With all the doom-and-gloom headlines around EVs in America, you can be forgiven for thinking that the sky is falling. Honda writing down its 0 Series models, GM pulling back investment on next-generation EV trucks, Hyundai scaling back Ioniq 6 plans. Legislative changes last year really did put a dent in electric car sales, but according to J.D. Power, the other side of the dip might be just around the corner.
At the same time, GM is absolutely raking it in, the Tesla Cybertruck really isn’t living up to sales expectations, and Range Rover is launching an electric coupe-SUV-type-thing. Welcome back to The Morning Dump, where we break down the morning’s car news headlines for your perusal. Let’s get cracking.
The EV Dip Might Just Be A Blip
It’s been a rough past 12 months for electric cars in America. From disappearing incentives to cancelled models, the industry is undergoing a thorough recalibration. However, this adjustment doesn’t mean that EVs are dead in America. J.D. Power’s latest EV Volumes study is out, and it claims that a bounce-back in EV sales might happen quicker than many expected. While market share for 2026 is expected to dip from 9.4 percent to 8.2 percent, this may just be a blip.
In 2027, 15.6% year-over-year growth in new EV sales is expected across the US. In turn, the EV share is projected to rise to 9.3%. This is forecast to nearly double to 18.1% in 2030, reaching 36.8% in 2035 and 56.2% in 2040.
Alright, so a few interesting claims to unpack here. The study combines battery electric and plug-in hybrid sales, and saying they’ll nearly return to 2025 levels in 2027 seems like a bold prediction, but there’s some substance to back it up. The war in Iran has resulted in a prolonged period of instability in global oil markets, running up the cost of gasoline at the pumps. This in turn has led to a bump in second-hand EV resale values, with more consumers looking to save on running costs. With the national average price of a gallon of gasoline sitting above $4 again per AAA’s fuel price tracker, going electric might be more of a financial play than anything else. At the same time, 36.8 percent U.S. market share by 2035 is far below the global forecast of 61.3 percent of overall market share. Reading between the lines, expect hybrids to continue playing a significant role for at least another decade as American drivers look to reduce their vehicle running costs.
Interestingly enough, J.D. Power claims Canada’s EV trajectory more closely follows America’s rather than Europe’s, and that has some interesting implications on both impending tailpipe emissions legislation for 2035 and provincial EV mandates.
The wider light-vehicle market is forecast to grow by 3.0% in 2026, with EV sales climbing by 40.2%. This would hand the powertrain pair a 13.1% share. However, this remains below the 13.7% peak recorded in 2024. This is predicted to be surpassed by a 24.1% share in 2030, rising to 42.5% in 2035 and 61.8% in 2040.
Earlier this year, Prime Minister Mark Carney spoke about plans to tighten fleet average carbon dioxide emissions from 172 grams-per-mile to 74 grams-per-mile by 2035. In theory, that would work out to somewhere around a 68 percent EV mix in 2035 which is well above J.D. Power’s demand forecast of a 42.5 percent EV mix. Will the great EV legislative walk-back continue? Only time will tell.
GM Just Keeps Making Money
For now, having a lineup of both solid EVs and regular cars is likely the safest bet, which helps explain why GM can’t stop winning when it comes to balance sheets. The automaker just beat its earnings forecast for the 16th time in a row, buoyed by a highly profitable product mix, resilient consumer demand, and regulatory easing. As Reuters reports:
The company’s quarterly earnings before interest and tax (EBIT) rose to $3.9 billion from roughly $3 billion a year earlier. On an adjusted basis, it earned $3.57 per share, topping analyst expectations of $3.20, according to LSEG data.
GM raised its 2026 profit outlook by $500 million to a range of $14 billion to $16 billion, after boosting it by the same amount earlier this year.
Those are some significant gains, especially in the wake of new expenses. Onshoring production of models like the Chevrolet Equinox, a reduction in EV sales volumes, “higher software expenses” and tariffs are all expected to add billions in combined costs. However, not only has GM’s North American profit margin improved from 6.1 percent to 8.6 percent, it’s kept the average transaction price of a GM vehicle to around $52,000. This reflects fairly clearly in the Q2 sales report: Sales of the reasonably priced Chevrolet Trailblazer are up 28 percent, the Buick Envista and Chevrolet Trax are more-or-less holding ground, Chevrolet Bolt sales are up, while models like the Chevrolet Corvette and GMC Sierra are also seeing sales gains to level things out. Total U.S. sales are holding within 5 percent year-over-year, and a strong EV lineup’s there for when America’s electric sales dip recovers.
The Tesla Cybertruck Hasn’t Been Having A Great 2026
There’s one long-range EV that probably won’t be leading a market-share comeback, and that’s the Tesla Cybertruck. It’s reportedly not living up to its lofty sales forecasts to the point that Bloomberg is comparing it to the Edsel.
Edsel sales dropped each year the model was on the market, and Ford discontinued the car in 1959. Cybertruck sales are off to an even worse start. Only 7,133 have been registered in the US this year through May, according to S&P Global Mobility data provided to Bloomberg News. That count is buoyed by Musk’s other companies, with SpaceX building out a fleet of Cybertrucks.
Even with fleet sales, that works out to around 1,427 Cybertrucks sold per month this year. Not ultra-low volumes, but certainly not high volumes. That’s just S&P’s data; according to Cox Automotive’s U.S. EV registration tracker, only 7,236 Cybertrucks were registered through the first half of the year.
It’s worth noting that electric pickup sales are pretty much down across the board. The only model to post a sales gain through the first half of 2026 according to Cox Automotive was the GMC Sierra EV with a volume bump of 9.8 percent. Still, it sold fewer than half as many units as the Cybertruck. This year has been tough for Tesla’s truck, as on a year-over-year basis, the only dedicated electric pickup truck to post a larger percentage decline than the Cybertruck was the Ford F-150 Lightning, and it’s been discontinued. Considering Tesla’s initial ambition of 250,000 Cybertruck sales per year, the model doesn’t appear to have met expectations.
Et Tu, Range Rover?
Even though it’s been 18 years since the BMW X6 entered production, it’s still somewhat amazing how less practical, swoopy-roofed crossover SUVs have become a market all their own. In addition to BMW, Audi, Mercedes-Benz, Porsche, Infiniti, Buick and Polestar have all entered the arena, and it’s not done growing yet. This is the Range Rover GT, an incoming heavily-fastbacked model from Land Rover that’s quite unlike anything else we’ve seen from the marque. Partly because of its styling and partly because it rides on a new electric-first architecture.
Obviously, Land Rover hasn’t revealed the entire car, but it has given everyone a camouflaged sneak peek so here’s what we know. The Range Rover GT will launch as a battery electric vehicle first, with flexibility for hybrid powertrains down the road. The wheels are enormous, the interior looks well-appointed if rather minimalist, and it can be had in a four-seat configuration with a console instead of a middle rear seat. Beyond that, range and power and battery pack size remain under wraps. It’s certainly an unusual development, but one that could be a natural successor to the Velar. Regardless, expect more details to surface later this year. Realtors, start your checkbooks.
What I’m Listening To While Writing TMD:
For some reason, the mood of the morning is “Up In Hudson” by Dirty Projectors. Not sure why, but I can’t complain. This track’s still absolutely fantastic.
The Big Question:
Since price is probably the biggest factor when it comes to most purchases, how have gas prices affected your current car-shopping endeavors? Are you suddenly finding that the math on an EV makes sense?
Top graphic image: Chevrolet
We bought a 2026 Toyota BZ XLE FWD Plus ~4 months ago for my wife to commute with.
Saving ~$300/mo in gas compared to the Honda Pilot she was using (that I am now stuck with…sigh).
Really wish we had made the switch earlier.
How much more is your electricity bill?
When our house switched to all EV in 2023, we were paying $300/month in gas and now pay $40 more for electric with an average rate of $0.14/kwh. Charging is all done at $0.06 off peak rates.
You are lucky to have those rates. Here in FL I pay $.17/kwh (and rising fast), and in ME it’s over $.30 with delivery (FL delivers for free). Neither has off-peak rates.
Definitely a factor to consider!
Nice!
Our “off-peak” is not too different from peak. We get charged more after consuming certain amounts amounts. I can get as low as $0.26 per kWh off-peak.
So, lowering that will require the PV math exercise to install solar.
We pay 0.13/kwh. No off peak rates. The bill is around $80-90 extra per month. We are also using the EV for all our driving. I’ve filled up the Corvette once and the Pilot twice in 4 months.
We were spending around $70/week on gas for the Pilot.
Seems a no-brainer if commuting.
I feel for you. I’ll be replacing my dead car (well, $6000 to revive it), and I’m getting my wife’s hybrid, which gets good mileage but is a snore (CT200h).
I found once we had an EV it was hard to justify driving the gas car.
The cost difference in fuel between our Bolt EV and Acura TSX is about 10 cents a mile.
I literally just bought an EV. It really just came down to the fact that I wanted something new (I plan on keeping cars for at least 5 years and aim for 10 but don’t actually expect to hit that) and in my ~$45k budget, nothing else seemed to be near as good as an Ioniq 5. I would have considered a large sedan, a wagon, a CUV, an SUV, or a pick-up but it had to fit in my driveway (ruling out really large SUVs and all full-size pick-ups). Loaded Ioniq 5 came out my personal winner.
Gas prices were a small part of it, as in they weren’t the driving factor but getting ~$25 savings in gas per week was certainly better than zero savings. But really, spending ~$900 per month to save $100 per month in gas isn’t exactly a good financial move. But I was prepared to spend ~$45k so $100 monthly savings was a small small win.
Agreed, it does’t necessarily make sense to buy a new EV just to save on gas, but the high fuel costs are making customers actually pay attention to total cost of ownership. That extra $100/mo (or more) is a nice bonus.
Our EV was in the shop for nearly two weeks for hail repair recently so I was driving the old Jeep WJ. It was shocking how often I needed to fill the fuel tank!
TBQ: When Trump launched his war on affordability, I was already dipping my toe in the waters for a new vehicle and purchased a Prius PHEV. Since taking delivery in April, I have burned 1/4 tank of fuel over nearly 3,500 miles. The only gas I have bought since then has been for the Miata.
For me going more electric was more about not having to do much maintenance and worrying about failures. I realized in my years of hybrids I never had a problem with any of the electric part. Battery degrades but thats typically easy and cheap fix. Beats pulling a transmission or engine or cab to get to said engine or transmission.
Drivability was also a big one. When you want it to go or stop every bev I’ve been in does. Almost every hybrid I’ve been in does. Ice cars not always it’s can be more of a suggestion.
Purchase price of the vehicles and operating costs definitely helped justify it further. BEV have been sitting about price parity with hybrids but cheaper then phev.
Used there were some great deals that I suspect are on their way back.
I feel a lot better knowing my daughter is in an EV that’s dependable over a ticking time bomb of a newer boxer cvt Subaru. That Subaru pushed me over the edge. I realized just how bad new ice cars are with their stupid cvts and poor tuning. I would drive a hybrid that was 16 years older with blown shocks with 250k mi that was still 10x the car that stupid thing could ever be. Drive that Subaru and just be angry and wonder why the stupid thing exists.
I’m still happy with the price and the zero mile 2025 used leaf I got that my wife mainly drives. The 2014 dirt cheap beater leaf I mainly use around town is fine it has maybe 60 mi of range I only dare to use about 30 miles and change it to 80% but for $2k it’s hard beat. I picked up a cheap 2019 model 3 the other day because I was able to straight trade the Forester for a Soltera a few months ago a year newer with less the half the miles. I’m curious to see if it is 4x the car the dirt cheap leaf is. So far so good.
Drivability was also a big one. When you want it to go or stop every bev I’ve been in does. Almost every hybrid I’ve been in does. Ice cars not always it’s can be more of a suggestion
??? Not sure what you mean by this. Are you saying you’ve driven ICE cars that don’t go or stop on command from the brake and gas pedals?
Gas prices generally don’t impact my car choice. I enjoyed driving a 4×4 van that got 10mpg going downhill for a fair bit of the 2010s.
That said, I’ve been waiting for the price of EVs to crater. I’d like to get one to take advantage of the excess energy my solar generates. The Iran quagmire is keeping everyone else interested in gas prices and used EVs.
Cratering EV prices will mean a glut in EV parts you can use to convert classic ICE cars that otherwise aren’t running.
IMO, you’d be a lot better off in the long term converting a classic car to electric. Get rid of all of the tech bloat, have something you can fix yourself with basic tools, and have lower operating cost if you pick many of the choices available that are aerodynamically more efficient than and lighter in mass than anything you can buy today. There are choices for donor chassis that can yield a car with better Wh/mile numbers than a Tesla Model 3.
I recommend a 1st gen Honda Insight for a 2-seater, a Honda CRX for a 4-seater, a Gen II Prius if you need more room than a CRX, and if it’s a sports car you want, there are a lot of good choices(Triumph Spitfire/GT6, Saab Sonnet, Porsche 914, 1st gen Toyota MR2, Toyota MR2 Spyder, among others).
What kind of USDM CRX has four seats?
The math on converting a classic to electric power is a little ugly still. It’s not a cheap date. But EV + solar is awesome.
None. You’d have to source a rare kit. But people have done it and I’ve ridden in the back of one. It wasn’t bad.
If you ned something totally stock with 4 seats, any 90s Civic hatchback or sedan will do, as well as a Ford Aspire or Geo Metro.
Sweat equity and salvage parts can yield a 100+ mile range conversion that does 0-60 mph in under 6 seconds for as little as $3k. But you better know how to do your own fabrication for things like adapter plates, couplers, motor mounts, battery boxes, ect.
All brand new parts, the cost can quickly go north of $20k for the same specs.
In either case, you’ll have a car not connected to the automotive spyware “ecosystem” that now permeates almost everything made within the last decade and which you can fix yourself or pay a local mechanic to fix outside of a dealership.
Then you can proceed to just rack up hundreds of thousands of miles on it over the decades without paying for gasoline. Bonus if it’s a car you really like and want.
I am not afraid of a project, but this would be all new territory for me and any friends I could rope into helping.
LOL, yes, just start with the Civic and you don’t need to source unobtanium JDM parts to make a 2+2.
If anyone feels like reading about the potential journey of a DIY EV CRX, here’s someone who’s done it. Simply buying a running Leaf or i3 would probably be a little quicker to get up and running.
https://www.diyelectriccar.com/threads/1986-crx-ev-conversion-nissan-leaf-donor-mr-conversion.205433/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=organic
I was thinking maybe a CR-Z, but those had two seats too.
And, sure, I’d like to convert something old…but that’s getting into fabrication and expensive parts. I think I’d still be better off figuring out something used.
This is my future avenue. I’m sure I’ll build an electric car eventually. But I just want the power train. Powertrains are literally the only part of modern vehicles that actually interests me. Otherwise, I’m a bit of a luddite, and beyond that, value this concept called “privacy”. so yeah, I want to get away from the bloat.
If you don’t need the room or the range, the Fiat 500e makes a great sub $5K around town car. I got one for the same reason. No regrets.
None for sale within their own range of me.
I was already shopping for an EV to replace my leased EV, so the gas price problems only affect me in that the used EV availability is down and prices are up in my area. Which is annoying. I wanted a smokin’ deal on a car nobody else was interested in, dang it.
*Polestar2 has entered the chat
Thought about it, but for road trips, I really want something with 800V architecture so I can minimize charging times. I was looking at the ioniq 6, but even those are getting snatched up.
True, but with an entry in the low $20’s, renting a car for the annual road trip is much less of a burden.
If it was just an annual road trip, that would be one thing. But it’s more like an every couple of months roadtrip. Renting a car that often is kinda annoying, plus there’s always the risks with renting a car that they try to screw you over, or you end up in something that wrecks your back.
From experience, the 2024 Polestar 2 does pretty well on road trips. The charging rate’s lower than what the Ioniq 6 can hit on 800V chargers, but if you’re on a 400V charger the Polestar will be a bit quicker.
Worth putting into ABRP and seeing how much time it’ll actually take for your route. Whether it matters or not depends partly on where the chargers are and what kind of road-tripper you are. If you tend to stop for lunch near a charger, or your refueling/recharging stops tend to involve taking a few minutes to pee, grab a drink or a snack, and stretch you probably won’t see much difference between the two. If you’re more of a road warrior who stops as little as possible and gets going again as quickly as possible the Ioniq 6 may make a difference.
You’re preaching to the choir. I use my most common trip as a base in ABRP to compare different EVs. The Polestar adds something like an hour and a half over the ioniq6.
I’m in the same boat. We’re currently leasing a Blazer EV and plan to replace it with a used EV9 this winter, and the ones we want (Wind trim) have gone from ~35k to 43k thanks to this stupid war.
We are about to be in a tough place re: car buying. With my wife and I actively trying to have a second kid, her 2015 CRV with 100,000 miles on it is on borrowed time. We’ve gone back and forth on how big of a car we’ll need for two kids and a dog. Like most people she’s convinced we need a three row, while I think we could make a current CRV/Forester hybrid/etc work just fine. Commentariat, we all know who will prevail in the end.
We really want to prioritize a hybrid for her next car but it’s easier said than done. A regular Highlander hybrid would be perfect, but good fucking luck getting one. They’re all spoken for before they even hit lots, Toyota almost exclusively makes the Platinum trim that’s $60,000, etc. She refuses to consider a van and is (correctly) worried about buying a Korean vehicle with a brand new turbo/hybrid powertrain.
Unfortunately we may just be SOL…especially if we won’t make the price delta for the hybrid back in gas savings. We’re conscientious of our carbon footprint, but there comes a point in today’s cursed market that the upcharge for a hybrid is so high that it doesn’t offer any sort of financial case…and with the cost of living, our comfortable but not super high earning careers, two kids, etc. in mind the cheaper all of this is up front the better.
I will happily hear other suggestions, and while I know the Grand Highlander is an option the size feels like overkill to both of us. The CX90 was going to be our choice for a while but they’ve had such significant issues that we’re no longer willing to roll the dice on one.
Right now what I keep coming back to is either:
1). Pilot/Passport
…not at all fuel efficient, but reliable, spacious, low maintenance, high residuals, and low cost of entry. In our area you can get a mid spec version of either with leather seats for $45,000. That’s a lot of car for the money.
2). A certified MDX
…all the positives of the Pilot with a nicer interior, luxury dealership experience, etc. You can get nice ones for the same price as a new Pilot all day every day.
3). A certified XC90 Recharge
This is an objectively awful idea, but we’d get all the hybrid benefits, a nicer interior, more panache, etc. We’d pay to upgrade to the 10 year warranty since shit is inevitably going to go wrong many times over.
My sister just bought a last gen Telluride that seems like a very nice car, but my wife is just not going to be talked into a Korean car. Oh and I’m not interested in an Outback/Ascent because of the damn CVT.
I know this isn’t cool, but shop for a Honda Odyssey EX-L. They are $43k, have leather and plenty of features and are known good powertrain that will last 200k+. They are huge inside, but don’t drive like it.
Pull out one of the center seats. Put the older child in the back and the infant seat in the middle and there will be a big space to fit even a huge dog.
They hold value well and drive nice and you will be teased, but.. who cares, you will have a superior vehicle.
I would be perfectly happy with an Odyssey, unfortunately the wife is staunchly anti-van
Have any trips planned? Rent with National and get the Emerald Aisle. They will have a sea of meh vehicles like Corollas and small SUVs and the like. Then they will have a couple vans (likely the Voyager). Say “I want more room and all we can pick from is a van, dang it.”
You will be van shopping when you get home.
The big advantage of a van with your family is the sliding door and Fido.
Back when, we had 2 kids and a small dog. When we would pull into the garage with our car, I would go to the back door, open the door and be met with a 15 pound ball of stupid that wanted into the house NOW. She would hit me, end up on the floor and lose her mind as she attempted to crawl under the door to get to the path to the garage. This would put the dog in the way for me to help my kids out of their seats.
When we had 3 kids, we still had the small ball of stupid. We also had ended up with a 100 lbs of very sweet dog, that also wanted to run into the house at Mach 1. The difference was that if you got in his way, he didn’t fall down, you did. Fortunately, we had a van. And that made all the difference. We would open the sliding door and be behind the path of least resistance to the house and the dumb dog and the large dog could rampage to the house before I would even have a chance to reach into the van to work on helping a kid out of a car seat.
Yes, you can trade a dog to do better with cars and doors. But you will also be giving your kids a very extensive vocabulary that you might not want them to have.
Lease a Kia Sportage PHEV. Kia is incentivizing leases right now. The warranty is excellent but you will not need it. Second row is huge. Has a proper transmission for the electric and gas powertrains. At least get her to test drive one. Battery commuting, AWD, fine interior with Carplay, etc. You can get one although I had to wait two weeks. $350 a month $3000 down including taxes all in.
Used R1S? Still stubbornly hovering around the 60s but a lot of car for the money.
The real answer is R2, but no third row.
She’s vaguely open to an R1S but $60,000 is a lot of money
A buddy of mine w/ 2 kids has been going through this, his wife’s Mazda 6 is very much ready for replacement w/ 200K surprisingly trouble free miles on the clock. Ideally he’d want them to get a 3 row hybrid (really just the Grand Highlander) for more room on family adventures but as you say the options are limited and mostly outside their budget, which has gotten him reconsidering if they can make do with a smaller 2 row like a RAV4 Hybrid. I keep telling him can make up some of the lost space if he puts a Thule/Yakima box on top.
My dad’s a low key car guy and had an MDX for a few years and liked it and found it to be pretty low maintenance compared to the various German cars he’s owned. I think they only got rid of it bc my mom thought it drove too big-but she’s in her 70s and a very timid driver in the best of conditions. To your point re: the Volvo, don’t buy without a warranty. My dad also had a 1st gen XC90 years ago and to your point before it got wrecked when someone cut him off on an icy road it was already needing some big ticket warranty items at 70K miles.
Good luck!
Is something wrong with the current Honda? Or do you just like to stay in warranty? I get that a lot of people don’t have the time/inclination/ability/desire to wrench but saying a 100k-mile Honda is used up but a used XC90 is a potential replacement doesn’t quite compute.
We have neither the time nor capacity to wrench. The current Honda is fine but we’ve had to put a couple thousand into it over the past few years and there’s going to come a point when it won’t be worth it to keep sinking money into it anymore.
You missed the certified descriptor with the Volvo. We’d buy an extended warranty and maintenance plan that would run for 10 years.
Fair enough. The warranty would cover issues but having to get a car in and out of the shop for repairs is a bummer. Unless their warranty includes a loaner, I guess.
Nice warranty, but you’d be without your daily for repairs at least once a year. MDX all the way.
He’s trying to have a second kid, I read the CR-V issue as soon to be too small, not unreliable.
Fair. I keyed in on Passport as an option and those have no third row. I suppose they’re bigger than a CRV, though.
A financially prudent choice for 3-row seating would be a 10-15 year old USED Honda Odyssey with around 100k on the odo, paid for with cash.
But if that’s not going to fly with the wife, pay the price I guess, and hope neither of you loses your job for the duration of the payment plan.
The longest contiguous streak in my career without a layoff is 5 years so far, with an average duration of unemployment of over 1 year each time I did suffer a layoff while diligently looking for work. That’s why I don’t have a mortgage, car payment, or wife/children. I’d have lost everything multiple times over through no fault of my own. I’ve even been homeless before! I consider myself fortunate that I was able to pay my student loans off by the time I was 33, and I came close to default multiple times while basically giving up on life/fun things for the duration in order to do it. Taking financial stability for granted can be a dangerous game because at the end of the day, no one is coming to save you unless you’re extremely lucky, and this society has a tendacy of preventing you from saving yourself at the same time.
Having a partner increases stability. In the 26 years we have been married both my wife and I have been out of work but never at the same time. Two incomes also makes life a lot more affordable although we have alway lived on one income and saved the other.
I’ve had the opposite experience with partners. I wanted to save/invest/pay off debt, they wanted to spend more than what came in by piling on debt in effort to keep up with the Joneses and have unnecessary frivolities/novelties on a daily basis. One of them found my plan “boring”, and they aren’t doing so well last I heard about them. Another came from privilege and didn’t have to worry about any of their basic needs going unmet for lack of money. Had I let either sway the decisions with my own money, I’d have been financially ruined at some point with almost zero likelihood of recovery.
That’s a major reason none of them ever worked out. Luck of the draw I guess.
There were times I was down to my last $20 and had to use it to eat after selling off investments to keep that student loan out of default and car insurance paid. Those investments would have netted me 6-figures by today if I could have kept them, but the penalty for not paying off the student loans and letting them default could have been worse, and ruined credit would have cost me job opportunities at a later date when I needed them…
Choices, choices. Not having money when you need it can be very expensive.
Financially, I’m doing pretty damned good right now by most peoples’ standards. But old habits die hard, and now that I have the money to buy a decent car outright, there isn’t a single new car on the market that truly appeals to me.
I wouldn’t call it luck of the draw. How someone handles finances becomes apparent pretty quickly
Indeed. The vast majority of Americans are terrible with money. I didn’t come from wealth and did what I had to do in order to build something up. That meant making a middle class income, and continuing to live like I was poor. That is also what kept me from ruin when I got unlucky on a repeated basis.
My dates wanted to live like “normal people”, and that would have been a very bad financial decision on my part. I drove a $1,200 used car, lived in a $550/mo slum, and rode my road bike for all local trips when I was making $60k/yr in 2013, and am glad I did. My dates weren’t very impressed though. But that made the difference between being able to recover after a job loss, or being permanently on the street with a defaulted student loan and unable to climb out. EVERY employer I’ve ever had did a credit check, and not having screwed up credit saved me when the time came, on more than one occassion.
It likely helps that both my wife and I came from working class families in a now dead GM town. Our expectations were modest starting out.
I recently went through the same thing with my wife last year. She was adamantly against a van to the point where she wouldn’t test drive one….. until she went on a work trip and a minivan was the only available rental car. Suddenly, she saw the light. I was blown away at how quick she stopped looking at Pilots, Grand Highlanders, Tellurides, Grand Cherokee Ls, and Atlases. She kinda realized most of those SUVs look a lot like a minivan with some lipstick, but are just less useful for the day-to-day schlepping of children, so why not just get a minivan? She’d get one again in a heartbeat; the only thing that would lead her to an SUV now is if the budget suddenly grew to accommodate a G Wagon.
I guess this is all to say, I think I got lucky. Good luck.
This is exactly how my wife was too before our first van.
Inshallah mine will be the same, if it was my call we’d be in a Sienna, but this is her car, happy wife happy life, etc.
My wife can pick what she wants, but if she asks for guidance/suggestions, I tell her that if she wants me to help, she must agree to at least test drive my top two recommendations. You don’t have to buy them or even like them. But you need to at least test drive them. She failed to do that last time, and then I got to hear for years, “I should have test driven the CX-5. Why did you recommend that!?!?”
I DID RECOMMEND THAT! YOU WERE DEAD SET ON A FORESTER AND DIDN’T WANT TO TEST DRIVE ANYTHING ELSE!!!!
I also told her to get remote start and she didn’t. But at least she says, “You were right about the remote start”
I mean, I understand it. Before she was onboard, I was begrudgingly offering to take one for the team and get the van for myself so she wouldn’t have to. I honestly didn’t want to do it, but did think it was probably better than having her get an SUV. Now that we have it, I regret not having got it for myself.
They don’t think it be like it is, but it do.
Come to flyover country!
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Which is all we have, because even my local flyover country Toyota dealer has no HiHys at all. Even some of the ones listed as “In production” are already sale pending.
Actually, I take that back. Those are Grand HiHys listed on their site. There’s only one regular one and it’s also sale pending. Toyota availability is Crazy with a capital C.
The Grands do look to be much more numerous on the ground here as well.
I suppose the standard Highlander is somewhat of a tougher sell in places where 3 rows in the smallest footprint is less important.
In the same boat here, sans dog. We have a Mazda 3 and Ford Focus with a second baby on the way, so we’ll have two rear facing car seats and they physically doesn’t come close to working with our current cars. I haven’t gone and test fit anything yet, but I am hoping a bigger sedan would work (Accord or Camry, hybrid), but realistically looking at CR-V/RAV4 sized vehicles. But I’m really not considering a non-hybrid, I drive about 20k miles per year, and a 30-45% increase in fuel efficiency can pay for itself well within the timeline I ideally plan on keeping the vehicle.
I’m also somewhat leery of a Hyuandai/Kia, but for the price relative to what you’d comparably get from Toyota, I’m seriously considering rolling the dice on a Tuscon or a Santa Fe or something, assuming I’d like it after sitting in and driving it.
We were in the same boat about 10 years ago with two growing kids and a dog with kennel. We made it work with an Outback for wife (understanding not your thing) and a used Touareg TDI for me. These had plenty of room for kids, dog kennel, and “stuff” for 95% of daily use, and they were still small enough to not be a pain to live with. When we went on longer trips, the key was having a Thule or Yakima pod for the roof, and occasionally a hitch mounted platform with a sturdy storage bin for all the extra things that get brought along for vacations. I think a new CRV hybrid or used X5 would fit the bill nicely for you as long as you buy a pod and a platform. Or similar vehicles with a barely-usable third row for the rare times you need to carry 7 people. And if you occasionally need to make 7 passengers comfortable, then just rent a Suburban for the trip.
I have a S60 Recharge, and love it beyond rational words.
Knocking on wood, I’ve had 50K trouble-free miles so far (it’s a ’23) and as long as you get the ’23 or newer recharge, it’s 40 miles on the battery, charges overnight easily on 110, and the infotainment, which is google based, is updated to the 2026 improvements wirelessly. I just got Gemini AI on mine over the weekend.
I don’t know your charging situation but a used ev9 is a lot of car for the money.
Plus lots of warranty left on the drivetrain. The bad Korean parts are gone unless there is some other underlying issue.
Its turned into the car of choice of suburban and urban moms especially in more granola areas.
They are going for $30k to $35k. Tons around with under 20k mi even 11k and 12k.
You can search “ev9 mom” and find all sorts of reviews with things like car seat fitting and things moms think about.
CPO EV9s with ~20k miles appear to be in the mid $40ks at the moment. I have 2 kids (though not little any more) and 2 large dogs and am a huge fan of minivans. We replaced our trusty Sienna with an EV9 and we love it. We road trip fairly regularly in it too. It can’t match a minivan for interior space, but it’s very comfortable for 6 adults or 4 adults and a dog or two.
It’s just crazy enough that it might work 😉
We were in a similar situation a year and a half ago, went with a 2021 Highlander Hybrid. It’s been great, no regrets.
Just get the grand highlander, with 2 kids you will be happy with the extra space and there is minimal downside. We had a 2016 pilot for 3 years and it was fine but had niggling issues that I was not expecting in a modern japanese car and got shit milage. The newer honda v6s are noticably less reliable than the toyota hybrids. The MDX is a lot less space but will drive better. The only compelling argument for the pilot was it was the best deal I could find after I totaled a car in 2022.
> With my wife and I actively trying to have a second kid
That sounds pretty fun, NGL.
One vote for the mdx. My 2013 rdx has been literally 100% trouble-free with only fluid and tire changes. Acuras are great cars (if not exciting).
Keep the CRV. It really is big enough for a family of four and should be plenty reliable for another another 100,000 miles. Isn’t this the lowest cost option?
That camo wrap on the Range Rover makes it look like it’s been in a battery fire. Just sayin’…
Foreshadowing.
Currently a bit. Not in so far as hybrid vs non hybrid. But the value proposition between plug in vs non plug in Rav 4s. About ~6k difference in price when you include WA state 10% tax. But when gas is still 4.50 or so, and not likely to drop anytime soon with whatever is going on with Iran, the break even comes before 50k miles.
And you get a much more refined and pleasant driving experience for those 50k miles. I think that’s worth something, too.
Yeah. Not having to use gas to commute is a big bonus. plus 320 HP and torque is a fun one for me
It seems obvious that automakers with an “all of the above” multi-powetrain strategy are doing well.
The ones ignoring EVs are bleeding market share in other markets and the ones who went all-in are having to take painful investment losses.
TBQ: The math on an EV has penciled out for a while, but the sheer rate of improvement of EVs is keeping me on the sidelines. Anytime I think a new model is a good fit, someone announces something 30% better coming in 6 months.
I would be looking at short term leases only for that reason.
I’m on my fourth 3-year EV lease for that reason. And each one has been at least a 20% improvement for essentially the same price. And I’ve had a nice new car the whole time.
Yeah I tend to buy cars I like and keep them relatively long, but leases are the move on EVs.
I can keep the fun stuff I like on longer timelines and the daily EV can rotate until the tech settles a bit.
I hear you. There are a bunch of EVs out there that are close but not quite there yet, and I’m sure in the next 3-5 years someone will release one that ticks all my boxes and I’ll want the new hotness.
The problem with leasing is that with the death of the tax credits and manufacturers realizing how much EVs actually depreciate, cheap leases don’t seem to be a thing as much anymore. It also doesn’t work for me personally because I drive too many miles in a year, but YMMV (pun entirely intended) on that.
The tax credit was $7500 of the depreciation.
From what I’ve been hearing, even when things settle down the 3.50 – 4.00 gas prices are likely here to stay, so that may be a factor in my next purchase.
I don’t regret my recent truck purchase (Nov 2025), but I may consider mileage more when shopping for its replacement.
I’m hoping my situation will change to one where charging an EV is more practical, because I REALLY like the Rivian R2. I miss certain things about my 4Runner, and the R2 would fill that role PERFECTLY.
Is the R2 one David tested that the AC could barely keep up with a 85° day? The one with the sunroof.
Did he say that? I’ll have to reread his review. I’ve watched a few videos on it, I don’t recall anyone mentioning the AC.
If so, that still fits with the 4R comparison, the AC sucked in my 4Runner.
He did but I don’t remember what Rivian it was, it was his off roading in Utah article.
I always appreciate seeing Hundal’s name on TMD because I know he’ll pick a song I don’t know and it’s always worth hearing, even if I’d never buy it (or ever want to hear it again). Today is no exception: I have no idea who these people are, but it’s a very well-produced ditty that surprisingly even at nearly eight minutes doesn’t overstay its welcome. I look forward to (and might actually look for) more Dirty Projectors. Thanks Thomas!
I’m only interested in the Slate. It would be my work daily 5 days a week, could charge at home, and have 3 other fun cars for zoom zoom stuff. Wouldn’t hurt to not buy as much gas anymore, especially 93 octane.
“Interestingly enough, J.D. Power claims Canada’s EV trajectory more closely follows America’s rather than Europe’s,”
I expect Canada to diverge from the USA in the coming years as the Canadian market gradually opens more and more to Chinese EV makers.
And as a Canadian, I fully support this given how the incumbant automakers in Canada that build cars here (Toyota, Honda, GM, Ford, Stellantis) have mostly been dragging their asses with bringing affordable BEVs to market (except for GM).
And I would love it if BYD came here and started building cars here.
“Since price is probably the biggest factor when it comes to most purchases, how have gas prices affected your current car-shopping endeavors”
I have always bought the most fuel efficient vehicle that suited my needs because I remember the fuel price spikes of the past. It’s not a question of if it will happen again, but when.
That was my thinking the last time I was in the market (in 2024).
I wanted to go with an EV… a 2014 Tesla Model S to be exact. Was all set to buy it but didn’t when I got the insurance quote… CAD$4500/year. And that was with shopping around for insurance.
So I bought a C-Max Energi plug in hybrid instead… which gives me about 75% of the BEV benefits, but with an insurance rate of only CAD$1500/year.
And back then, decent used BEVs weren’t as abundant or affordable.
But my next vehicle purchase is very likely to be a BEV… especially with used Chevy Bolts with low mileage getting to be pretty cheap on the used market.
“I have always bought the most fuel efficient vehicle that suited my needs because I remember the fuel price spikes of the past. It’s not a question of if it will happen again, but when.”
I kind of lucked out on this. Shortly after my wife and I were married she went back to school and had a daily 100 mile commute. We simply could not afford to put gas in her 2000 Frontier 4×4 at 15 mpg so it was traded on a 2003 Jetta Wagon TDI that got 50 mpg. When fuel spiked up to $5 a gallon in 2008 we just shrugged.
From then on we have always had a least one vehicle that got 45 – 50 mpg. Two cars ago we stepped it up to 100 mpge with an EV.
Gas prices affected me a bit last year when I got the Miata before trading that in for the Polestar 2. But also the fun factor played into it if I could not get a fun car with a stick that could get over 30mpg I was going to get an EV the only thing that really struck the manual/30+mpg was the Miata (which I had for ~6months) but once that 3rd gear syncro went and the trans was replaced that was traded in for the Polestar and after having that I am going to find it really hard to go back to a non-EV for a daily driver unless again it is a fun stick shift that gets good mpgs. Just a note my commute is almost 100 miles a day so in a year well over 20k miles on my probably even over 25k miles so good mpgs or kwh/mi plays a decent affect into it.
Just hoping more fun EV’s start coming out not all these big CUV/SUV type blob mobiles.
I feel like it’s always the 3rd gear synchro that is the shittiest one on all my cars.
Yeah I really wonder why that is. With the ND I assumed it was more due to going from a 5 speed to a 6 speed in such a small form package.
Zero car shopping endeavors until something comes out that is of interest, but it has been almost 9 years since I realized that getting a (cheap) new EV would basically pay for itself in fuel and maintenance savings over an assumed 200,000 mile lifetime. 125,000 miles in, and so far it is following that expectation.
In an alternative world where CUVs and SUV are the default regular vehicles, hordes of commentators in enthusiasts websites show their disappointment and anger at this so called new breed of lower vehicles (so-called ‘cars’) trying to replace what is objectively best what a four wheeled vehicle should be.
“Why is Range Rover building this ‘car’? Surely it is for the people who don’t know best and are only trying to impress neighbours and onlookers. They are bringing down our beloved vehicles! And only because of market demand and because they want to increase profit! Heresy! Suddenly these ‘cars’ will be everywhere!”
That “alternative world” is today.
Why would people want to cram themselves into a smaller car with more difficulty to enter and exit is certainly beyond any rational comprehension.
I’ve been dailying a used Camry hybrid for 8 years now. It is the way with current infrastucture and my personal parking situation. Daughter has a Prius.
A British electric car, the jokes write themselves.
“Lucas, I am your father.”
–this car
Gas prices gave not affected my choice of getting a pickup at all because any of the ones I’d choose today gets better mileage than the one I have now.
It’s wild the economy pickups are getting these days, especially the fullsizes.
My Ram 1500 crew cab 4×4 Hurricane on 33’s gets better mileage than my old V6 4Runner.
To be fair, those 4Runners got terrible mileage.
They all did back in the day. I remember a V6 Dakota getting 12mpg.
I typically got 19.5- 20mpg with mine. A lot of the 4Runner guys call BS on anything over 17, haha. That’s driving like a grandma though.
When I traded it in, the average eco readout was 19.7 mpg, I hadn’t reset it in like 50K miles.
I filled the Ram up last night, got a hand calculated 21.2mpg over 425 miles. Not a road trip, just regular daily driving.
> driving like a grandma
The savings are canceled by taking circuitous routes and getting lost and body shop expenses.
Ask me how I know.
LMAO!
Exactly!
TBQ: I just paid off my CX-30 Turbo, and have no desire to replace it. I’m working on getting my Tundra ready to sell, not because of gas prices but because I no longer need it, and the cash would get me into something much more enjoyable as a backup car.
Regardless, if/when I am in the market for a new Daily, cost of fuel won’t be the driving factor, it’ll largely be feature set and EV availability. If the R3X is all it’s claimed to be, that’ll be the very top one on my list. I’d like an EV daily next for the combo of at-home chagrining, lower maintenance, and cheaper speed. I only do maybe a half-dozen trips exceeding 250 miles a year, so the compromise is a no brainer.
If you have the V8 it’ll be an easy sell.
It’s an ’07 with the unkillable 4.7 2UZ, and ~110k miles plus recent Timing Belt and Water Pump, so i’m not too concerned. Bed cap and TRD Offroad pack is a plus, but the paint it pretty horrible, clearcoat is half gone. Just got a new windshield in, about to get tires and an inspection done and then we’re off to marketplace! Figure I list it at around 75-85% of KBB and see what happens.
Sound like a good plan.
I don’t generally comment to correct typos and don’t care to be pedantic, but I would like to highlight that the phrase, “at-home chagrining” just made my day.
I’m chagrinning at home and away.
Just make the Range Rover GT a damn Jaguar shooting brake for Christ’s sake. Some of us buy SUV’s for the room and actual boxy, useful shape.
I was thinking the same thing. It looks an awful lot like a lifted Jaguar 001.
EV’s started making sense when I drove some modern sports cars, the throttle mapping and gear ratios convinced me that I’d rather drive something that doesn’t have to disobey my inputs for emissions/noise regs, even if it doesn’t make engine noises.
For now, I’m sticking with my quarter-century-old cable-throttle daily, but when turn-of-the-century cars start to get a bit too rare to commute in, and assuming mainstream manufacturers start to release competent single-motor 4-seaters under 3500lb, I’ll start looking forward to buying one used as a commuter so the fun car can be spared for good weather and road trips.
I had this same thought awhile back driving a newer BMW 3 series with the turbo 4 and 8 speed auto and it was quite speedy but souless, sounded like a vacuum cleaner with perfectly smooth but frequent shifts, though of course who could care about revving the motor out anyways. If this is the future of performance cars I’m ready for an EV. I’ll dearly miss the characterful manual transmission cars of the past but at this point most of the ICE cars coming out are so dull and compromised that they seem to be as anachronistically clinging to the past as EVs with fake engine noise.
Are you asking about my car-shopping endeavors or are you asking about what makes sense?
Just a reminder that trading a 30 mpg car driven 12,000 miles a year for a $50,000 EV would take more than 30 years to pay off, even if you got electricity for free.
Buying something new to save money on fuel is almost never a winner financially.
No, but if one is shopping anyway, it may be enough to swing the decision.
I don’t think the question focussed specifically on new EV purchasing.
The first topic is all about new EV sales, it’s not crazy to assume the question follows from that.
Reduce the numbers accordingly and the underlying logic is similar unless the EV purchase is extremely cheap.
I think if you are looking for a new car currently and comparing Ice/hybrid to an EV it makes sense if gas prices vs electric will play into it. Now just looking for a new car because of gas prices never makes sense.
Financial math is hard for many people. Generally, for many, it’s all about the monthly payment, not total outlay.
Recently, we did get rid of my lower MPG vehicle that was having some intermittent trans glitches for a newer car for my Wife…and I took over her older car, so I picked up about 80 more miles extra per similar fill up now, albeit, less HP on tap.
This comment should be pinned.
No it shouldn’t. Despite what many claim, I don’t think there’s near the number of people that want to go buy a new car to save money. I do think there are plenty of people that are buying a new car regardless, and thus compare the efficient new car to the less efficient new car.
I’m not thinking the number of people is zero, but rather that the original commenter is setting up false arguments for easy wins.
Plus, come on. If we really want to talk about frugality, get a bus pass and ride a bike. Oh, that doesn’t work for you? Buy a 20 year old Civic Hybrid.
What people want to does not invalidate the original comment at all.
In the same way that saying that car is more efficient than a crossover (when comparable of course) stands regardless.
Now, of course people can do whatever they want with their money. And they are free to buy a new car, don’t, take the bus or buy a Suburban if they wish.
The point is laying out math starkly.
If you’d prefer another example, perhaps more relevant, spending $40K on a 40 mpg hybrid vs $30K on a 30 mpg pure ICE car is a 25 year payback too ($4 gas, 12,000 miles a year).
Gas prices are extremely high impact emotionally, and relatively low impact financially.
Other stark math is that buying a new car is just a poor financial decision. $30k new ICE car!?!? Why not get a $10k used car that gets 25mpg! Stark math says it’ll take 31 years to justify the new car over the old one!
More seriously, what cars even fit your financial scenario above? A mid-trim RAV4 to a barebones Equinox? How many people actually compare those two? They are likely comparing $40k RAV4 to $37k Equinox and such.
That’s why trying to justify any of these as money saving decisions is foolish if not ridiculous.
Returning to the original question, “the math” on an EV is likely never going to make sense! But that’s the wrong question anyways, because buying a car shouldn’t be about “math”.
Just admit you’re buying something you like!
I can dig that. But I won’t blame someone comparing $60k Car A that gets 22mpg to $60k Car B that gets 2.4mi/kWh and then concluding that the perk of “saving” $120 per month in fuel is enough to push them towards Car B.
If incremental hybrid costs were that high you might have a point but in most cases they aren’t if you are going to compare like to like.
2026 Toyota Corolla LE — $23,125 — 37 mpg
2025 Toyota Corolla Hybrid LE — $24,975 — 50 mpg
The hybrid’s $1850 extra cost pays back in 66K miles
2026 Ford Maverick XLT AWD — $30,645 — 25 mpg
2026 Ford Maverick XLT AWD Hybrid – $32,865 — 37 mpg
The hybrid’s $2220 extra cost pays back in 43K miles
I found that the spirit of the question seems to be assuming you would be shopping anyway so at this point does the cost difference between the two types of vehicles now make more sense with the volatility of gas prices and the future outlook being… not as great.
Your logic isn’t something I can argue with but perhaps the underlying assumption isn’t accurate. Of course, it could be made more clear in the question but the first portion of the question asking about shopping in a more general sense led me to my own assumptions.
You’re not alone, I took the question the same way. “If you’re in the market, has the math changed for you?” Not “Are you in the market because of the running costs.”
Same.
I added another example above because it does seem like your way of interpreting the question is more popular than my initial one.
Either way, efficiency is a diminishing return, and even at $4/gallon, gas prices aren’t high enough compared to the cost of cars to sway a lot of purchase decisions from a pure financial perspective. Road warriors or people who can realistically downsize to a smaller class of vehicle may be exceptions.
I originally interpreted it the first way that you did, but people have criticized me for complaining about vague TMD questions.
Vaguely worded TMD questions generate more varied comments.