Home » Here’s The Cheap, Simple Electric Car Everyone Should Be Asking For

Here’s The Cheap, Simple Electric Car Everyone Should Be Asking For

Dacia Hipster Concept Ts
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Automakers hate regulations. Whether it’s safety- or efficiency-related, regulations essentially define all restrictions for designs, equipment, and powertrains. Regulations provide the framework that automakers must follow if they want to make a car they can sell on the road. Most of the time, adhering to those regulations means lots of added costs, whether that’s from extra engineering, differing design, or added equipment. All of that stuff makes cars more complex and usually heavier.

Dacia, the Romanian manufacturer known for building the cheapest car in Europe, has a new concept that subverts those ideas. On first glance, you’d think the Hipster, a blocky, tall hatchback with small wheels, a stubby nose, and near-zero overhangs, was meant for the streets of Japan. It looks like a Kei car lifted straight from 2033. But it’s not—this funky hatch is meant for European roads.

Vidframe Min Top
Vidframe Min Bottom

The Hipster is a proof-of-concept idea to show consumers and lawmakers alike what’s possible for the cheap EV segment when manufacturers are unburdened with certain safety and tech regulations that have made many of today’s modern EVs so heavy and complex. It prioritizes simplicity and lightweight construction to drive costs down and improve efficiency. It’s the type of EV people should be demanding from automakers and regulators alike.

The Hipster is 20 percent lighter than the company’s current production EV (and the cheapest EV in Europe), the Spring. It’s also physically small, being shorter than the current Fiat 500e. Compared to today’s average EV, the tiny hatch costs less to run and delivers a smaller total carbon footprint, because it needs less raw material and less energy to build.

Dacia Hipster Concept Copy
Source: Dacia

Despite that, the Hipster can fit four adults and “meet the real needs” of customers when it comes to range. Dacia doesn’t specify a battery size, but says it can swing “daily journeys” with just two recharges per week. The company then notes that in France, 94% of drivers travel less than 24 miles per day (in America, that number is much higher, at 42 miles, per Axios).

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The Hipster’s interior is similarly bare-bones. The hard plastic-riddled cabin has next to nothing in the way of equipment, aside from a portrait-style screen in front of the driver for essential functions. There’s a mount for your smartphone on the dashboard, which also serves as the car’s audio hub (there’s only one speaker, a removable Bluetooth unit that also mounts to the dash).

Dacia Hipster Concept
Dacia

It’s impossible not to draw a connection between the Hipster and Japan’s class of Kei vehicles. These small, similarly shaped hatchbacks have been in this game for decades, delivering lots of practicality in slim, tall packages in a way that maximizes efficiency and value. Dacia’s goal with the Hipster is to present a vehicle to the wide audience of buyers who can’t afford anything currently on the market. The company notes that “the average price of new vehicles in Europe rose by 77% between 2010 and 2024, far outpacing household purchasing power.”

Whether Dacia can push this ethos onto European roads is a matter of, well, regulations. From Autocar:

The concept is driveable and finished to a level that’s close to what could be expected of a near-production prototype, but Dacia bosses wouldn’t commit to a potential launch date, with the car’s viability ultimately contingent on a hospitable legislative environment.

[Chief designer David Durand] said: “I hope we will find a way through the regulation, through all the aspects. There is also an industrial risk: are we sure that there are enough customers to buy it, and is it still a field that is really our specialty?

“There are questions to solve, but this car is feasible. We are not far [away]: we have some regulation problems to solve and some answers to come from the regulators, but there is no big reason why it shouldn’t be feasible at the right price, the right weight, the right everything.”

Dacia Hipster Concept Copy 2
Dacia

If I had to choose between a car that’s simpler, lighter, and cheaper versus a car that’s more complex, heavier, and more expensive, I’d choose the first option every time. Not only would it save me money, but it’d also be less harsh on the environment and, theoretically, more fun to drive. At a time when people are paying more and more for everyday essentials, cars like this make a ton of sense for shoppers and automakers alike. Whether they can squeeze through regulations is the big question.

For the sake of affordability, I sure hope the Hipster becomes reality. Also, I’d just like to see it on the road because it looks cool. I can have two reasons for wanting something to exist.

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Top graphic image: Dacia

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Jesse Lee
Jesse Lee
3 months ago

The idea is lovely. But I just don’t see why a minimalist car cannot be made to be aero. As important as aerodynamics is to EV range, it makes zero sense to have an EV with worse aerodynamics that a garbage truck.

Axiomatik
Member
Axiomatik
2 months ago
Reply to  Jesse Lee

At typical European road speeds, aero plays a much smaller role in range than in America.

Xx Yy Zz
Xx Yy Zz
3 months ago

I guess the safety regulation they talk about would be GSR2:
“Overall, GSR II sets out requirements to advanced vehicle systems applicable for all motor vehicle categories to be equipped with a number of safety features:• Advanced driver distraction warning
• Alcohol interlock installation facilitation
• Driver drowsiness and attention warning
• Emergency stop signal
• Event data recorder
• Intelligent speed assistance (ISA)
• Reversing detection
• Advanced emergency braking systems (AEBS) for M1 and N1 category vehicles
• Blind spot information systems and pedestrian / cyclist collision warning systems for M2, M3, N2 and N3 category vehicles
• Emergency lane keeping systems for M1 and N1 category vehicles
• Tyre pressure monitoring systems (TPMS) for all vehicle categories
• Enlarged pedestrian protection head impact protection zone for M1 and N1 category vehicles”
https://www.tuvsud.com/en/knowledge-hub/articles/revision-of-the-eu-general-safety-regulation

Edit: GSR2 made the Sandero cost about USD 1000-1500 more.

Last edited 3 months ago by Xx Yy Zz
Xx Yy Zz
Xx Yy Zz
3 months ago

I’d rather have what Daihatsu and Suzuki used to sell in Europe not that long ago: kei cars with a larger, 0.8-1 liter engine (or something like the last Indian market Alto that could be bought in Europe would be also better).

Last edited 3 months ago by Xx Yy Zz
Adrian Clarke
Editor
Adrian Clarke
3 months ago

“Here’s a million dollar concept to illustrate the idea of a £10k car”

Forrest
Member
Forrest
3 months ago

I like it! It would fit really well in the Slate lineup. Call it the “Slate Micro” and make your money on accessory sales.

Scott
Member
Scott
3 months ago

I guess some embargo was lifted, because I just happened to watch a video about this concept car this morning on Youtube.

I’m of the ‘less-is-more’ persuasion, so of course I like this. Or maybe it’s all the purple affecting my judgement? 😉 I don’t know how potentially unsafe it might be what with the talk of not being constrained by regulations, but this isn’t a car for highway road trips or long distances of course, it’s an around-town runabout. And I think it’s kind of great, but will withhold final judgement until if/when it becomes a production reality and I’ve read some reviews.

It’s unclear to me whether this car has/can be had with air conditioning. Without it, they’ll only sell six in America, given consumer preferences here.

I think it’s cute, and appreciate the fact that it doesn’t look like everything else on the road. Frankly, I’m sick of crossover coupes, and angry-eyed brodozer wanabees, and anime-insect faces on everything down to econoboxes. Why not have some fun for a change? Plus: purple! 😀

Without any hard specs or prices to go on, if this thing got a real-world 130-180 miles on a charge, and included the bare minimum of convenience features (sliding windows and interesting-looking steelies are OK, no A/C is not), and managed to sell (in base form MSRP) in the lower $20K range, I could see it appealing to urban/single/small family/light tradespeople customers. If they somehow managed to MSRP it for an actual $19,999. or maybe even less (and make more profit on accessories/upgrades) I think they’d steal all of Slate’s hype and then some.

At that price, I’d definitely consider one… in fact, I’d go test drive it today, and probably bring my checkbook with me.

I’ll take mine with those purple trim bits of course. 🙂

Last edited 3 months ago by Scott
Urban Runabout
Member
Urban Runabout
3 months ago

That’s hideous.
Jeep should/should have built that.

Fahfoofnik
Fahfoofnik
3 months ago

Saddens me to see such enthusiasm for vehicles like this. At this point, why not bring it to America? It’ll blend in PERFECTLY with the rest of the black, white, and shades of grey Needlessly Gigantic And Ridiculously Oversized bro dozers, SUVs and pickups barely anyone needs but are continually gaslight into believing they want these — let’s face it — boxes on wheels (or slightly rounded boxes on wheels).

Totally fine if folks really truly need or just like these ugly boxes on wheels — ICE or electric. I’m having a hard time understanding why this country continues to want to line the pockets of carmakers who continue to overcharge for these vehicles no one needs. Same as @CheapBastard points out. Definitely a need for gigantic vehicles. People have been fooled into thinking they, too, need a huge box on wheels that they can’t drive properly nor really need. “I like to ride high!” “I need space for my 1 child!” “I need to haul stuff!” Right. All can be done with a regular car. It was the standard for decades.

So, yeah. Like what you like. Love these things just ‘cuz you do? Great. Spend your money, doesn’t matter to me. I’m just extremely bored with being surrounded by huge boring vehicles that tend to be driven by incompetent people that don’t truly need them & continue to be bamboozled into thinking that’s what they’re owed as ‘Muricans.

Fjord
Fjord
3 months ago
Reply to  Fahfoofnik

Did you miss the part where this is very small, cheap, and purple? It’s blocky because that’s the most efficient way of fitting four passengers, which is why all those Kei vans have this form-factor.

Scott
Member
Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  Fjord

“Weird” and “purple” are two of my fave adjectives when it comes to cars. 🙂

Johnologue
Member
Johnologue
2 months ago
Reply to  Fahfoofnik

It’s a small, simple, affordable EV. It has a phone mount instead of infotainment, as other Dacia models had before. I think that, aside from being proportionally tall, it’s contrary to the ideas you’re complaining about.

Manwich Sandwich
Member
Manwich Sandwich
3 months ago

This will never make it to North America… even if Nissan makes a version of it.

And even if it somehow does make it, I don’t see it selling. 2 door vehicles don’t sell well. And cheap 2 door cars sell even worse

Most new car buyers are too preoccupied with paying for overpriced vehicles with way more options than needed and a ‘luxury’ features. And in the USA and to a lesser degree in Canada, people use their vehicles as a (bogus) statement of ‘status’.

And a thing like this won’t have any ‘status’ or faux-prestige.

And I say faux-prestige because that’s how I see all these entry-level BMWs and Mercedes vehicles. They’re objectively not that great… but people lap the shit up for the ‘status’ of the brand name.

For the same or less money, a Prius would arguably be a better, higher-quality vehicle.

Scott
Member
Scott
2 months ago

Nissan’s new Micra is actually a Renault 5, which is an awesome small EV. We’re unlikely to ever see it here, even though I’m pretty sure Nissan would sell a LOT of them if it they managed to price it right. But as you said, it’s super unlikely to ever happen, let alone us get this.

Which is sad. 🙁 I really like these weirdish small cars and they’d be perfect for my 99% of the time. As long as they were priced to reflect the difference between them and bigger/faster/more complex cars, I think they’d sell in the U.S., albeit mostly around big cities.

Scott
Member
Scott
2 months ago

Well, a Prius is just a bit under $30K and I admit that’s a decent price for what it is in this day and age (our current dystopia where everything is so friggin’ expensive… I’m pretty sure base Priuses were about $23K just before the pandemic). And it’s easy on the eyes too, which is a plus, along with that mustard color (Kirashi) it finally comes in here (at least theretically): https://www.theautopian.com/the-2025-toyota-prius-gets-something-canadas-enjoyed-for-years-embargo-700-am-et

But I’m thinking it’s not really comparable to what Dacia’s Hipster concept is supposed to be… it’s a small city EV w/modest range and specs, and ideally, it’d cost perhaps half the price of a Prius.

We’re not going to get it here, even if it does go into production for Europe, so it’s moot of course. Just a shame that’s all (to me) since something like that is really enough car for me most of the time, and would be a cheap way to dip my toe into EV ownership with fresh batteries and a bit of visual charm.

SCW
SCW
3 months ago

Pretty swank, I’ll take mine with two doors and a 6 foot or better yet 7 foot bed though.

Vanagan
Member
Vanagan
3 months ago
Reply to  SCW

They already have that..it’s called the TELO, and its from some guys in San Fran….but it is pre-order only.

Canopysaurus
Canopysaurus
3 months ago
Reply to  Vanagan

Go Telo on the mountain,
Over the hills and everywhere,
Go Telo on the mountain,
Egregious ICE should fear.

Zeppelopod
Zeppelopod
2 months ago
Reply to  Canopysaurus

It’s criminal this doesn’t have more likes.

Johnologue
Member
Johnologue
2 months ago
Reply to  SCW

I’d offer the Slate Truck, but it’s only got 5 feet like the TELO already mentioned. But, unlike the TELO, it’s only got two doors! Less swank, but customizable; etc.

Michael Beranek
Member
Michael Beranek
3 months ago

Did they crib that grille logo from John DeLorean?
Or did he crib it from them?

The Stig's Misanthropic Cousin
Member
The Stig's Misanthropic Cousin
3 months ago

I hate this thing, but I acknowledge it might work for markets other than the US. If people are only driving short distances at low speeds, that might make sense. An e-bike, public transportation, or an Uber might make even more sense, though.

As an American, I have less than zero interest in a vehicle like this. Its range will make it useless for out of town trips. I also presume it sucks to drive at 70 mph, if it reaches highway speeds at all. I am also skeptical of saving costs at the expense of safety – I’m not sure that is a great trade off. Again, if you need a glorified golf cart for your twice weekly trip to the grocery store, this might make sense. That describes very few people in the US.

Let’s not pretend there would be any demand for something like this in the US. If you are an American that wants a cheap EV, look for a used Bolt, Tesla, or almost any EV that is 3-5 years old. They will be priced similarly to this Dacia golf cart, but they will drive like a real car and still have a battery warranty.

Also, this is one of the ugliest vehicles I have ever seen. This is uglier than the Cybertruck.

And its called a damn Hipster? As if I didn’t already have enough reasons to hate it.

Jack Beckman
Member
Jack Beckman
3 months ago

And they’ll meet safety regulations.

VanGuy
Member
VanGuy
3 months ago

With the most emphasis I can add without profanity, what safety regulations is this disregarding? Pretty important detail. And I want every standard airbag other newer cars have (knees, sides, etc.).

Regulations aren’t red tape. They’re white tape that’s been stained with the blood of people who died before they were in place.

Not to say that’s applicable to all regulations, but it’s certainly the vast majority of them.

Side note, that one photo has an image of simultaneous taillights and one turn signal, and the turn signal replaces one of the taillights while in operation?
Why do automakers keep inventing new ways for taillights to be wrong??

Jeremy Aber
Member
Jeremy Aber
3 months ago
Reply to  VanGuy

Some of the regulations they’re referring to probably have little or nothing to do with safety, at least not directly. But yeah, what exactly is being cut in this experiment? What happens when this thing gets hit by a semi? What happens when it hits a pedestrian? Can it be repaired easily?

Last edited 3 months ago by Jeremy Aber
VanGuy
Member
VanGuy
3 months ago
Reply to  Jeremy Aber

Not to mention, I assume, being an EV, that it already meets the vast majority of applicable efficiency requirements/regulations?

Gubbin
Member
Gubbin
3 months ago
Reply to  VanGuy

Yeah, without those details, this article is clickbait Lorem ipsum.

Jack Beckman
Member
Jack Beckman
3 months ago
Reply to  VanGuy

I can’t like this comment enough. ANY automaker can make a cheap, small car if “unburdened” by safety regulations. And I bet none of them would be this ugly.

Elanosaurous
Member
Elanosaurous
3 months ago
Reply to  VanGuy

In recent years, Dacia has kept costs low by leaving out things like lane detection/lane keep assist, driver alertness warnings, traffic sign recognition, pedestrian recognition, collision avoidance (automatic braking). In other words, a lot of the ADAS stuff that many people complain about and turn off anyway… Also things like rear seat occupant alert and adaptive headlights (I’m assuming the matrix kind which are super expensive). In terms of airbags and how they hold up in a crash, they’re just fine, from what I’ve read. It’s the “extra” tech that’s been added by regulations in recent years that they’ve largely avoided at least on base models.

VanGuy
Member
VanGuy
3 months ago
Reply to  Elanosaurous

Given how much disdain many people show for LEDs being too bright, opting out of matrix headlights seems dumb since that’s literally the ideal solution.

As for the rest, I’ll shrug my shoulders for now. I don’t know how much they actually reduce accidents and/or lead to better outcomes, although I assume they’re still net positives.

Alex Estill
Member
Alex Estill
3 months ago

So… which regulations is this vehicle not complying with? That seems like essential information.

SAABstory
Member
SAABstory
3 months ago
Reply to  Alex Estill

Is it going to be like those cheapo airlines?

VanGuy
Member
VanGuy
3 months ago
Reply to  SAABstory
Last edited 3 months ago by VanGuy
Canopysaurus
Canopysaurus
3 months ago
Reply to  Alex Estill

Don’t know, but I’d assume it might need a voltage regulator.

Spopepro
Member
Spopepro
3 months ago

I like the car, although I see more Slate than Kei in it.

But I think the article premise needed more time in the oven. So say “this is what regulations are taking from you” and then compare it multiple times to a class of cars that only exist because of some of the most substantial and long term regulations in the world (Kei class rules) is not awesome logic.

Cloud Shouter
Cloud Shouter
3 months ago

Could they make it better looking? That thing is so ugly that it makes a PT Cruiser look good.

Yuck!

Eggsalad
Eggsalad
3 months ago

America will be great again when the rest of the world is building and driving sensible cars like this that can’t be sold in the US. Then if you want a reasonably-sized vehicle you will be forced to drive a GM or Ford, built in America for and by Americans.

[This is sarcasm. I think]

Maymar
Maymar
3 months ago

If I had to choose between a car that’s simpler, lighter, and cheaper versus a car that’s more complex, heavier, and more expensive, I’d choose the first option every time.”

Brian Silvestro is The Autopian’s news editor. Best known for buying cheap, rusty project cars, he currently drives a 2003 Mazda MX-5 Miata, and, when it works, a 2008 Range Rover.”

Well, I don’t know about *every time*.

Clark B
Member
Clark B
3 months ago

Cars like this are cool, but I see why they will never make it to the States. They’re great for navigating large European cities with their narrow roads and tight parking spaces. They don’t need as much range because people don’t drive as much there, on average. Safety is another big point, while every country has large heavy commercial trucks, Americans also have very large, heavy personal vehicles. From what I understand a lot of vehicles in cities such as Paris also see quite a lot of abuse. I can see why people would be happy to buy something cheap and spartan, because it’s just going to get beat up anyway.

Also, is this particular EV one designed to travel at highway speeds, or is it a lower speed vehicle intended primarily for cities? Low speed EVs are basically useless here, outside specific use cases such as college campuses and retirement communities.

Don’t get me wrong, I like this vehicle a lot! But it’s just not meant for the US.

NephewOfBaconator
NephewOfBaconator
3 months ago
Reply to  Clark B

>Also, is this particular EV one designed to travel at highway speeds, or is it a lower speed vehicle intended primarily for cities?

According to Reuters the top speed is around 90kph/56mph.

Pilotgrrl
Member
Pilotgrrl
3 months ago

Non paywall link

http://archive.today/8jGnA

That Belgian Guy
That Belgian Guy
3 months ago

Quoting 24 miles a day and two recharges per week calculates to a range of about 100 miles.
This is unacceptable!!! My daily commute is 200 miles. Uphill in both ways. Towing a speedboat. In freezing temperatures. And I have nowhere to charge anyway.
This proves once and for all that EVs are useless for everyone.

Minivanlife
Member
Minivanlife
3 months ago

You speak the truth!

Last edited 3 months ago by Minivanlife
V10omous
Member
V10omous
3 months ago

If I had to choose between a car that’s simpler, lighter, and cheaper versus a car that’s more complex, heavier, and more expensive, I’d choose the first option every time. 

Yes, you and the other 0.1% of the actual new car buying market that obsessively comments on the internet on this topic.

The Slate is coming, there’s the one and only chance for “durrr no screens in my car” folks to put up or shut up.

I don’t mean to be rude about this, but the constant whining for smaller, cheaper, less equipped, shitbox-style cars is just so far from what people actually vote with their dollars to buy that’s it’s frustrating to read it over and over.

V10omous
Member
V10omous
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

I wish the market provided more V10 powered sport coupes that I could purchase. While I’m heartbroken that they don’t, I also don’t think it would be a productive use of a website’s editorial voice to write at least one article a week advocating for more of them to be sold.

TheDrunkenWrench
Member
TheDrunkenWrench
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

Counterpoint: If sufficiently cheap enough with the basic essentials, people will buy it.

There’s a reason the Grand Caravan was a juggernaut and the Pacifica sells significantly less. It was cheap, seated 8, and had A/C.

The problem is when they claim “cheap” and it’s 30k. That’s not a cheap car. It doesn’t fit the brief.

I’ll buy a commuter EV when I can buy or lease one for less than I spend on fuel in my daily. Nothing has gotten there yet in my market (I’m in Canada).

V10omous
Member
V10omous
3 months ago

I guess we’ll test the limits of this to an extent with the Slate.

I will say that there is an exception for large size plus small price, because families are often on a budget.

That’s not usually what’s being discussed here, where small, cheap and basic is the ask.

Max Headbolts
Member
Max Headbolts
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

I mean this is pretty close to almost exactly what I want for my typical use cases. I Could sell my old 03 LX Civic, and store my 13 Si away for fun drives. I bought a 12 year old “economy” sedan because there are no current offerings that meet that need at a price point I’m comfortable paying.

My actual requirements for a new car:

4 doors.Cheap to drive and maintain (good or no gas mileage)Cheap to insureUnder $20,000I know this is a pipe dream, but that’s what I specifically want. I had to compromise on #2 by running premium in my Si, but at least it gets over 30 MPG. The Lx gets choked on the cheapest swill I can pump into it.

Last edited 3 months ago by Max Headbolts
Max Headbolts
Member
Max Headbolts
3 months ago
Reply to  Max Headbolts

Well the comment system ate my formatting. :
1 4 doors

2 Cheap to drive and maintain (good or no gas mileage)

3 Cheap to insure

4 Under $20,000

VanGuy
Member
VanGuy
3 months ago
Reply to  Max Headbolts

And yet, this already doesn’t meet that since it’s a 2-door.

Max Headbolts
Member
Max Headbolts
3 months ago
Reply to  VanGuy

I know, I’m not crying, you’re crying!

The Stig's Misanthropic Cousin
Member
The Stig's Misanthropic Cousin
3 months ago
Reply to  Max Headbolts

You seem like a perfect candidate for a used EV. Used EVs are great second cars. You can always use the ICE vehicle if you need to go on a road trip (although, I recently did an 800-mile road trip in my janky ex-rental twice-wrecked Model 3 that is worth maybe 12k).

If you look around, it is easy to find a 2- to 4-year-old Bolt, Leaf, or Model 3 for $20k or less. These cars will have low to moderate miles, several years left on the battery warranty, and 150+ miles of real-world range.

If you want something cheaper, it isn’t hard to get a Bolt or second-generation Leaf without a battery warranty (but with a good battery that should last years) for $12k or less – these are great commuting vehicles with 100+ miles of range.

If you really want to plumb the depths of the used EV market, you could always look for a 1G Leaf. While these can be hard to find with good batteries, I occasionally come across these with 50+ miles of real-world range for under $5k.

Used EVs require minimal maintenance. From my experience, insurance is slightly more expensive than comparable ICE vehicles, but the fuel savings more than offsets that (assuming you charge at home and don’t live in an area with exceptionally high electricity costs).

Honestly, would you really prefer a Dacia Hipster over a 2022 Bolt?

Last edited 3 months ago by The Stig's Misanthropic Cousin
Max Headbolts
Member
Max Headbolts
3 months ago

Honestly, would you really prefer a Dacia Hipster over a 2022 Bolt?

I used to own a Scion.

I do appreciate the insight, and given how little I really need long range driving, there might be a use case for me to sell both Civics, buy a used EV and bank some savings for potential rental use if needed.

Racer Esq.
Racer Esq.
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

Counterpoint: https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/golf-carts-have-taken-over-suburbia-cue-the-resistance-abaef307

People want “smaller, cheaper, less equipped, shitbox-style cars” so bad they are settling for golf carts.

V10omous
Member
V10omous
3 months ago
Reply to  Racer Esq.

Can’t read past the paywall but I’d strongly suspect these are in addition to “normal” cars, not replacing them.

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

Tomato, tomato. “Normal” cars have their uses, even gas guzzling pedestrian crushers. These cars won’t serve those uses. An F350 will still be needed by some for pulling stumps once a decade or whatever.

What they WILL replace is driving the F350 a mile to the hardware store for a single box of screws, to the store for a quart of milk, taking the dog to the vet, going to the office and 99.9% of the other things people do that don’t require a “normal” car.

V10omous
Member
V10omous
3 months ago
Reply to  Cheap Bastard

Why would I want to pay an extra $20 something thousand dollars for something I can already handle in my F350 though?

That’s always what’s lost in these articles. The amount of people who could get by with one of these for some errands might be high, but they won’t be able to do everything. And if you own a bigger/more useful vehicle anyways, who wants to take up the time/space/expense of having another small vehicle around?

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

“Why would I want to pay an extra $20 something thousand dollars for something I can already handle in my F350 though?”

Because you’re not an asshole who drives a climate wrecking, pedestrian crushing F350 a mile to pick up a single box of screws.

Last edited 3 months ago by Cheap Bastard
V10omous
Member
V10omous
3 months ago
Reply to  Cheap Bastard

#1, I don’t grant your premise that doing errands in a truck makes one an asshole, but even if I did:

#2, I certainly wouldn’t buy a whole separate vehicle just for the purposes of not appearing to be an asshole to internet strangers.

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

Someone who owns a F350 does so presumably to do “truck” things, right? Like towing? Or hauling kids around? And an F350 does not fit in most garages or even on many driveways. So parking a runabout shouldn’t be a problem.

Someone who has room and money for boats, campers, racecars, whatever has room and money for a cheap runabout.

And what about winter beaters? Lots of people own those. That “beater” can be a cheap, fuel efficient year round run about instead.

“I certainly wouldn’t buy a whole separate vehicle just for the purposes of not appearing to be an asshole to internet strangers”

There are plenty of better reasons to buy a small, fuel efficient runabout: Energy costs, flexibility, parking, not wanting to appear as an asshole to people whose opinions you DO care about, actually giving a shit about the environment, not putting miles on the truck are just a few that come to mind.

And what happens when the kids want to drive themselves around? Are you going to toss over the keys to the F350?

Last edited 3 months ago by Cheap Bastard
V10omous
Member
V10omous
3 months ago
Reply to  Cheap Bastard

I do own an F350 and the idea of buying a car just to do errands in has never crossed my mind.

I owned a small efficient car when I had a 100 mile commute, but now that I’m mostly WFH, the idea of paying many thousands of dollars for any of the reasons you laid out strikes me as foolish in the extreme.

I would think a “cheap bastard” of all people would grasp the idea that owning one vehicle that can do many things is cheaper and simpler in the long run than trying to buy several separate vehicles to do different things.

WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
Member
WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

I own a 3500 as my only 4-wheeled vehicle and also WFH. I use it for all my needs… family hauler, grocery store, camper puller, dump runs, etc. The idea of buying a shitbox to run around in while my fancy truck sits in the garage is ludicrous to me.

If people think that makes me an asshole, so be it (whether I care about their opinion or not)

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

What’s foolish is driving around in a F350 when a Changli will do.

You WFH and only use your F350 to pick up mulch by the tons? Great, that’s what F350s are for.

But you would be the edge case. I am speaking to those people “who could get by with one of these for some errands might be high, but they won’t be able to do everything.”

A F350 can’t do everything either. It can’t fit in a garage, it’s a huge PITA to park in urban areas, it can’t fit in many parking spaces, it can’t get great MPG or plug into a wall, it can’t virtue signal, it (I imagine) drives like crap compared to a smaller car and it certainly can’t be in two places at once.

“And if you own a bigger/more useful vehicle anyways, who wants to take up the time/space/expense of having another small vehicle around?”

You’ve got an F350 AND a Viper right? You tell me.

V10omous
Member
V10omous
3 months ago
Reply to  Cheap Bastard

You’ve got an F350 AND a Viper right? You tell me.

You’re right, but I didn’t buy the Viper for errands, or to save money.

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

So it makes even less sense.

WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
Member
WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
3 months ago
Reply to  Cheap Bastard

I wonder how many mile trips to pickup a box of screws in an F350 it would take to equal the environmental cost of producing a WHOLE other vehicle.

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
3 months ago

Considering most of the wear and nasty emissions are produced on cold starts?

Probably not as many as you’d think.

Last edited 3 months ago by Cheap Bastard
WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
Member
WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
3 months ago
Reply to  Cheap Bastard

Probably more than you’d think

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
3 months ago

Google claims 260 gallons of gas worth of energy are needed to build a 3000 lb car and 325 gallons to build a similar hybrid. This is an EV that weighs 1764 lbs so in the absence of better numbers let’s guess it takes 200 gallons of gasoline energy to build.

An F350 gets 12-14 mpg but that’s average with a warm engine. So lets be generous and put it at 10 mpg for that two mile, stop and go drive back and forth on a mostly cold engine. That’s works out to 5 trips/gallon.

So 5 trips/gallon * 200 gallons energy needed or 1000 trips. Sounds like a lot till it’s pointed out car factories don’t build cars using energy exclusively from gasoline. They can use nuclear, wind, solar, geothermal, hydro, etc so the emissions penalty are potentially a lot less than the equivalent of 1000 trips. Even if they use natural gas its going to be a lot less, especially when looking at the cost as at most 2000 miles of travel.

WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
Member
WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
3 months ago
Reply to  Cheap Bastard

Wooeee I guess. I’ll take the 350 to the store

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
3 months ago

It didn’t matter what I said your answer was always going to be this. Oh well, now we know who to blame.

Last edited 3 months ago by Cheap Bastard
WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
Member
WK2JeepHdStreetGlide
2 months ago
Reply to  Cheap Bastard

For what?

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
2 months ago

Hogging up all the parking space and gas while pumping out emissions.

The Stig's Misanthropic Cousin
Member
The Stig's Misanthropic Cousin
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

I couldn’t get past the paywall either but I am skeptical that golf carts have “taken over suburbia.” That claim doesn’t pass the smell test.

I live in a suburban area where golf carts can be driven on streets and it is safe and reasonably practical to do so. They aren’t common, though. I see them on a daily basis, but they represent a very small fraction of vehicles on the road. Their popularity does not appear to be increasing.

I am aware of a few communities where golf carts are somewhat popular (Peachtree City, GA and a few retirement communities here in Florida), but that hardly indicates a broad societal interest in cheap, minimalist transportation appliances.

Last edited 3 months ago by The Stig's Misanthropic Cousin
Pilotgrrl
Member
Pilotgrrl
3 months ago
Reply to  Racer Esq.

Non paywall link

http://archive.today/rBpX3

Minivanlife
Member
Minivanlife
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

Really curious to see what Ford’s new Universal EV platform will be like and if can really hit that sweet spot of affordability and features people actually use like infotainment. It’s mainly marketing hype now, but fingers crossed.

PresterJohn
Member
PresterJohn
3 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

This is why I hope so desperately that Slate manages to get to market.

Part of me thinks that people will finally let this go when it flops, but the other, more rational part of me knows it will just morph into a variant of the “but real communism stripper EV has never been tried!”

Johnologue
Member
Johnologue
2 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

I’d never shut up about the Slate if it didn’t feel rude to mention!

I can’t afford a car of any sort and have no new income in my immediate future, so I’m still in the “hypothetical comment-section buyer who isn’t a real customer” category; but if I could, I’d buy nothing else.

Zeppelopod
Zeppelopod
3 months ago

So it’s a post-Soviet bloc(k)?

Arch Duke Maxyenko
Member
Arch Duke Maxyenko
3 months ago

Back in my day, the Dacia Hipster would have been a Penny Farthing that was only ironically ridden to the local coffee shop where they would have ordered a water just to use the free wifi

Hazdazos
Hazdazos
3 months ago

I could see this being where Scion evolved to if the division wasn’t killed off.

Buzz
Buzz
3 months ago
Reply to  Hazdazos
Hazdazos
Hazdazos
3 months ago
Reply to  Buzz

That’s pretty awesome.

4jim
4jim
3 months ago

I love the idea of having a small cheap EV. I also think that “we skimped on safety to make it cheaper” is not a sales pitch that would work with the Americans buying 1 ton trucks for their 16 year old angels to be “safe” in. This also reminds me of a golf cart used in some well off retired people or beach peoples communities or the SXSs that rural people run errands with. I also do not want a cell phone as my gage cluster.

Last edited 3 months ago by 4jim
That Belgian Guy
That Belgian Guy
3 months ago
Reply to  4jim

Americans drive trucks that weigh 1 ton? Interesting. What are they made of? Beryllium? Some kind of lithium alloy?

Max Headbolts
Member
Max Headbolts
3 months ago

1 ton refers to the payload capacity, not the weight of the vehicle.

That Belgian Guy
That Belgian Guy
3 months ago
Reply to  Max Headbolts

Forgot to add I was being sarcastic. Thanks for the reply. 😀

Racer Esq.
Racer Esq.
3 months ago
Reply to  Max Headbolts

It has kind of become meaningless because my Silverado 1500 crew cab “half ton” can carry 2,070 pounds, and a “one ton” 3500 can carry 2+ to 3+ tons depending on DRW.

4jim
4jim
3 months ago

As an Old I was using a short hand phrase that I assumed people knew as short hand for the trucks that are heavy-duty pickup trucks with a high gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), typically in the “350” or “3500” class, that are the most capable non-commercial trucks and include models such as the Ford F-350 Super Duty, Chevrolet Silverado 3500HD, GMC Sierra 3500HD, and Ram 3500. I will type that next time.

Ranwhenparked
Member
Ranwhenparked
3 months ago
Reply to  4jim

I honestly just want a gauge cluster as my gauge cluster, and it pisses me off that literally every car today has to have a screen there, too.

SSSSNKE
SSSSNKE
3 months ago
Reply to  Ranwhenparked

Preach, brother. Now the screen freaks are not only gonna come for my comments, but for yours too!

D-dub
Member
D-dub
3 months ago
Reply to  4jim

“These stupid safety regulations are why cars are so expensive” is not the marketing move they think it is.

Canopysaurus
Canopysaurus
3 months ago
Reply to  D-dub

Never underestimate the power of human stupidity..

— Robert H. Heinlein

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