It’s powered by a Mitsubishi-built 2.0-liter turbo four that makes 210 horsepower stock, and is capable of a whole lot more with some modification. Shifting is done via a five-speed manual, and all four wheels receive power through a really slick AWD system. It’s quick, it handles well, and it’s actually really pleasant to drive, unlike some other fast cars from the era. The seller says this one “runs and drives great,” though of course they don’t elaborate, and if you’re expecting any maintenance records, dream on.
Interior quality was never a DSM strong suit; I remember taking apart the dash and center console of an Eclipse my wife used to own, and finding nearly every clip and fastener holding it together was broken. And I broke one myself, as careful as I was being, so I don’t blame whoever took it apart before. This one looks pretty good, though I can hear the center console rattling through this photo. But it’s got nice leather seats, and you don’t buy this car for interior appointments anyway. You buy it because it’s fun to drive.
Outside, it’s surprisingly stock-looking; a lot of these got modified six ways from Sunday. It isn’t lowered, and it has the stock wheels. It does have that stupid fart-can muffler, but you only have to put up with the noise from that long enough to drive it to a shop and have a real exhaust put back on – which we also had to do to that aforementioned Eclipse. I think this one has the same muffler on it, actually.
2003 Acura RSX – $4,995
Engine/drivetrain: 2.0-liter DOHC inline 4, five-speed manual, FWD
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Odometer reading: 205,000 miles
Operational status: Ad doesn’t say, but we’ll assume it runs fine
This car had some enormous shoes to fill; its predecessor was a legend. Well, actually, it’s predecessor was an Integra, which was more legendary than the Legend. But I digress. The Integra was another darling of the tuner crowd, praised for its good performance and modifiability at a good price. Honda moved upmarket with the Acura RSX (which was still called the Integra in other parts of the world) and it wasn’t nearly as revered. It is, however, a nicer car than the Integra.
The engine in the RSX is well-known to Honda fans: it’s the K-series inline four that everyone swaps into “lesser” Hondas. This is a relatively tame version, producing 160 horsepower, and it’s mated to a five-speed manual, as it should be. The dealership selling it is too busy blathering on about their buy-here-pay-here program to actually say anything about its mechanical condition; they only say “buy with confidence,” which I assume means it runs. Would it kill them to actually include a few words about the thing they’re trying to get money for?
We’ll just have to assess its condition for ourselves, then, based on what we see. It has leather seats, but a seam is split on the driver’s seat, and it has what looks like sweat stains. The steering wheel and shift knob both show heavy wear, which you’d expect at this mileage. It has an aftermarket stereo that looks cheap; I’m guessing it’s a replacement for a better stereo that someone kept when they traded in the car. All in all, it’s not terribly inspiring, but I’ve seen worse.
Outside, it’s losing some clearcoat on the horizontal surfaces, but it looks undamaged. I’m reasonably sure those are not the original wheels, but I’m sure someone who knows Acuras better could say for sure. At least it isn’t lowered.
I really wish we had more information on these two. Both ads have that annoyingly long list of keywords at the end, and say precious little about the cars. To find out what you need to know, you have to go look at them in person, and once you’re on the lot, you’re on their turf. They’ll talk your ear off to distract you from whatever issues the car may have. It’s off-putting, and it’s meant to be, to rush you into a decision you may regret. It’s predatory, and it’s sleazy, and I can’t stand it. But neither of these cars is easy to find, so if you want one, you may have to deal with it. Which one of these would be worth it to you?
The Talon is going to be way more fun and way more tossable than the Acura. Let that Eagle fly baby!
I voted Talon but I have concerns. You mentioned the fartcan exhaust but that hot-air intake ain’t stock either. I suspect more shenanigans along the exhaust too, it was common to replace the cat with a straight piece of pipe, I know I did back in the day. My biggest concern though is all that rust under the hood. Every bracket and bolt and rod that isn’t painted is rusty. I’m sure Tracy would call it mint but down here where it doesn’t snow that’s a shitshow. Still, at $4K I’d hoon it until it fell a part and consider it money well spent.
Talon. Cleaner, fewer miles, cheaper.
Also (IMO), a little more fun. OG Integra si, RSX no. Gotta lose the muffler, for sure, but that’s not gonna run a G to replace.
Seats and interior I can clean or replace. The K engine is pretty stout, and the disgusting interior can be leverage in negotiation.
Rust is miserable and the adage “Pick two: cheap, fast, or reliable” applies to the Talon. It sure is cheap, and very few of these didn’t have the boost cranked up until the headbolts trembled are selling for way more money.
Acura.
Acura for me. I’m not so certain those are stains in the back seat as much as they are sunlight coming in and reflecting. I’d still have the interior steam cleaned and redye the leather to get it more uniform.
Owned 2 of the Talon/Eclipse vehicles. Both were absolute trash. Clutch and rear end blew in first 95 Talon. Turbo fell off, transmission blew up, and engine cracked in half of second 91 Eclipse. I will gladly place my bets and try a third one with even more miles than the previous 2 combined.
Same, I’ve owned 5 mitz sportscars including a ’91 Talon AWD and a ’97 Eclipse GSX. Simply the most fun I’ve ever had on 4 wheels when they’re running but I wouldn’t rely on one to get me to work every day.
I was going to give in to Honda reliability over the heart and the Talon. Then I saw the RSX and….heart wins. I presents nicer, turbo and aw. The Talon also doesn’t look hooned to death and while both won’t exactly cheap to maintain, neither will necessarily break the bank either so it’s a wash there, the Talon needs a lot less from what we see to be a fun car.
I was certain I was going to pick the Honda, but that seat turned my stomach. I’ll take my chances in DSM land. That car appears to have been much better cared for at least.
Fully expected to be voting for the younger Acura, but the sweat stains on the driver seat are a red flag that the previous owner was hitting every track day/street race he could find. That car has been proverbially ridden hard and probably put away wet, and very hot.
The Eclipse looks to be in pretty decent shape and most of right the option boxes were ticked (would it have killed you, Mr. First Owner, to choose a bit of color for the car?!?). Plus, AWD>>FWD.
I do have a soft spot for the RSX in general, but gimme the off brand, diet Evo of the Talon. You just know it is going to be super problematic but once it is sorted mechanically you’ve got a fun good looking car that isn’t too nice to subject to harsh Michigan winters where the awd should make it unstoppable.
Chose Talon because a buddy test drive one in college and blew the clutch doing neutral drops.
Same friend later subsequently died in a scooter accident where he rear ended someone then fell into the oncoming lane and got ran over. Simultaneously the dumbest and most brilliant person I have met in life. Miss you Koss.
Damn.
The Talon. Why the hell not? Both of these cars are sketchy and being sold by even sketchier dealerships, so I’ll spin the roulette wheel for the potentially more entertaining car.
I am old enough to remember those cars new so I am old enough to think $4K for a 30 year old used car seems like a lot. (Older GenX even if that sentence sounded boomer)
You haven’t shopped lately? It isn’t 2008 anymore. (Older GenX here)
I know they are expensive it still does not feel right.
My first manual car was a plain ’93 Eagle Talon ES trim if I remember. Manual everything- windows, door locks, a simple sunroof. I put well over 100k on that thing, a second engine after the original blew up the day after I paid off the loan.
$2k for a new engine vs more for an unknown used car? Except for the engine this thing was flawless. I think I did another 60k on that engine & sold it to a friend that didn’t keep up on checking the oil. He blew it up within a month.
That Talon all day long.
My very first car was a dark green ’93 Talon ES 5-speed. I drove that thing for ten years, and at least 150k – I was working out of the country for a couple of stints in that time, and it sat in a farm shed. That car was great to me. The biggest items I had to replace was the clutch; otherwise, it was thermostats, rad hoses, and plug wires. Interior fasteners were a bit dodgy, and a control module for the power locks went haywire. I decided it was too small a car to need power locks, and just pulled the fuse.
I traded it in on a new Lancer Ralliart in 2005. I miss both of those cars to this day.
KAW! KAW!!
Talon for me.
Also, the stains on the RSX seats give me the squirms.
Especially that back seat!! Did someone take dump back there?
Man, if I wasn’t in the process of buying a house I’d be seriously looking at that Talon. It’s potentially a great starting point for a fun project that runs while you fix the little cosmetic things. Almost too suspicious of a price given the legend and unmolested status of that car though.
I’ll take the Acura, so I can pillage it’s corpse for my Civic of the same vintage. Yeah it’s the wrong K to swap into a Civic, but it’s got EVERYTHING I need and the shell looks clean enough to get decent cash for it when I’m done. It doesn’t NEED 200+ HP to be fun, adding an extra 60 will still be a blast, and I’ll have better suspension and brakes to go with it.
I want to pick the Acura, but something just seems off, especially with whatever biohazard is all over the drivers seat. I’ll go with the Talon, and have the engine thoroughly gone over, including a timing belt replacement.
Man those ads are terrible. Definitely the Talon for me, those have always been a guilty pleasure of mine, even if they are known for timing belts snapping at like 50k.
well warned. Timing belt would be an early preventative maintenance item for sure.
Oh for sure. I automatically do those if I don’t have a documented history on pretty much any car I get. It’s not a cheap thing to do, but it’s 10x more expensive to not do it and it’s just not worth the risk. Two of my last 3 cars I’ve had that done within a month of getting the car. The one in the middle? Blew the engine in 6 weeks. The TB was not the problem though haha
Always like this gen on Talon/Eclipse do I will vote that also seems to be better shape then the Acura and you don’t see many of that gen of Eclipse/Talon (or first gen) in Midwest by me anymore.
I don’t think you could go wrong with either of these.
I votes Talon, but man, it was close. Honestly, in today’s market these are both almost suspiciously good deals, right?
For the price, I think you could definitely go wrong with the Acura. I owned one. Paid less than this one, and it had 100k less miles in much better condition. This one has been thrashed.
I guess since I have to wade into the side of the rode stealership either way here, I would definitely go Talon here. though I would definitely not send this guy any money to “hold” the car and would have to see it.
Still, I had the ESI version of it and always wanted a TSi. it was a pretty awesome setup for the midwest with AWD and enough traction to hold that 210 hp onto the road without torque steer or one wheel peals.
I had a 91 Talon TSi that I got for like $400 when I was in college. Never got it to running condition (blown turbo, head, I shouldn’t have taken on that project). I don’t remember it being terribly rusty for a NE car but my guess is this one is super crusty under there or the person selling it is running some scam.
Either way, I’d take it over the seemingly worse condition Acura.
I too think the Talon is likely a rot box underneath. I still picked it over the biohazard Acura as well.
I would vote “both”
I had a colleague with an RSX that has been his commuter up until he retired a couple years back. He’s just shy of 7-digits on the odometer with nary more than basic maintenance and things that he’s broken (e.g. radiator from a stone).
Having driven an RSX-S back in the day, it’s a great fun car that’s eager to do whatever stupid thing you think your car should do.
Ultimately I voted the
EclipseTalon, though. I’ve always liked the look of them, and I could make it a great winter-carver with some fresh Hakkapalittas.Fewer miles, lower entry cost, more horsepower, I’ll take the dead brand coupe! It’d put a bigger smile on my face to see an Eagle in the driveway vs an Acura.
My only gripe with the Eagle is that I would be sad every time I saw it and remembered it wasn’t an Eclipse. The Mitsu was so much better looking.
That is a an opinion. It is wrong, but still an opinion.
TIL that this opinion is not universal. I present exhibit A: the rear ends.
https://www.driveandreview.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/1996_Talon_3.jpg
https://bringatrailer.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/1998_mitsubishi_eclipse-gsx_5-92784.jpeg?w=620&resize=620%2C413
The Talon is super frumpy. The amber heckblende clashes with basically every fun paint color, the way the plate is actually inside the heckblende is weird, and the dinky rear glass spoiler (and later the bisected wing) are SO inferior to the iconic hoop of the Eclipse.
The Eclipse tails/heckblende shape are a great mirror to the side glass with a flat bottom and pointed ends, as does the Hoop actually in how it connects to the hatch lid. It’s a cohesive design that still stands up 30 years later.
Oh man I don’t think we can be friends with this hot take. I always preferred the Talon, both because it was more unusual, and just because it is better looking.