It’s been one of those days and I’m starting The Morning Dump at 11:42 AM. Technically, it’s still morning. It won’t be morning by the time you read this because even I’m not that fast. You know who is fast, though? Policymakers in the United States, who keep changing the rules on tariffs.
For a company like Nissan, this is super annoying. While Nissan builds vehicles in the United States, it doesn’t think it can build a sub-$30k vehicle here, so it makes those cars in Mexico. There’s essentially a 25% tariff on those vehicles, meaning it’s cheaper to build something in a place like South Korea. Is that fair?
If you thought the original round of tariffs was unfair, you’re not alone. After the Supreme Court ruled that the certain tariffs were unconstitutional, a bunch of companies lined up for refunds. Some of those refunds will be going to hedge funds.
For all the crap Stellantis takes, it’s at least finding a way to bring sales up in what was a tough quarter for most. In fact, Stellantis might be the only large automaker that did better in every market. Even China! It’s a tough place to sell cars these days, and Ford CEO Jim Farley doesn’t want to import that market stateside.
‘It Is Not Feasible’ To Move Cheapest Cars To The US Says Nissan CEO
I finally drove the new Nissan Kicks and, eventually, I’ll tell you about it in detail. It was good, although the high trim version I drove seemed a little expensive. That’s not a coincidence. With a 25% tariff on the Kicks, the company basically can’t make money on the vehicle if it can’t charge a lot for it, according to the company.
This is a strange quirk of the tariffs. The original stated goal was to have “90 deals in 90 days.” It’s been a year and there aren’t 90 deals and, in many cases, the deals that do exist aren’t fully signed or ratified. This means that automakers who build cars in countries that do have a mostly agreed upon or signed deal, like Japan and South Korea, save money relative to places like Mexico.
As with everything trade-related, this isn’t universal. The United States-Mexico-Canada Agreement (USMCA) is still in place, and vehicles that follow those rules are exempt. Well, the content of those cars that is USMCA-complaint is exempt from the newer 25% tariff. This is why Audi got hosed, because the Q5s they were building in Mexico were mostly non-USMCA complaint, with a lot of parts from Europe.
This is what Nissan is complaining about in this Automotive News article as the company’s leaders complain about trying to sell Sentras and Kicks:
“These two products are sourced from Mexico because of the affordability requirements of the segment,” CEO Ivan Espinosa told Automotive News at a media event here.
“At the moment, it’s not feasible to move them to the U.S.,” he said. “We need to continue working on the cost competitiveness.”
Espinosa isn’t the only one who takes issue with this. From the story:
The Trump administration’s 25 percent tariff on imports from Mexico is “unfair,” particularly compared with the 15 percent charged on vehicles from Europe and South Korea, Nissan Americas Chairman Christian Meunier said.
“A 10 to 15 percent tariff is manageable, but 25 percent is not sustainable long term,” Meunier said.
Because few companies make a truly affordable car in the United States anymore, it’s hard to argue that we aren’t just raising the cost of these lower-priced vehicles. However, both Toyota and Honda have found a way to make some Corollas and Civics here, so it’s not entirely impossible.
Nissan’s plans involve increasing the amount of US-sourced parts in the Sentra and Kicks, which does point to the original goal of the White House being somewhat fulfilled. The other big part of the plan, reportedly, is to sell higher trims (Trimflation), which counters the White House’s other goal of making cars more affordable.
Hedge Funds Might Be Getting Your Tariff Refund
When the Supreme Court overturned certain tariffs, numerous companies had already filed lawsuits so they’d be first in line to get refunds. Not everyone can wait for all the capital they lost, which is an opportunity for hedge funds that want to buy those refunds at a discount.
“The Supreme Court decision unlocked the market,” said Wes Harrell, a managing director at Seaport Global, which connects hedge funds with importers holding tariff claims.
“I think ultimately we’ll see more folks come in as a result of higher inflation around input costs and what that’s doing to liquidity concerns,” Harrell said.
Tariff refunds were selling at 20 to 40 cents on the dollar before the Supreme Court’s ruling. But prices have since skyrocketed with major brands taking legal action to get their money back.
Larger claims with high-quality sellers are going for up to 70 cents on the dollar, Harrell said. “The past month or so has been importers getting their ducks in a row, talking to trade counsel, determining how best to protect their rights in this litigation and in the refund process.”
Will you see any of that money? Probably not.
Stellantis Saw A Lift In Every Market
While Stellantis has been able to boost North American sales with the addition of the Hemi V8 back to the Ram 1500 (where it belongs), that’s not going to work in Belgium. It turns out that Stellantis, which was near the bottom a year ago, has managed to find ways to sell cars everywhere. Is there any automaker that has improved its sales in every market? Not that I can think of.
As a whole, the company was up about 12% in Q1, including a 17% rise in North America and a 15% rise in Asia Pacific. The company even did well in Europe, as it explains:
In Enlarged Europe, Q1 shipments increased by approximately 69 thousand units, up 12% y-o-y. LCV volumes were stable at approximately 135 thousand units. Passenger car volume growth was driven by new launches. FIAT, Opel/Vauxhall and Citroën brands shipments benefited from the performance of Smart Car platform nameplates (Citroën C3, C3 Aircross, Opel/Vauxhall Frontera, Fiat Grande Panda) which increased by approximately 48 thousand units, or 85% y-o-y. Leapmotor-branded vehicles gained commercial momentum, with shipments increasing by 22 thousand units to approximately 27 thousand units; supported by the success of the T03, in the BEV entry-price segment across Europe, particularly in Italy.
I had an enlarged Europe once, but a doctor gave me a pill and it went back to normal size.
‘We Should Not Let Them Into Our Country’
Ford CEO Jim Farley may have loved his SU7, but he doesn’t think Chinese automakers should be able to sell cars here. The CEO went on Fox News and basically said it would be a bad outcome if that happened.
From that interview, via InsideEVs:
Ford CEO Jim Farley loves driving Chinese EVs, but he’s also clearly worried about what could happen if they could more easily enter the U.S. market. In a recent interview with Fox News, the CEO said Chinese EVs shouldn’t be allowed on U.S. streets due to the “devastating” impact they would have on the auto industry.
“We should not let them into our country,” he said. “Manufacturing is the heart and soul of our country. For us to lose that to those exports would be devastating for our country.”
This will keep coming up, and it’s approximately correct to say that more so than pretty much anywhere, China has subsidized its industry in a way that makes it an all-consuming beast. That being said, American companies could benefit from competition with world-class EVs. It just ain’t gonna happen here anytime soon.
What I’m Listening To While Writing TMD
You can’t do TMD in 45 minutes without some power, so I turned to The Stooges and “I Want to Be Your Dog.” That’s such a great riff.
The Big Question
What are some of the best American-made affordable cars and why are they the Pontiac Vibe?
Top graphic images: Nissan
Fixed that.
How about just buying that Chinese company, and move production here? Sure, it will cost you some money, but that is a sacrifice I’m willing to make.
Pontiac Vibe (and Canadian Twin Toyota Matrix) are that perfect size, seats five with luggage (did that once on a trip to LAX), the slide-stuff-in-hatch area — no lip, so easy in and out), the length inside allows long thin stuff like 8ft fluorescent tubes both from Home Depot and then to the toxic waste dump, or in my case a 6-foot-tall wine refrigerator, and if you wanted a little more power and a manual, the high-compression 2zz was available for the first few years.
Oh, and they last seemingly forever. I still see 2003 and 2004 models on the road.
Would China even allow the sale of a giant Chinese company to an American company?
Probably not. Everyone has their price, though.
Yeah it seems it would be very similar to a Japan situation ala Microslop trying to buy Nintendo back around the turn of the century before they started Xbox.
The Chinese are good capitalists, we taught them (literally in American universities) well. Many people don’t realize that members of their politburo are the very rich elite of the country. You can see the similarities to US political structure. Offer enough money, as to not make them lose face or look like bad ‘communists’ to the common people, and they will acquiesce.
Not sure the Chinese Government would sell the Chinese car companies or if we could afford all of the different companies they have
Maybe we could trade them Buick?
China has over 100 automobile manufacturers, and the Chinese government has expressed a desire to get rid of some of them.
In 1920, the number of American automobile manufacturers had dropped to roughly 93, down from over 250 around 1908, so they can see what’s happening.
So true. I have a friend who bought a used Vibe with 250k miles on it and he put another ~100k miles on it (exact figure unknown, since the odometer stopped at 299,999). He sold it and for all we know, it’s still running today.
Protectionism only goes so far. Eventually industry has to catch up with the rest of the world. Otherwise you get strange bubbles and become no longer relevant. Ford fought the Germans quite literally then after the war, the Japanese the same making partnerships, the Koreans making partnerships. Ford has a Chinese partnership already. As does gm, and stalantis if you can even call them American anymore. Build the plants to co make cars.
Farley even as a fairly decent CEO yelling heart and soul doesn’t do much. With all those people it’s money. The situation he is in isn’t necessary his fault. But he needs to wake up to reality. Maybe if he said he needs a year or two breathing room to start building the plants there is a conversion. But the Chinese are coming as other have before. They have already reshaped global auto. They will make their mark on American auto too.
CEOs – like politicians – tailor their public statements to the audience.
“The United States-Mexico-Canada Agreement (USMCA) is still in place, and vehicles that follow those rules are exempt. Well, the content of those cars that is USMCA-complaint is exempt from the newer 25% tariff.”
This is no longer correct. Today if a vehicle is USMCA compliant a manufacturer only pays the 25% on the non-US content. Content from Canada and Mexico is taxed at the same rate as anywhere else.
That is as of 11 PST on 15-April-2026. It could change again at any time.
Give it a day or so
Hopefully when the adults are back in office, we can simply go back to NAFTA proper. There were less problems, and more people across the board were happier.
Good to have some hope.
So the hedge fund managers are basically offering pay-day loans to smaller businesses?
Sounds about right. Taking 30% of their money for the convenience of getting paid now. Are we sure this isn’t J.G. Wentworth starting a hedge fund?
877 Cash Now
Viking helmet.
It’s your money, use it when YOU need it 😛
It’s my money and I need it now!
-Every Hedge Fund Ever
They are simply buying debt at a discount. Happens all the time.
We can hope the courts rule against the refunds and the hedge funds get taken to the cleaners!
It’s almost like he already knows his goose is cooked without strong isolationist policies. Manufacturing was the heart and soul of this country…like in 1965…now it’s the heart and soul of China, who has generally beaten the rest of the world for the last 20 years. If you want some great analogues, go look up some of the “downfall of BL” type documentaries on youtube regarding the introduction of Japanese cars to Britain. They had a lot of labor issues, but it’s still fundamentally rooted in cheaper and far better cars being brought in from overseas, while domestic manufacturing had high labor cost consideration, same as the US today.
Honestly the sooner people realize it’s 2026, and stop trying to reach back to completely unattainable “glory days” and uh…making America that again? we’ll all be better off for it, and invest accordingly.
“It’s been one of those days and I’m starting The Morning Dump at 11:42 AM. Technically, it’s still morning. It won’t be morning by the time you read this because even I’m not that fast.”
Odd as I’m reading it at 10:55 am and I’m in the continental USA.
I am near Boston and the time is off by an hour
I’m in the Pacific Time Zone and all times on Autopian are ahead by an hour. It seems there is no official Autopian Date Line.
Pretty sure we are correct. Maybe central time?
Your comment shows as Central Time for me. Which makes it off by 2 hours for me.
I think we have a winner for Autopian Time.
My browser just kicked into night panel, LOL.
It’s Eastern Standard Time. They just don’t update for Daylight Saving Time.
“They just don’t update for Daylight Saving Time.”
Where can I sign up for that! Seems like have been talking about dropping it for my entire lifetime.
I am a bit lucky that we have flexible schedules so I can show up anytime from 6 am to 9 am. This last winter I just refused to “fall back”
They might be running this through a server in the Carribean. When I lived in Colorado I had flexible hours and most of the people I worked with were on Eastern time, so when I moved to MD, I didn’t have to adjust.
When will the winning stop? I just can’t believe how it keeps winning
Well, we were supposed to get tired of winning. I am. The guy said so. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.facebook.com/politico/videos/donald-j-trump-were-gonna-win-so-much-youre-gonna-get-tired-of-winning/10153741780316680/&ved=2ahUKEwjQyOL1t_CTAxX7GVkFHXZdPQYQFnoECBEQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1SD1kllAqZ3x152cFTg1n0
There’s going to be far more people disagreeing with me than agreeing, but my Corvair is an absolute delight to drive. Well balanced handling, easy steering, good brakes, a comfortable ride without being floaty, and cushy seats. Ive had it fir years, have 4 other vehicles in the fleet right now and have owned others during that time, but its the one that makes me smile the most consistently when I get behind the wheel, and often ends up being what I pick for longer road trips over my more modern cars (Challenger) because of that
And it was very cheap new, around $2400, which is maybe $25kish today. I mean, its still doing the job over 60 years later and I could get in it today and head out on an 1800 mile trip if I wanted to, as I have done more than once
Corvairs are wonderful cheap driver’s cars with a manual. Not sure about the 2-speed PowerGlide. They are a bargain as an accessible, drivable collector car.
I’m likely to buy a ’62 with a Powerglide. The owner has some serious medical issues and I have been it’s mechanic. Intriguing cars. It also made be fully understand why the GM cars of my childhood were held in such low esteem.
I can’t believe how cheap Corvair’s still are. I really want one.
Not just the cars, the parts are also very affordable and virtually everything is readily available, they are very cheap and easy to keep on the road
I understand the desire to protect the US car industry, but we have already lived this tale. The Domestics got caught flat footed AGAIN. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
Japan never used slave labor for their vehicles.
I find it comical – and quite hypocritical – that many of the same people who are gushing over these impossibly low cost Chinese EVs, are also the type of people who complain about companies not offering “living wages” to their employees.
The automotive industry in modern times, at least in the US, has historically paid their workers quite well – one of the biggest drivers of the American middle class. So to undercut those well-paying job just so some cuck can buy a $8k Chinesium EV is just the kind of short-sighted planning that see all too often in the US.
My point is we had opportunity to get ahead of this. We made the joint ventures, we sold (gave) the technology. We built the original factories. We persisted in pursuing quarterly profit rather than innovation.
We were played by China and it was obvious 15+ years ago. China is doing what is best for China. Forcing joint-ventures, stealing technology, not caring about patents, and now that is has everything it needs, its tossing Western automakers to the side and looking to invade their space. As frustratingly short-sighted as our Western companies are, no one would ever dare get in the way of the good times and large profits rolling in. Nor could they. As independent companies, there is no mechanism for Western governments to tell them how exactly to operate.
The biggest problem is that while China looks decades into the future for what’s best for it’s people, Western governments (especially the US) barely looks a week ahead for what’s best for us. And I do know is that gutting our domestic car manufacturing industries just to get some cheap cars is most definitely NOT the smart thing to do.
No, we were played by American businesses chasing easy money, in a land with cheap labor, zero employee protections and no environmental (at the time) laws. They sold you out. Specifically, Republican Richard Nixon opened China up to US business in 1972. The rest is history.
I’m not going to defend the practices if Corporate America, but please don’t forget that every major car maker was trying to get it’s foot in the door if the Chinese domestic market. The Germans, the Japanese and everyone else. So while some will vilify the American brands, they weren’t even the biggest players there, and those other brands weren’t doing anything different.
The Chinese learned from us – true. Then they started innovating on their own and then surpassed us. We would do well to learn from them and require joint ventures in the USA in exchange for access to our market.
The longer we wait the farther we fall behind and the less relevant we are in the global market.
Surpassed us HOW? In lies-per-press release? In the most number of slave labor hours per car sold? Or is it in most gimmicks and gaudy styling?
Seems like someone has fallen for good marketing. Like those stories of EVs charging in 10 mins, but conveniently not telling you that there are only a handful of chargers that can go that fast in an entire country of 1.4 Billion people. Or those stupid videos of that one sports car that can jump. Umm. Yeah. I want a car that can jump. Or the one that wears down your tires so it can spin them to get you into a super tight parking spot.
Chinese car makers are definitely more in tune with Tiktok, but that’s not a good thing.
I’m getting my info from manufacturing engineers that have worked in our Chinese plants and supplier quality engineers that have been in Chinese supplier’s plants to certify the part production process.
Who are you talking to with direct knowledge of Chinese auto manufacturing?
You need a direct contact to see the end product? That’s like saying the only way to judge how good a meal is only if you know the cooks. I’ve working in manufacturing long enough to separate the buzz from the reality.
There are plenty of Chinese market (as well as Australian, African and a few European) sources that review Chinese cars and it’s one tacky, generic vehicle after another that always over-promises and under-delivers. If you’re impressed by fluff, then by all means, enjoy the offerings from China.
Slave labor is building cars in the USA today
https://www.al.com/news/2025/11/alabama-prison-labor-in-hyundai-supply-chain-driving-has-devastating-effect-on-wages-researchers-say.html
That’s a KOREAN company, and unlike China, it’s something that gets stopped, investigated and punished.
The State of Alabama sells slave labor to any company willing to pay for it – hundreds of companies. McDonald’s, Burger King, Wendy’s, KFC, Applebee’s …. those American enough for you?
https://apnews.com/article/prison-to-plate-inmate-labor-investigation-alabama-3b2c7e414c681ba545dc1d0ad30bfaf5
“He currently works at Progressive Finishes, one of the state’s biggest contractors of prison labor, which says on its website that it has served as a third-party supplier to automotive companies including Honda, General Motors, Ford, Toyota, Nissan, Kia, Volvo, Chrysler and Hyundai.”
Looks like it isn’t just Hyundai….
Also Hyundai wasn’t punished. It was simply the press shaming them that caused them to SAY they were going to make changes.
Oh look everybody, this is the norm in US car manufacturing.
Oh wait.
No it’s not.
It’s the complete opposite.
It’s the absurd outlier, but let’s pretend that it’s not so we can give the Chinese car makers a free pass to actual real large scale slave labor.
37 states contract prisoners to private companies. Not an absurd outlier. But hey – Hazdazos only cares about slave labor if those prisors are in China.
What a ridiculous take. If you spent even 5 seconds searching any of this nonsense, you’d see that some 60,000 prisoners in the US produce goods (of all types) while in prison, and just 4000 work for private companies producing goods outside of prison. And there is no indication they all work in the auto industry.
You understand that some 10 million Americans work in the auto industry directly or indirectly. 10 million. But yeah, let’s give China a free pass because MAYBE a few thousand prisoners in the US might be making hubcaps. That’s totally the same as having 80,000 Uyghurs (not counting thousands of people from other groups) used as slaved in the building of electronics for cars in the Chinese market. These aren’t prisoners who committed crimes like the ones doing time in the US. These are people who have been enslaved simply because of their heritage.
What an absolutely absurd outlier to focus on.
Why does the industry matter to you so much? Is a prisoner working in slave conditions at McDonalds, Tyson Foods, or on a farm somehow better than those people working for an auto part supplier?
If forced prison labor is wrong it is wrong. It is wrong despite the industry or country that is using prison slave labor.
However, you are willing to turn a blind eye to state sanctioned prison slave labor in the USA yet bring it up on pretty much any post about China.
I don’t give two fucks if some criminal is made to earn their keep. All criminals should be forced to repay their debt to society. I’m supposed to feel bad about some thief, murderer or drug dealer? Oh hell no.
And that’s the massive difference between putting prisoners to work, versus enslaving people who did nothing wrong, which is what China does. China isn’t taking their thieves and murders and making them work. They are rounding up all people of a certain ethnicity and enslaving them.
How dare you even remotely compare the two.
It is appalling you are trying to make that connection.
Yes, you should feel bad about the US prison system that is used to warehouse drug users, homeless and the mentally ill.
The idea of most of the people we have locked up are murders and thieves is laughable.
Nice pivot there when your original argument fell apart and went nowhere.
Maybe do less drunk posting.
My argument is that forced prison slave labor is wrong regardless of location.
It is also hilarious that you cannot see that the USA also rounds up people based on ethnicity but no doubt you think our justice system is blind and treats everyone the same.
Carry on with your head in the sand.
You’re welcome to go live in one of these meccas of human rights…. oh, but cowards like you never will. You LOVE to talk smack about the country you’re in, but too much of a pussy to stick to your guns, hand in your citizenship and go live amongst the Uyghurs. You want to hide behind the rights that Western nations give you, but want to equate outliers that happen in the West to the normalcy that happens in China and elsewhere.
Imagine getting your ass handed to you about human rights, on a website about cars, simply because you’re too clueless to understand the massive chasm between prisoners earning their keep and the mass enslaving of ethnic groups.
Get back in your lane, because you’re way over your head here.
Acknowledging our own shortcomings is the necessary first step to addressing them.
It’s disappointing to see The Autopian devolve into clickbait headlines that use the word “this” instead of the actual name of the person/thing in question.
“Nissan” is fewer letters than “this car,” too, so it’s not as if it’s a “we had to make this hed work” type situation. Autopian has lots of charm, a few quirks, and some things that could use shoring up.
An entire article published recently predicated on the range of a motorcycle didn’t even mention the range until the *eighteenth* paragraph, a count which generously leaves out the extensive autohagiographic block quotes the manufacturer provided about their history, legacy, etc etc. The lede wasn’t just buried, it was in the damn mantle.
I object also to the increasingly juvenile clickbait thumbnail/top shot illustrations. I don’t need cartoons (see above) if the author delivers a worthwhile article. If the author doesn’t, such illustrations don’t redeem it. Well, maybe Jason’s cartoons would.
Disappointing but not surprising if you read their article about the economics of running an ad supported online magazine.
You and I aren’t paying a dime for the content and they need to get paid. Clickbait headlines bring eyeballs and are favored by algorithms that control viability.
I’m probably missing something, but how would Chinese EVs in the US be such a major concern if the charger infrastructure isn’t any better here than it currently is? A vast majority of Americans (myself included) don’t have anywhere to charge without planning a trip to a public charging station that would include spending a good chunk of time there.
I think because the 10% ish market share that is currently sitting between Tesla and the others in this country, will probably shift to BYD and any other brand that sells EVs since the tax credit is gone, people will decide with their wallet.
Chinese OEMs have vertical integration on almost everything, they cars are cheaper because of that and labor. They dont even have to sell EVs, just with their PHEV offers have a big advantage because they have every different flavor, just the BYD Shark truck would be enough to make some damage to the Ford Ranger/Chevy Colorado, same price, better specs.
Thanks, you just supplied what I was missing. I was thinking in terms of only EVs, and hadn’t even considered any kind of hybrid or extended range electrics.
People truly do not understand how big of a deal the integration that the Chinese have done. When everything to build the car is made in the same country, it is cheap. Like why is that hard to see for people. It is wild.
But many Americans do have plenty of places to charge. In CA, there are Tesla supercharger stations everywhere. It would take a lot of effort to run out of charge and get stranded.
According to EVgo, there are approximately 9,520 public chargers in Los Angeles. The entire state of Alabama, where I live, has 538. The closest public charger to where I live is 27 miles away. So if I had a pure EV (not a hybrid or EREV), getting charged up would have to be an actual trip I have to plan. It’s safe to say when you get outside the major urban centers in this country, it’ll be the same situation for an awful lot of folks.
This, I was offered an EV as a rental out of Houston last year. I declined as I had no idea if I would be able to charge it out where I was going roughly 2 hours away. For 4 days.
Your local politicians are letting you down.
There are 50 states and the population density of the country is not very high. Currently, a tiny percent of the US fleet is EV, so an onslaught of cheap EVs (that would need more frequent charging) is going to be a huge challenge to the infrastructure in rural areas, particularly for supplying the kind of power that allows the fast charging necessary to make a cheap EV that needs to be charged more often practical in places where long distance driving is routine. Merely getting them installed is a challenge, never mind power generation and transport. Of course, those communities aren’t the ones most clamoring for an EV, though any kind of cheap car would be appealing as many of these places are in the lower economic class. In places with good existing infrastructure, like CA, the already high volume of EVs getting hit by a massive increase of cars that require more frequent charging (cheap EVs=small battery packs) might also be a big challenge as local charger density, wait times, and traffic conditions become a greater concern than distances. Urban areas also tend to have more rentals, pushing more residents to rely on public chargers rather than being able to charge at home and, with demand for the chargers, it’s not like a resident can leave it plugged into a public charger overnight.
55% of US households live in a detached single family home with dedicated off street parking.
And 45% don’t. My wife loves her Bolt and charges it overnight with the dedicated level 2 charger in our garage. But in a month we’re moving to Milwaukee, and the need for a home with a garage where we can install a charger is vastly complicating choices.
Eric said “A vast majority of Americans (myself included) don’t have anywhere to charge without planning a trip to a public charging station “
The reality is that a large minority could not charge at home – at that only looking detached single family homes. Plenty of townhomes have driveways and even garages. Some condos and apartments have chargers.
I’ve only lived in Alabama since the rise of EVs (so this will necessarily be anecdotal), but in my city of 60,000 there are zero apartment complexes or townhome communities with chargers. I personally live in a beautiful historic neighborhood with houses that are 120-150 years old and there isn’t a garage in sight. Hell, most of us don’t even have driveways. Chargers at home are just not feasible for a significant portion of the population here.
Also my city has no public charging stations. Two or three dealerships here have one or two chargers each but the dealerships say they are only for people who drive that dealership’s brand of EV. Of the 500+ chargers currently in Alabama, about 130 of them are in a city 30 miles from me, over 200 of them are in a city 95 miles from me, and most of the remaining ones are even farther away than that.
I imagine a lot of it comes down to demand, though. I believe in my neck of the woods about everyone who wants an EV has gotten one and figured out how to make charging work for them. I think the only way more people around here would want an EV is if they could charge one as quickly as they can fill up an ICE car at the gas station. I think this also points to how circumstances are so vastly different from one region to the next in this country that it’s hard to get an understanding of the average resident’s situation if you zoom out to a national level.
(Side note: I drove a Model S when I was in Denver on vacation and it was so much fun it ruined my Chevy Trax for me. I returned to Alabama a defeated man who’s only getting more bitter by the day because for me an EV is just not practical.)
Before we moved west I lived in Alabama for 7 years in a suburb south of Birmingham. 1920 population 808. 2020 population 21,000. Thousands of new cookie cutter spec homes with a driveway, garage, and 200 amp panel.
Today I live in a suburb of Portland, Oregon that is also filled with cookie cutter homes with driveways, garages, and 200 amp panels. 1920 population 2,468. 2020 population 106,000.
In Alabama EVs make up 3% of new car sales. In Oregon it is 17%. The difference is not geography – it is policy. Oregon is a CARB state that actively supports a move to EVs with both policy and direct incentives. Alabama does not. A lot of that policy can be tied to politics.
When 17% of new car sales are EVs apartments start installing chargers to attract tenants. DC chargers get built so those EVs can go on road trips. Employers install chargers because it is a cheap perk for employees. It snowballs because the more chargers the more people are comfortable buying an EV but someone has to start that snowball rolling.
It also politics and beliefs. I like clean air, no matter where I live.
Clean air is nice! I think a lot of people haven’t realized how much a difference the air quality is in areas that don’t have as many car emissions thanks to EVs, cleaner diesels, etc.
You nailed it.
I’m sure there are a lot of people here like me who’d like an EV but are hesitant to get one because of the lack of infrastructure.
Either a bunch of us need to take the plunge and then the private sector sees the trend so they start putting in the infrastructure, or the government just needs to go ahead and add it so folks won’t be so skittish to get EVs because they will see enough charging stations to put their minds at ease regarding range anxiety.
(Although I still think ultimately mass adoption won’t happen outside of major metro areas until the process of charging gets as fast as filling up an ICE car at a gas station.)
The majority of the US population lives in urban areas. 67% in metros over 500K and 55% in metros over 1 million. So we have a long way to go in adoption rates before EVs need to get to rural areas. That said, rural areas in general have less barriers to home charging which is what is key to making an EV work.
As to DC charge times – the 15 minute charge times we have today work fine. We just need more DC chargers in more areas. People that don’t own EVs get hung up on DC charge times but they are so infrequent that it doesn’t really matter. However, me saying that on the internet isn’t going to change any minds.
Minds get changed when people we know and trust personally have a good experience with a product. It will be friends, family, and coworkers that change minds about EVs just like they did with hybrids.
Yeah, I’m displaying my own ignorance here because I didn’t even realize charge times were down to 15 minutes. Are most newer chargers going to be DC chargers? As in, are DC chargers predominately what are installed now?
Yes, almost all new public chargers are DC. They are sometimes called Level 3 or fast chargers. Most new ones in the USA are rated at 150 kW to 350 kW. (Which is on the low end globally). The USA added 18,000 new DC chargers in 2025.
AC charging (Level 1 or Level 2) is mostly done at home. AC charging tops out at 19.2 kW.
(I charge my EV at 5.5 kW on a 240 / 30 amp circuit shared with my electric clothes dryer.)
The speed of charging is based on the limitations of the vehicle and charger. The max charge speed for my Bolt is 55 kW. I can plug it into a 350 kW DC charger but it will still only charge at 55 kW.
On the other hand an Ioniq 6 can plug into that 350kW charger and charge from 10% to 80% in 18 minutes but someone wanting to make time on a trip would not charge to 80%.
EV charging is not linear. At low state of charge they charge faster and then slow down as the battery SOC increases. It is faster to do more but shorter charges. Add about 200 miles of highway range and then get back on the road.
Charging apps will do all this planning for you. Just select whether you want a faster trip or fewer charges. Select the minimum SOC you want as a reserve. From there it will tell you where to stop for a charge and the SOC to charge at for each stop.
Sounds like while a lot of us were whining about range, the EV community went ahead and figured it out.
Yes they did. The focus today should be building out the DC charging network. Faster speeds would be nice but even that isn’t that important. What is important is more chargers in more places – especially outside of large metros.
The biggest disconnect between people that own EVs and those that don’t is that people that don’t own EVs want to replicate the gas station model with EVs. That model does not work and it isn’t even that desirable.
I looked at MKE before moving to Appalachia. It rules as a city, but boy can they drink. Also weirdly segregated…felt whiter than Denver.
Houses were very very neat, but garages were sparse. And it seemed like we would need one for our cars because of snow. Nevermind the projects and motorbikes.
Yeah, neat city, lots of diversity but still very segregated by neighborhood. And yes, they can drink!
Someone else pointed out that you can charge electric cars outside, but I don’t relish the idea of breaking the charger free after a Wisconsin ice storm. Finding a property with a garage bumps us up $50-100k.
Appalachia is beautiful. Enjoy!
Cars don’t need garages. Not for charging, not for rain, not for sun, not for snow. Ice scrapers were invented for a reason and having a garage won’t keep you from needing one. In the snow belt life goes on when it snows so your car might get buried in 6-8 inches of snow while it is in the parking lot at work.
Growing up in Michigan we had a garage but only my mom’s car lived in the garage. The rest of us got to scrape windows every morning while the car idled to warm up a bit.
I know scrapers exist. Not having to use one is a tiny luxury I prioritize.
Is it a garage, carport or open driveway? Does the service need upgraded? What are the local power rates?
Garage, carport, or driveway – that doesn’t matter. EVs charge fine outside.
Electrical service and power rates are not technical issues – they are economic ones.
There are also options to share electrical service with smart switches so the service doesn’t need to be upgraded to install a charger. My charger shares a plug with my clothes dryer.
We’ve discussed this. If David had been better organized and not moved to the West Coast, you could have gotten started much earlier and would have finished well before noon.
I have grown tired of listening to CEO’s complain about anything “unfair”. Effing cake-eaters.
Also we have been hearing about “unfair” imports since the 1970s. Too bad, so sad.
Deming tried his hardest to teach us first, we just wouldn’t listen.
We have only ourselves (as a collective) to blame. The relentless pursuit of quarterly profit.
COTD
CEOs are like small children, who claim lots of things are unfair. Competition is hard.
I think their compensation, now average hundreds of times of that of the average worker, is unfair.
2 billion people will be able to see ‘God of Chaos’ asteroid Apophis when it buzzes Earth in April 2029.
But.. I’m seeing him Now.
Always preferred this version of I WANNA BE YOUR DOG.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhnNRZVC7SY&list=RDuhnNRZVC7SY&start_radio=1
I appreciate the reminder from Matt that it has been way too long since I listened to The Stooges.
I think the Belvidere, Illinois cars were decent cheap transportation, cheap being the main point there. The Dodge Charger(L Body)/Omni/Neon/Caliber, fisher price plastic interiors but they worked. I may be partial with the Neon, it was a great little cheap coupe.
The thing that’s interesting about the Chinese cars is yes they’re heavily subsidized, but they’re also good, and that’s the new thing. Previous state owned/subsidized cars were just horrible attempts at basic transportation for the masses, Yugo, Lada, Skoda, etc. So they weren’t a threat, more of a punishment. It’s an entirely different thing when the government is funding cars that are really good, yay for China but unfair for capitalism. So the options are we let them in and they just destroy our industry, or keep them out to ‘save’ capitalism, but that’s not exactly the best example of capitalism.
You make this post as if you’re intentionally disregarding all the subsidies offered to domestic automakers, oil companies, and corporate farming on this side of the Pacific.
Agreed. Its really not a level playing field in the US
Not all automakers equally, and then some have Unions, some don’t, but with all that they get, incentives to build and hire people by the local governments, rebates, write offs, bail outs if they go bankrupt, but they still don’t make competitive products at the same prices, and that’s including when they could build the cheap stuff in Mexico without tariffs.
It’s going to be mid 70s all over again when Japan came in if China breaks through, domestic makes will have to wake up or shut down a few more brands, and Chrysler’s just got the 1 van to live in down by the river.
I had a Plymouth Neon I bought new. ’94 I think, maybe a ’93. Paid about $10K for it new. It really was a fun-to-drive small car. Great answer on the question.
The Indiana-made Toyota GH/hybrid and Sienna.
“Affordable” is in the eye of the beholder of course, but 35+ mpg and 300,000 mile life in a legit family hauler help take the sting out of the MSRP (which is still only about the average for a new vehicle).
We’re probably getting a GH hybrid. It’s a hard car to argue with.
American *made* cars or American *branded* cars? Because you can still get a new Civic or Corolla made right here in Freedom Land for less than $30k. The Trax is cheaper but I don’t think they are made here.
It’s not, it’s mainly assembled in South Korea, with an engine that appears to be made in Mexico. Kind of stretches the definition of “domestic” car, but what the hell.
Arguablely the Japanese car industry has invested more in US production over the last 40+ years than the Domestics.
Granted, they are also not UAW jobs.
Domestic and non-union is what the current admin would like. Global supply and production wasn’t political, it was capitalism
I worked a salaried mtc supervisor/engineer/manager over about 20 years in the domestic steel industry. My feelings on Unions are complex. At the worst companies, they were vital. At the best, an obstacle.
The problem is they are pretty much the only tool that workers have. Everything else is being stripped away.
Unions are also a double edged sword. Yes, they return higher wages and benefits but they also hold back good employees from advancing. When everything is based on seniority there no reward for going the extra mile and no penalty for doing the bare minimum.
Totally agree with that but I would argue that most companies seem to hire/promote based on seniority/loyalty anyways. How many worthless C suite ass kissers are out there. It is no different than the Unions. At least the point of Unions is to protect workers.
Having worked in UAW factories and Japanese non-union factories there is a world of difference between how things work on the factory floor.
In a UAW factory I have seen first hand a senor worker telling a new guy boldly right in front of me to slow down – “we work to rate here”.
Seen a worker stop the line and sit down because his bin of bolts was empty. There were more bolts not 50 feet away but he wouldn’t get them because “That’s not my job”. Materials is suppose to stock his bin. So I went and filled his bin and started the line. That got me a look and a grievance but was the right thing to do.
In the Japanese factory it was everyone’s job to work together to get good product out the door.
What is the pay and benefit difference like between the American union factories and the Japanese non-union factories?
About 20%
UAW workers at the Detroit 2.5 are in the low $70 / hour range.
That’s…quite a large difference. Is this why the Japanese car factories are mostly in the south and away from Detroit where the unions are? Because if I were an autoworker and could choose to work at two factories close enough to commute to, one union and one not, I know which one I’d pick.
Yes. Asian and European companies specifically choose “right to work” states that have laws that make unionizing difficult. They also chose site locations in rural areas where land is cheap and the local workforce doesn’t have a lot of options.
For example the Mercedes is in Vance, AL, Honda is in Lincoln, AL, Kia is in West Point, GA….
I wonder what it would take for the workers at those plants to demand a union. They probably don’t have much power to do that at all, because they could easily just be fired and replaced by someone else desperate for a job. You know, one of the exact reasons that unions became a thing for…
51% of them rolling the dice on throwing away what they have in hopes of more. The blue collar guys working assembling Hondas are still making double what someone working in a tier 1 would make.
While it is technically illegal to shut down a factory because it unionized it does happen and companies can freely shop their business to other cities and states. Most of the cost of a new factory is the equipment inside it not the shell. My father-in-law (union electrician) retired when the factory he worked at his whole career was crated up an moved. They did ask him to rewire the machines in the new location – he said no.
It is crazy to see what happens when a UAW shop closes. I grew up in a now dead GM town that used to have tens of thousands of UAW workers. One by one the factories closed and relocated. A lot of those guys retired or just quit working altogether because they refused to work for what they could get on the open market in a non-union factory like the one my dad worked in.
My dad looked at moving to a union factory a couple of times but never did because he would have had to start all over again at the bottom since EVERYTHING was seniority based.
I worked with unions and around them a few times and I have a similar kind of love/hate with them. The main issue, like almost everything, is people suck and power attracts the worst of them, be it union, management, or government.
The Japanese tend to have more modern, more efficient plants, optimized non-union workforces, and are generally located in states with less regulations and a lower cost of doing business. The legacy domestics started where they started, and are largely stuck with the structure they have, while foreign companies all came in and started from a clean sheet
This. They also empowered (to some degree) the workforce from the start. There is less need for a Union when everyone is treated fairly to begin with.
Yeah, Toyota never had a Battle of the Overpass in Kentucky
I’ve been in (as a consultant) the auto plants of all of the big three and Toyota and Honda in Ontario. It’s been many years, but at the time the glaring difference between how the big three and the Japanese would engage with their workforce would blow your mind. The big three thought their workers were criminal idiots while the Japanese valued them as capable professional team members.
I’ve worked in both UAW and Japanese factories. The key difference I’ve seen is that in a UAW factory EVERYTHING is based on seniority while in a Japanese factory more is based on performance and skills.
You can also fire the criminals and idiots in a Japanese factory.
Toyota doesn’t pay their assembly line workers $70 per hour in wages + benefits.
Even worse, Howard Lutnik the Commerce Secretary, will likely be getting the most benefit from the Tariff Refunds, as his hedge fund run fully by his sons began buying up tariff refund contracts not very long after the tariffs went into place. All while he was actively shouting from the roof tops about how the tariffs were 100% legal and going to stick and are totally the best thing for the economy.
Corruption, gaslighting, insider information and crime: the true art of the deal.
Me thinks the SEC should have a … nevermind
Too late for that, we need guillotines. I’ll sign up to pull levers for free.
Well, we can’t have our
best peoplepatriots looked at for insider trading. Lutnick is such a great guy! /sWhenever I read the name lutnick it comes out with the N and the L reversed.
Does anyone else have that same problem?
Chevy Bolt. Unfortunately it will be produced for a short period of time (GM doing GM things).
Light words.
It’s someone unilaterally disregarding trade agreements that they, themselves, established.
Why makes countries really excited to make new deals. Which explains the talking without actual deals being signed. Trump is about headlines not policy.
Well, there is a conflict going on where the current admin flaked out 3 times to the same country. We shouldn’t be surprised that a leader who has regularly stiffed contractors has decided to opt out of a contract.
I guess now I’m not getting my tariff check.
Thanks, Obama.
You sure it wasn’t Biden? This is still his economy over a year later after all.
Before Trump took office I was saying they would continue to blame the Democrats for anything bad that happens, even though they control the white house, the senate, the house of reps, and the supreme court. And the cult eats it up because how could Trump be wrong? He’s Jesus. I saw the picture where he was healing Jon Stewart.
I am a member of the local Elks and last winter I had a local MAGA person blaming the “liberals” for all of the problems. I pointed out that the GOP had all three and still couldn’t get anything positive going. I apparently farted in church. You were correct.
First term was the same. Apparently day 1 in that term was the guy, but not so much a year plus into term 2. Selective thinking is important.
Come on now – he clearly said he was not Jesus – that is crazy talk.
He is clearly wearing a standard issue Red Cross uniform. /S
No no he was trying to save Epstein not John Stewart
Japanese American is a good way to start. As with your vibe . XV10 Camry is about as indestructible car as you can get built in Indiana. But saturns of the same era were well built and received. SC1, SC2. They are fairly close to indestructible.
The geo line up had many models at the nummi plant they were all decent and fairly indestructible.
The nummi-built Toyotas?
There’s a theme here.
It’s just a vibe
Since I cannot think of any current cheap good American made cars.
I will suggest the early 1980s Rabbits made near Pittsburgh.
The Pennsylvania State Police bought some of those back in the day, slower than a Dodge St Regis but their radios were still just as quick
Ahh, the Westmoreland plant in New Stanton. It’s still alive as a mixed use industrial site. Fun fact, the plant was actually built by Chrysler.
I nominate the Corolla.
Unfortunately they had electrical issues.
Mine only did when it rained and water leaked behind the dash, Otherwise it was fine.
Mr. Farley can kick and scream like an SNL skit all he wants, the Chinese EVs cometh.
Once they make headway here in Canada, it’s just a matter of time before they move south. Especially if we set up plants here.
It’s almost like there were lessons from (recent) history that could have been learned here.
History requires reading. He was elected to lead, not to read.