If you were betting on the F1 race in Las Vegas being a disaster then I’d consider now a good opportunity to double down on that wager. Last night’s first practice bled into chaos this morning as an errant manhole cover absolutely whacked a Ferrari and disrupted the whole event.
Oh, hello, your trusty Morning Dumper reporting here from the bottom bunk yet again (Jason is above, wearily attempting to squeeze out a Cold Start). We’ve got in-person trivia coming this weekend at the LA Auto Show, and most of the staff is passed out in other rooms, but expect a flurry of posts here in a couple of hours.
Besides F1 I suppose we should talk about unions and Tesla, a big Honda recall, and BrightDrop becoming part of GM.
Let’s do this thing.
What Happens In Vegas Does Not Stay In Vegas
I don't even blink at any of this. I once saw a track fixed with Tide. In the middle of the Daytona 500. After a jet dryer exploded on impact.
— Jenna Fryer (@JennaFryer) November 17, 2023
There are a lot of people seemingly rooting against the F1 race in Las Vegas this weekend. The locals are unhappy about traffic and overall displacement. Some fans see this as yet another expensive event they’ll never be able to attend. And some fans just don’t like new things.
This almost shoves me into the pro camp. We had a drought of F1 racing in the United States and now we get to enjoy three races on our home turf. That’s great. Also, as we learned from the Chicago Street Race, new events (especially on street circuits) always seem to be heading for disaster before eventually turning out great. It’s like in the theater, where a bad dress rehearsal always means a great show.
Well, F1 got its bad dress rehearsal last night/this morning. After staving off a looming strike and a massive drop in ticket prices, all things seemed calmer and cooler as Free Practice 1 began. Then this happened:
Here’s the moment Carlos Sainz drove over THAT drain cover ????#F1 #LasVegasGPpic.twitter.com/zBrjpPVgJH
— Autosport (@autosport) November 17, 2023
That’s right. Ferrari driver Carlos Sainz found a manhole cover that seems to have been sucked up by all the force of the F1 cars and absolutely destroyed his Ferrari. This led to a pissed-off Ferrari complaining that the mistake is going to cost them a fortune (and a penalty).
Here’s ESPN on why this is bad:
It is a nightmare start to F1’s controversial race. The sport has spent $500 million on it in a rare deal that sees it be the promoter of the event.
Having annoyed locals through the construction of the circuit, it is one of the worst outcomes F1 could have had.
Even worse, the first track action of the race ended after a few minutes and sent the fans wondering what the hell was going to happen. F1 officials had to go to every cover on the 1.3-mile circuit and fasten the covers with quick-setting concrete. By the time that was done, it was so late that the track then had to boot all the fans for “logistical reasons” and eventually finish around 4 am so some of the roads could be reopened to commuters.
This seems bad and it is bad, but I appreciate long-time AP reporter Jenna Fryer’s take on it above. Things can always be worse.
Tesla’s Union Battles Continue
The simmering conflict between Tesla and organized labor is heating up on both sides of the Atlantic as Union Summer bleeds into Union Winter.
In the United States, Tesla scored a victory with an appeals court this week, overturning a National Labor Relations Board ruling over the banning of t-shirts with pro-union messaging.
Specifically, Tesla required workers to don “team wear” shirts instead, which the company said better protected the paint of new vehicles.
From the AP:
The 5th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals threw out a 3-2 decision issued last year by the National Labor Relations Board, which had said Tesla couldn’t prohibit union attire. The court opinion noted that Tesla allowed workers to affix “any number or size” of pro-union stickers to company-issued clothing.
“We may have concluded differently had Tesla prohibited union insignia,” read the opinion issued Tuesday by a unanimous panel of three 5th Circuit judges.
Seems reasonable. And how are things going in Europe? Well, Swedish dockworkers are refusing to unload cars. There’s a whole Reuters report on the showdown between Sweden’s industrial union and the company, but this seems ominous:
In addition to dockworkers, unionised cleaners are refusing to clean Tesla buildings and postal workers have stopped delivering mail.
On Friday, electricians stopped service and repair work for Tesla, including at its charging stations across Sweden.
Swedish workers are also supported by Norway’s Fellesforbundet, the biggest union in the country’s LO confederation.
Action against Tesla in Sweden is due to escalate further – if no agreement is reached – on Nov. 24 when about 50 unionised workers at Hydro Extrusions, a subsidiary of Norwegian aluminium and energy company Hydro (NHY.OL), will stop work on Tesla car products.
This is one to watch.
Honda Recalls Around 250,000 Vehicles Over Seizing Engines
Honda (and Acura) is recalling around a quarter-million vehicles over a potentially serious production flaw that can cause engines in some of its most popular products to seize.
From the NHTSA safety report:
During production of the crankshaft, due to improper settings of equipment used to manufacture the engine crankshaft, the crank pin was improperly ground, resulting in crank pins with a crown or convex shape that are out of specification.
If the connecting rod bearing seizes, the engine can be damaged and run improperly, stall, stop while driving, and/or not start, increasing the risk of a fire, crash or injury.
Not great, Bob. To date, Honda has had to service at least 1,400 cars with this issue, so it’s not rare.
The recall covers certain 2016 and 2018-19 Honda Pilot, 2017 and 2019 Ridgeline and 2018-19 Odyssey vehicles. It also covers two models from the Japanese automaker’s luxury brand, Acura: the 2015-20 TLX and 2016-20 MDX.
Only models with V-6 engines produced in the U.S. are affected, Honda spokesperson Chris Martin told Automotive News. About 30,000 vehicles are affected in Canada and Mexico, he said.
If you have one of these vehicles you should be notified soon so you can have your engine repaired and, possibly, replaced if there’s a sign of a serious issue.
BrightDrop Becomes Part Of GM
One of the brightest parts of GM’s electrification experiment has been its fleet of BrightDrop delivery vans. Since it’s a wholly GM-created and owned company I just assumed it was part of GM. I guess that’s not the case?
I’ll let The Detroit News explain:
BrightDrop was born from GM’s Innovation Lab and was a wholly owned subsidiary for the last three years. In that time, BrightDrop produced a product portfolio of electric vans for customers like FedEx and Ryder using the “agility and innovation of a tech startup” with access to “GM’s deep manufacturing expertise,” the company said.
“As BrightDrop has matured, we are now bringing that ethos back to GM so our work is more efficient and so BrightDrop’s startup spirit can help fuel further success with GM’s commercial customers,” GM said in a statement.
I’m not sure I 100% understand this, but it basically sounds like BrightDrop is going to become more integrated into GM and everyone there is going to become a GM employee.
The Big Question
Are you hoping the F1 race in Vegas is a success or are you Team Chaos?
Lead Image: Aston Martin
I don’t want to see any business venture concerning racing fail, so I wish them luck. Sylvester Stallone warned them about the manhole cover problem years ago.
I’m Team Successful Chaos.
I want F1 to grow in the US, but Vegas GP does not appear to be the way to go about it. I don’t specifically WANT to cheer for failure/chaos, but I believe it to be the inevitable outcome.
I too thought that BrightDrop was already part of GM. I haven’t been inside one, but I do see the Fedex ones around LA regularly (but have yet to see a single Amazon by Rivian EV van, though I never go to the west side if I can avoid it… they’re out there maybe). I really like these EV delivery vans for whatever reason, and I think I’d enjoy using one as a daily driver (a short wheelbase one, so parking wouldn’t be entirely a PITA) but of course, they’re too expensive (as expected) what with the Rivian van costing more than the Rivian pickup or SUV.
Come to east coast, the local Amazon hub here has over 50 of them
“The court opinion noted that Tesla allowed workers to affix “any number or size” of pro-union stickers to company-issued clothing.”
Does an iron on decal count as a “sticker”?
Considering the justification for team wear was the flimsy paint excuse, I’d think iron-on would be less likely to cause damage than normal stickers, so one would think so. Of course, what common sense dictates and what actually happens are often different.
Time for some militant, pro union iron -ons then!
Forget it Jake, it’s the 5th Circuit.
Team success, why have it fail? I’d rather see it there than not there. But, loose personhole covers is butch league shit. Why are they not tack welded shut????? Quick set concrete is a better solution??????
They are welded shut. They’re saying the housing itself lifted up, not just the lid. It’s not a manhole, it’s a water valve access. Maybe 8-10 inches in diameter.
Thank you for clarifying, that makes more sense now. If that was my race team, I’d charge full price + 40% to replace all those now broken parts.
For real. Has to be in the 6 or 7 figures for repairs.
I wonder if anyone warned their superiors of this issue before the fact, and was overruled by someone who gets paid more money than they do…
If we can’t ban auto racing in the name of not wasting fuel and unnecessarily polluting the planet with tire particles, can we at least agree to stop calling it a ‘sport’?
I’m with you on needing to watch our waste and emissions. But I think it’s definitely a sport.
“an activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others for entertainment”
Sounds like racing to me. If you don’t think it involves physical exertion or skill to drive a racecar, you should drive a racecar.
As much as golf is a sport I suppose.
I’d argue it’s more of a sport than golf, but not that hard because it’s kind of a silly argument either way.
Pro golfers are driving distances on average in the 300’s. It requires exceptional physical abilities.
Being good at golf requires a ton of skill if not traditional athletic prowess. I don’t even like golf and would still call it a sport. If curling is an Olympic sport then golf is a sport.
Golf is an Olympic sport too.
https://olympics.com/en/sports/
So is flag football…lol
I’m waiting for video sports to join that list and see the Olympic village filled with pudgy basement dwellers.
They are already on the way…
https://olympics.com/ioc/news/ioc-announces-olympic-esports-series-2023
And that kids is how the Olympics jumped the shark.
(Come to think of it why ISN’T shark jumping on that list?!)
The e-lympics?
Oh man, they aren’t the nerds of yore, they’re doing strict diet and fitness regimes to ensure they can compete at the bleeding edge of the games. Even high end chess players are doing serious diet and fitness stuff because their brains can function better when they’re in peak physical condition.
They still dwell in basements though, right?
Does this mean yes, acktually COD players ARE as talented and physically fit as their real world counterparts too?
Curling is incredibly technical. I did a class with coworkers and it changed my opinion completely.
And golf is one of the most technically difficult sports. Maybe only surpassed by skateboarding.
I have been curling once. The muscles that it works sliding and sweeping across that ice are ones that you NEVER use in daily life. I didn’t feel exhausted at the end of the match but I was sore all over the next day.
And couch surfing.
Global motorsport emissions is probably less than a single cargo ship carrying your kids Christmas presents here from China.
yeah but cargo ships are generally needed for day to day life. f1 races that cost thousands of dollars to attend and take place past midnight for the majority of the country are completely unnecessary.
one could also make the case that a shipload of chinese made christmas present shovelware isn’t needed for day to day life either.
no shit, that’s why I said ‘generally.’ like it or not, lots of very necessary things for everyday life get here via cargo ship.
Kids, this is why you need to stay in school and not do drugs.
School, sure. Let’s not get too hasty about the drugs part, eh?
Hell, I give my own kid drugs just so he can do better in school
Adderall is a Hell of a drug.
Fair enough.
Ok, but are hot dogs sandwiches?
Yes.
Next question.
No. A sandwich has two pieces of bread. A hot dog bun is technically one piece of bread with a hinge.
My wife’s favorite sandwich is an open faced tuna melt. Just one slice of bread.
That’s properly called a tartine
-checks username-
Hard to argue with someone who is clearly an expert.
“Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports … all others are games little boys play.” – Dear Lord Baby Jesus
I remember when the first gas “shortage” hit in the early 70s and there were cries to ban auto racing and Bill France pointed out how minimal the petroleum use was for Nascar vs the airplane rides of sports like baseball and football.
The rich using their private planes to fly to the event will use far more fuel. And it’s definitely a sport. You know how difficult it is to drive a race car for hours at a time? The drivers have to be in great shape to compete.
Seems like a really big thing to close down all of the touristy Vegas area for one sport, namely one that is not all that dominant, but I imagine it is above my understanding. Sportsball winning cities also shut down for parades after a big superbowl win, that seems off to me too.
They’re about to build a baseball stadium on the Strip for the Athletics where the Tropicana is, so in a few years F1 won’t be the only sport clogging the area with traffic.
T-Mobile arena (LV Knights) is just behind the New York New York and the Raiders play just across I-15 from the strip. So, there are already two major pro teams right there. There is always sports traffic in town. Putting an MLB team there isn’t gonna make that much of a difference.
I meant Las Vegas Blvd specifically, as the stadiums you mention aren’t directly on the Strip like the A’s stadium will be, but fair point.
FYI traffic in LV is not really that bad for the amount of people there. The strip can be bad.
Championship parades typically are a huge boon for the winning city. It’s a major sales bump for all the restaurants/stores for that day. Particularly for cities where the arena is located farther away from the parade route. Sportsball it all you want, but a parade is a net benefit.
The restaurants/store near me actually complained greatly about the lack of foot traffic as the parade goers were not there to shop and the shoppers were unable to get tot he shops.
In an exclusive interview with Martin Brundle, Charissa Thompson reports that Brundle has named Carrot Top as the reason for the F1 track issues due to a prop-building mishap at his subterranean laboratory.
Turns out Brundle mistook Seth Green for Carrot Top. Between that and Thompson’s reputation, I don’t know what to believe anymore.
They haven’t committed a war crime and/or human rights abuse! In the grand scheme of Formula One, that’s pretty good.
Gee, IndyCar has been welding manhole covers shut for like 40 years.
Is IndyCar smarter than F1?
Sure looks that way.
IndyCar’s main objective currently seems to be producing good racing; F1’s seems to be maintaining an elite club. So given that, I guess I’m not too surprised this slipped through.
The issue wasn’t that the cover wasn’t welded down, but that the aero load from the ground effects pulled an entire water valve cover and frame out of the concrete it was set in. Not a full size manhole cover like the craziness in Baku.
Portland cement doesn’t bond to cast iron very well. Welding is much more effective.
I find the years for the Honda engine recall to be interesting. There are skipped years for certain models but then the issue reappears. 2017 Pilots are good, but Ridgelines have the issue. Like a manufacturing gemling moved from one model to the other throughout the years.
Maybe its following this one guy moving from department to department.
Maternity/paternity leave?
With the level of automation these days, it could be that the out-of-spec machine was only used for certain batches of parts over the years and no one was checking the settings/output.
I still think it’s lame to have F1 in the Miami (not actually in Miami) Dolphins parking lot, and incredibly lame in Vegas. I think instead one race should be at Indy, one at COTA, and the other at Watkins Glenn (yes I’m aware of the updates it would need to be Class 1)
You mean like how the Miami track went right by the water? I mean, the giant sticker of water with a couple of plastic boats and a fake harbor.
Minor correction for you: those were real boats, they were just sitting on their trailers concealed under the “water”. Many of them were for sale and people could pay to be on them to watch the race.
Good point. I feel like that’s worse. Pay exorbitant amounts to be surrounded by fake water on a real boat, provided by a company that wants to sell you that boat for even more money.
Hey, some people buy a t-shirt as a souvenir, some people buy a boat. Don’t wealth-shame!!!
Wow, had no idea. I do remember seeing people on them now that you mention it, and wondered what they were thinking of the whole thing.
It’s a good strategy to attract all-cash buyers considering the demos of a US F1 race.
Watkins Glen is in the middle of nowhere. It’s a lovely facility, though. The issue is that the closest areas that even faintly resemble what modern F1 considers civilized are Rochester or Syracuse. Both are a 90 minute drive away without traffic. On race weekends the main route in town is a traffic jam. F1 would make those jams seem quick. The town itself? Despite having an awesome hole in the wall pizzeria attached to an equally awesome Italian restaurant, the town has nothing to offer that crowd. It’s fine for PCA and SCCA racers, but there’s not much to do there besides boating, hiking, drinking the excellent (and some not so excellent) local wine and of course racing.
Problem with venues like that is all you get is motorsport enthusiasts willing to make the trek to the middle of nowhere to watch racing. F1 would rather attract thousands of rich people who couldn’t care less about F1 and just want to have a very expensive party.
In other words, rich people ruined F1 too?
The problem with every for profit company ever created, is they go where the money is. It’s the same reason auto mfgs could give a shit less about enthusiasts.
Gah, the Miami autocross is the height of lame.
I wish Miami, LV and a bunch of sportswashing dictatorships’ races ought to be taken off the calendar to allow teams some damn breathing room and maybe space for some beloved historic dedicated circuits to come back in the mix.
Teams are made up of people with friends and families back home, and this stupid push to add more races is unnecessarily brutal on them. And for what? To give Crown Prince Bonesaw undeserved positive clout, and a parking lot some fake water? Get your damn schedule in order and be kinder to your teams, F1. They’re the real reason any of these races can actually happen.
Don’t they go around and spot weld all the manhole covers down?
I’m no racing expert but I thought that was like step#1 for a road course.
What the hell are they doing with concrete? Tack weld the lid to the frame then come back and grind them off. Are the entire frames being sucked out of the ground? Some weird stuff going on down there.
Yes it sucked up the whole frame along with the welded cover.
ha, well, that’s messed up.
Ferrari’s really grounded to the ground.
If only Toyota had manufactured the cover.
Shut up,
WesleyData.There is plenty of open space in Nevada for F1 to set up a pop-up track. They don’t have to disrupt the Vegas strip and piss everybody off. 3/4 of the state’s population lives in Vegas, so that leaves a LOT of space elsewhere in Nevada to race. F1 has the money to do it, and non-Vegas Nevada is probably easier to bribe, not as many people to bribe, and less money per bribe too lol
Tesla’s Fremont factory used to be GM and UAW, so the fact that it’s so hard for them to organize it says something about the union, doesn’t it?
Norway is one of the biggest EV markets, so the Swedish strike is more significant than it sounds.
With respect, you’re kinda missing the point. Factually, you’re correct in that Nevada has enough open land to hold 100 F1 events simultaneously. The appeal to a race in Las Vegas is the race is through the city streets, like Monaco. Holding the race at night will make for spectacular TV images. The casino area during daylight is, to me, depressing and hideous. An F1 race on open land would make for great spectator sightlines but F1 doesn’t care about that.
It’s happening on the strip? If that’s the case it’s kinda asinine that they would be getting pissed off. IMO moving to Vegas and complaining about events is like moving near a racetrack or airport and then complaining about noise.
For people who have lived there since before it was a destination city, OK, but it’s stuff like this that keeps the city going. Without being an absolute zoo there would be no reason to live in Vegas in the first place.
Someone feel free to tell me I’m wrong, I’m having a hard time seeing the issue.
it’s the difference between a pop-up street track in Jersey City and, say, midtown Manhattan, for example.
In my little mind at least, the difference between that and this is that the Strip itself is an attraction, and not a single (local) person who uses it is there for any other reason than to support the entertainment industry. The same forces that brought the F1 race also employ these people.
The issue is that Vegas exists because it is made to attract this sort of thing. Why would you live in Vegas if you weren’t open to this kind of thing. I can’t think of a single reason. Sure, there are definitely some locals who have ancestry from the area but they are likely small in number (in this specific area of Vegas) and also I would think they would have other issues with the place.
Heck, if this were literally anywhere in the entire US other than the Vegas strip I would understand the complaints.
Please note: I have never been there so I could be making some incredibly wrong assumptions. I just have little patience for NIMBY people who put themselves in a situation and are trying to get rid of the situation rather than just taking themselves back out of it.
It is almost like F1 is looking for any and every excuse to never come back to America.
The Andretti Cadillac fiasco is sure to help.
So Brightdrop operated with speed and efficiency so they are going to suck it back into GM and smother it; like Saturn.
Dulldrop 😛
Once again GM is deluded into thinking the rest of the company will learn something from a successful subsidiary.
OT: every time I see the new(ish) GM logo, it reads ‘gum’ to me. Am I the only one that sees that?
Classic GM.
There’s some sensationalism here, as the “manhole cover” was like a 6″ diameter maintenance hole cover. When I first heard about this I thought a giant 24″ cover got sucked up.
I’m divided on my opinion of F1 in Vegas. As a Southern Californian I’ve been going to Vegas regularly for work or play for the last 20 years and wanted the event to be a success for them. But hearing the games the F1 promoters have been playing with the city and businesses on the strip has given me the impression they’re getting greedy and it’s been interesting seeing stories of ticket prices falling at the last minute.
Then I actually visited Vegas last weekend, and seeing the chaos that the track building has caused on the Strip has me almost rooting for it to fail. Walking the Strip felt like being in a prison yard, and every cabbie/Uber driver I talked to can’t wait for it to be over.
It was a water valve box cover. These are used for valves that are not inside a valve vault.
Yep. Last I checked, a manhole will actually, you know, fit a man.
That cover nearly touched a man at speed, though. Punched right through the bottom of Sainz’s cockpit.
I’m so mad that Sainz got a penalty for something that was totally out of his control. It’s on the organizers to make a safe venue that’s up to handle F1 cars. Teams compete on the assumption that that’s the case. Sainz couldn’t compete at all without extensive repairs for something that was not his fault. Just maddening.
I’m not denying any of that, just saying that an actual manhole cover is like 4x the diameter and probably as many times heavy as the cover that Sainz hit, so sucking up one of those with a car would likely cause way more damage. Words matter, especially if you’re a journalist.
I agree that penalizing Sainz in this case is total bullshit.
Oh yeah, fair fair. (I admit I called it a manhole before someone else pointed out that wait, that’s not actually a manhole.)
I think they may be called utility access covers
Well yeah but that applies to a million different things. Telecoms use fiberglass hand vaults with covers. Every storm and sanitary structure/manhole has a cast iron lid or grate. Electrical vaults often use bolted-down steel plates.
But these, at 6″ and cast iron, are most likely water valves. You pop off the lid, insert a key, and you can close it to isolate a section of the main for repair.
Team chaos, baby. I’ve never been particularly fond of Formula 1 due to what a shameless display of wealth and excess it is. To me it’s more or less a bunch of 1%ers playing with their extremely expensive toys and waving their dicks around. I’ll never forget the sob story about a driver (I think it was Sainz?) having his multi million dollar watch stolen. Cry me a fucking river.
The Vegas race has taken all of this shit and cranked it to 11. It’s a microcosm of everything I dislike about the sport…and it’s been a huge pain for the locals, tickets are so exorbitantly expensive that regular ass folks can’t go, they’ve blacked out every potential free view of the race to keep the riff raff out, the list is long.
It’s bullshit and I’d rather head down to a local drag strip or track attack day to watch regular people like me push the cars that they likely daily drive to the limit. That’s way more fun to me than a rich person dick measuring contest. Cars and racing should be for everyone, not just the ultra wealthy.
Well put. For me, F1 is increasingly a contest of technology first and foremost, and while I respect that for what it is, I’m more interested in the human side of the racing equation, so lower-end (or at least more balanced) racing is much more appealing, to me anyway.
I really like IndyCar right now, as it hits that sweet spot in a lot of ways. And perhaps most of all, its vibe is unconsciously of another era – a focus on the racing and the skill involved, with less of the (manufactured or real) personality drama and tech-for-tech’s sake.
And I figure it’s not long before F1 drivers are replaced by AIs anyway…it’s the rational next step.
I’m with you, I don’t really care for F1 or even most motorsports that are so pay-to-play.
But at the same time, I don’t really understand this issue:
“it’s been a huge pain for the locals”
Where do the people of Vegas think they live? This isn’t some quiet town in the middle of nowhere, this is a town focused around entertainment and events (in the middle of nowhere. Ha.)
Somewhere else I used the analogy of moving to Vegas and complaining about events being like moving near an airport or racetrack and complaining about the noise. But honestly it’s probably more like moving near an airport to work at said airport and then complaining about the noise.
As a local I mostly just avoided the strip (as is tradition) I think the complaint is mainly coming from two sources:
Small businesses off strip not benefitting from F1 but are losing customers to construction.
Workers stuck in traffic because of poor construction planning
Team Chaos—-with caveats
I don’t care for Vegas’ zeitgeist, so I relish stuff like the locusts awhile back. But I’m not evil: don’t want to see anyone hurt or not be able to make a living. Outside that, bring on the Bad Craziness
Fear and Loathing. It’s Vegas after all.
This race would make a worthy sequel. Nobody would have what it takes to go full Gonzo on it though.
I’m not sure I’m up for full Gonzo anyway.
The older I get, the less the reality of speeding through the desert in an open convertible with a head full of acid and cocaine and ether and—-where the hell would I get ahold of poppers anyway?—-appeals
As far as cities to disrupt with races, I would think Vegas is a good choice. It’s already full of noise, lights, and activity. It’s in the desert. It’s a destination city.
But I definitely don’t know much about this race being there or the extent of how it affects people. It’s hard to root for F1 races at this point, given the high ticket prices. If the people affected are upset by it, I’m probably a lot more willing to side with chaos than F1.
As it stands, without knowing more, I am team chaos, but not particularly invested in it.
I think the ridiculous prices are a US (street race only?) thing.
I was listening to an F1 podcast where a FL resident flew to Europe for two+ weeks, attended two F1 races and still saved money over just admission to the Miami GP.
That’s true. The Vegas race is the most expensive, and I think Miami is second. It’s not entirely clear why they’ve decided to make those races the most expensive, but there are certainly far more affordable races out there.
Maybe stands full of celebrities are worth more to them than stands full of fans?
I assume they have some sort of plan with the admission prices being so drastically different from European races.
The middle class is dying. This is why New York is drowning in vacant luxury apartments while people who make $80K have to live with roommates.
While I understand the desire to have the race go down the strip for the flashiness of it, they should just build a dedicated F1 track in Vegas if they want it to be a thing.
Especially if they’re going to all the trouble of stopping people from having any view if they haven’t bought an expensive ticket. Just build it out in the desert where you can control the view without all the trouble.
Exactly. Point the monorail you don’t even use anymore at the track while you’re at it.
I like the idea of F1, the execution is terrible. Blacked out windows in hotels and one way glass on bridges.
This is how I find myself feeling about it. The idea of F1 in Vegas seemed awesome when they announced it, but it seems like the execution has been the worst possible scenario.
I don’t understand the idea of showcasing a race to a mostly new audience in the US and then pricing out people who might be curious.
I’ve been to the Indy 500 once, but never F1. I’d have taken a shot if tickets with good views could be had for a couple hundred bucks. Instead, I can take my entire family to an NFL game, an NBA game, and an MLB game for the ~$2500 cost of a single ticket with a view.
Taking an initial loss to build an audience is a tried and true method. Instead the experience is priced such that only super fans will pony up. How is that improving F1’s American prospects?
Yup, I’m somewhat new to F1, would love to go to a race, looked at the Vegas pricing and noped out. Austin is close so I may go there next year, though Mexico City looks to be best bang for the buck.
What makes it more inexplicable to me is it’s a road course covering a large area.
It’s in the city with the most hotel rooms of any in the world.
You could sell hundreds of thousands of tickets along the entire course if you were so inclined. They are only reporting 20-30,000 grandstand tickets sold. Why the exclusivity?
F1 was started by ultra rich playboys, for ultra rich playboys.
It has ALWAYS been about big wealth flexin’ and excluding the plebs. Why people would expect a change in tack now, I can’t follow the logic.
Because there has been some worry about F1 dwindling, so it was thought they’d be trying to bilk a larger audience out of money. You can still have the expensive seats to separate the wealthy from all us poors, but make it a bit more affordable.
Also, I believe the Vegas tickets are even expensive by F1 standards.
My parents used to go to Anderstorp in the seventies. The tickets were a pittance and they’d spend three days living in a tent for a nominal fee, eating food they bought in grocery stores. Similar stories abound from Silverstone, Watkins Glen, Le Mans, and elsewhere. Only Monaco was always crazy expensive; sucks that this is the experience they are trying to make universal.
Yes, it was ultra rich playboys, but they wanted the hoi polloi to watch them flex. I think that was ok.
When F1 ran in Indianapolis, they used to commute from Chicago via helicopter because there were no hotels exclusive enough….
It seems like a terrible place to watch a race in-person. I’m going to enjoy watching the replay of this one from the comfort of my home.
I did say replay, because I am not going to want to watch this live on Eastern time.
I love Vegas, usually travel there several times a year, and am open to the idea of watching a race in person even though I don’t follow the sport or watch on TV.
I’m the ideal person they should have been targeting, and they blew it.
I watched a ride-through of the track. It seemed narrow and walled-off. I will wait and see where the fans sit and what they can see, but I don’t think you’re going to be able to see much of the action because of the barriers.
Dedicated race tracks have runoff areas without walls in a lot of places, so you can see a lot more from the stands.
I’m OK with Vegas. Not a huge fan but I think it’s a great location for an F1 track since you can easily and cheaply get there from almost anywhere.
I am a huge fan of Miami and go there quite a bit. I’m also not tempted to go to the race there for the same reason. Stuck in pens in the Florida heat for the chance to see some of a car once a lap couldn’t justify the cost for me. I’ll admit that if the tickets were cheap I’d probably give it a try at least once.
Similar case here—new race, friends in town who offered a couch to crash on, an actual street circuit that isn’t a glorified autocross—all signs pointed to saving my hoarded airline miles for a long weekend of “why not?” I’m no high roller by any means—still mostly unemployed!—but screw it, F1 with friends is a good time.
Then pricing for tickets dropped and I nearly laughed my face off. Heavens, no.
Yep, I’m totally in that bucket. Admittedly I never followed F1 much over the years and like many Americans just started getting into it thanks to the Netflix series. If ticket prices weren’t insane I’d love to actually check it out – in fact I was just in Vegas last weekend – but as soon as I saw the prices it was a bit fat nope.
This is where I’m at. I’m happy F1 is back in the USA, but I don’t understand their desire to intentionally limit building a new audience. People visit Vegas for all sorts of reasons, so price it in a way where you catch people who may be there for other reasons as well as those who can justify flying in just for it. I’ve been a casual follower of F1 for decades, and I’d love to watch a race in person, but at their current pricing levels I will remain a casual follower for years to come.
Same. I’ll watch it on tv if nothing else is on, but I’m not religious about it, and I’m certainly not going to spend that kind of money (ticket + all the other stuff that’s in effect mandatory) to see it live. I’d rather go to my local dirt track and watch the regional racing.
Maybe they make more money on ‘average’ fans when they watch from home.
Attendees increase costs to run the event, and there’s probably a point where you can calculate that the $75 tickets cost you more in staffing, portable toilets and security than you’re making from those attendees.
Also, exclusive events draw ‘influencers.’ They may be intentionally providing poor-free safe spaces for instatok people.
“I don’t understand the idea of showcasing a race to a mostly new audience in the US and then pricing out people who might be curious.”
Nail on the head right here. Vegas had no reason to charge that much for what it’s offering: a race of unproven quality with a still-growing regional fanbase with no support races at a wildly inconvenient time.
If anything, the lack of support races and stupid late-night scheduling should’ve discounted tickets.
The best F1 races are Successful Chaos.