Despite a ton of options on the market, many people are still wary of EVs. Some don’t want to buy an EV because of perceived range issues. Some don’t want to buy one because of battery life concerns. Some don’t want to buy an EV because public charging networks aren’t there yet. However, the biggest reason why people should think hard before buying a new EV is that the quality of many EVs at launch has been problematic. From recalls due to fire to owner complaints about software, very few EVs have rolled out smoothly. Let’s recap some of the problems facing popular EVs and then see what an expert has to say about quality in the segment.
Audi E-Tron GT
While the Audi E-Tron GT is a fairly solid EV, it’s not without minor troubles. Audi has a TSB out over E-Tron GTs shifting to neutral when coming to a stop without any driver input, a somewhat disorienting malfunction to have. The cause? Bad software; and software issues don’t just affect the drive unit. There’s also a TSB out for flickering heads-up display street names, one for dead telematics, and one for stored trouble codes upon delivery with no actual faults present. All of those issues sound annoying, so the E-Tron being one of the better of this bunch on paper when it comes to teething issues is wild. (Oh, and a fair warning for anyone who wants to peruse technical service bulletins on NHTSA’s site: German automakers will put out TSBs over anything, so you really need to dig for common E-Tron GT-specific faults).
Chevrolet Bolt EV
The big scandal around the Chevrolet Bolt had to do with a supplier problem, but it could still take out the entire car. It seems that battery supplier LG cocked up making the battery cells. Normally, when a manufacturer messes up building an engine, it dies in a puddle of its own oil at the side of the road. Expensive and annoying, sure, but relatively manageable without getting the emergency services involved. However, LG’s battery pack issue resulted in a risk of fiery death. Alright, so no actual death, but certainly fire. As a result, GM recalled every single Bolt EV and Bolt EUV it made from the beginning of time to August 2021, and put a stop-sale order on the whole lot. Dealers couldn’t sell new or used in-stock models, owners couldn’t park their cars indoors, and GM would eventually vow to replace the battery packs in all affected Bolts. Production wouldn’t start up again until months later.
Of course, the Bolts could only stay away from fire for so long. Late last year, Chevrolet recalled the vast majority of Bolts once again, this time due to a risk of the seatbelt pretensioners setting the carpet on fire in crashes. These problems are quite ironic considering that the Bolt name is meant to evoke the image of lightning bolts, which are known for causing wildfires.
Some airports and other public spaces have specifically banned Chevy Bolts from their parking lots.
Ford F-150 Lightning
While Chevrolet Bolts caught fire in the hands of owners, a Ford F-150 Lightning electric truck’s battery caught fire before the vehicle even left Ford’s custody. It’s a bit ironic that two vehicles named after lightning would have fire issues, but sometimes life deals up cards that even sitcom script editors would find heavy-handed. On Feb. 4, an F-150 Lightning ignited at a Ford storage lot. Awkward. In addition, Ford currently has a customer campaign out for F-150 Lightning battery performance degradation — not a great look for a recently-launched flagship EV.
Ford Mustang Mach-E
Mind you, the F-150 Lightning isn’t the only Ford EV to have been stricken with battery problems. In June of 2022, Ford recalled 48,924 Mustang Mach-E electric crossovers and placed a stop-sale order on in-stock units due to battery contactors overheating when the vehicle was driven like a Mustang. The fix came in the form of a software update, although I haven’t been out in a post-recall Mach-E to see if that update had any adverse effects on performance.
Hyundai Ioniq 5 and Kia EV6
After receiving their new Hyundai Ioniq 5 and Kia EV6 electric crossovers, many owners rolled into winter and realized they had no heat inside their pricey new cars. A quick scroll through the forums points to several owners having cabin heater issues, which would make for a very unpleasant winter driving experience. A technical service bulletin for these issues is known to exist in Ireland, although the issue is somewhat on the down-low. A more common launch issue was a lack of battery preconditioning, which is currently being fixed through a software update. Lack of battery preconditioning can seriously affect DC fast charging speed, which is a bit embarrassing considering that the E-GMP platform’s 800-volt architecture is a huge selling point for these cars.
Oh, and then there was the recall for the shifter control unit disengaging the parking pawl and letting these vehicles roll away without any driver input. That issue apparently led to four vehicles on the loose in South Korea.
Jaguar I-Pace
Jokes about British cars and electronics are a bit cheap, but it seems as if Jaguar hasn’t moved past them quite yet. In 2019, Jaguar had to recall 3,083 2019 and 2022 I-Pace models because their regenerative braking systems could fail. I don’t know about you but that doesn’t sound so fun. Add in hundreds of technical service bulletins including one about failure of the high-voltage coolant heater, and you end up with a risky if visually-attractive buy.
Nissan Leaf
This one’s a throwback showing that EV problems are nothing new. While the second-generation Leaf is a perfectly fine car, the original version had significant battery degradation issues due to how the battery was cooled. See, instead of using liquid cooling like pretty much every other EV on the planet, Nissan decided to save costs and cool the batteries using air. This didn’t work so well, and as a result, most early Leafs for sale are best considered about-town cars. Add in a recall for 2013 to 2015 Leafs’ brake relays freezing in cold temperatures, and first-generation Leafs didn’t have a great time on the market.
Polestar 2
In 2022, Polestar recalled 3,457 2021 and 2022 Polestar 2 electric vehicles because the battery energy control module could reset while driving, cutting power and leaving drivers unable to accelerate or maintain speed. Mind you, the Polestar 2 isn’t just affected by one safety-related issue. the 2021 model currently has 93 technical service bulletins covering components from dead keys to problems during high-voltage battery replacement.
Rivian R1T
Instead of drivetrain problems, Rivian had an issue with keeping all its suspension parts together. Back in October, Rivian recalled 12,212 R1T electric trucks, R1S electric SUVs, and EDV electric vans due to hardware between the steering knuckles and upper control arms potentially backing out. While only two vehicles were confirmed to experience this failure, the thought of your shiny new expensive pickup truck doing its best Lightning McQueen impersonation is nerve-wracking to say the least. The solution was, in Rivian’s words, “a properly-torqued fastener.” Sounds almost too simple to mess up, right? In addition, Rivian recalled 12,716 R1T trucks and R1S SUVs just last month for restraint system issues that could “prevent the automatic locking retractor “(ALR)” from functioning as intended.” In simpler words, ouch.
Subaru Solterra and Toyota bZ4X
How mortifying must it be when your first real effort at a global electric vehicle has issues with wheels falling off? Yeah, these Toyota and Subaru twins had issues with lug bolts backing out despite Toyota being no stranger to lug bolts. The result was a stop-sale order, buyback offers, and a PR nightmare for Toyota and Subaru. We’ve covered the issue in-depth before if you want a closer look at these twins’ failure to launch. Since then, Toyota has issued several technical service bulletins regarding disappointing charging performance, so it looks like this crossover isn’t out of the woods yet.
Tesla…Everything
What can be said about Tesla quality problems that hasn’t been said before? From Model 3 production hell to panel gap issues to an investigation into having steering wheels detach while underway, Tesla has quite fairly been the poster child for EV quality issues. What appears to be a combination of aggressive production targets and an inclination towards fixing things in post-production means that buying a Tesla has historically been a bit of a gamble. After all, when was the last time you heard of a new car’s bumper cover falling off after driving through a puddle?
Volkswagen ID.4
Volkswagen’s in the midst of a software disaster right now and the ID.4 isn’t unscathed. The ID.4’s infotainment software sucks. It’s laggy, glitchy, and generally a fearsome beast to operate. While this isn’t EV-specific as the Golf GTI suffers from similar maladies, it’s still an annoying thing to get around when launching a new EV. Here’s something EV-specific though: The ID.4 can have issues with charging. Numerous owners have reported charging failures when trying to charge at home, be it on Level 1 or Level 2, and I also had issues trying to charge an early ID.4 on Level 1. This isn’t be excusable as charging at home should be painless, just like it has been in every other plug-in car I’ve tested.
So what’s going on here? We reached out to Robby DeGraff, Product and Consumer Insights Analyst at AutoPacific, for his insight on EV problems, and he reckons that manufacturers are still figuring out how to make EVs. “ICE vehicles for a hundred plus years now have been able to adapt on-the-fly to such an eclectic mix of environments, weather, and driving situations,” said DeGraff. “Automakers are trying to mirror that with EVs and we’re getting there. A lot of these quality problems affecting EVs related to the batteries themselves, expectedly, whether that be cells failing or the various fire risks associated with lithium-ion packs. I think once solid-state batteries arrive on the scene for EVs and even PHEVs, that’ll fix a lot of these issues.”
One thing that might affect how we perceive EV quality is that minor powertrain failure points are largely a thing of the past due to EV drivetrains. “It’s not like an ICE car in which if you’re driving and your muffler falls off or gets a hole in it, you can simply keep going,” said DeGraff. With the simplification we’re seeing in electric vehicles, fewer and larger failure points are to be expected.
DeGraff also pointed out that we also face new problems thanks to DC fast charging. He told us, “I’m especially concerned about these reports I’ve read about EVs getting absolutely fried at public charging stations. Whether that’s an issue with the vehicle’s battery or the plugged-in charging stall and cable itself. That’s a threat that needs to be addressed ASAP and doesn’t help wipe away any consumer worries about public charging infrastructure.”
In short, many of the issues around EVs is because companies have never done anything like them at scale before. Automakers like Tesla and Rivian that don’t have decades of history are still working on manufacturing. Automakers that we’ve been used to for generations are still working on electric powertrains and all the changes they involve. The electric future isn’t going to be trouble-free, so it would be reasonable to expect early efforts to always have some kinks.
[Editor’s Note: I’d also like to mention that a lot of cars, EV or ICE, tend to see TSBs and recalls, especially during their first model year. Now, we’re seeing cars debut that were developed during the pandemic, when automakers had to figure out how to design cars remotely. There have also been a ton of supply chain issues, and economic turmoil for suppliers and OEMs alike. There are lots of factors that are playing into the problems you’re seeing here, but it’s worth noting that these automakers are trying to put their best feet forward so they can jump into the EV future full-steam ahead, but they’re stumbling. And, whether the primary cause is indeed an unfamiliarity with EV technology and startups lacking historical automotive expertise — or if it’s supply chain and other COVID-related problems — that stumbling alone is worth highlighting given how important these cars are to these automakers, especially at this moment in auto history.
In response to one person’s much-appreciated feedback in the comments, I’d like to make it clear that we love EVs around here (I just bought one — more on that in a future article), and I’d like to quote an Axios article comparing EV recalls/defect numbers to those of traditional ICE-powered cars.
From the story titled “EVs recalled more often than gas engine vehicles”:
…EVs collectively made up about 0.9% of automotive recall incidents and 1% of total vehicles recalled from 2017 through the first half of 2022, according to data compiled by recalls manager Sedgwick at the request of Axios.
- But during that period, EVs represented an average of no more than about 0.4% of vehicles on the road, according to figures provided by car research site Edmunds and the Bureau of Transportation Statistics. And that figure assumes that none of the 2.1 million EVs sold this century were ever scrapped during that period.
…Third-party studies of consumers’ experiences have also concluded that EVs have more problems than gas-engine vehicles.
- The 2022 J.D. Power Initial Quality Study found that owners of electric vehicles and plug-in hybrids reported an average of 240 and 239 problems per 100 vehicles, respectively, compared with 173 for ICE vehicles.
- Electric SUVs were the least reliable category of vehicles among 17 types ranked by Consumer Reports in January, due in large part to issues that “often have no connection to the drivetrain,” such as electronics, climate system, body hardware and trim.
-DT].
(Photo credits: Audi, Chevrolet, Ford, Hyundai, Kia, Jaguar, Nissan, Polestar, Rivian, Subaru, Toyota, Tesla, Volkswagen)
Support our mission of championing car culture by becoming an Official Autopian Member.
-
Toyota Hoped The bZ4X EV Would Usher The Brand Into The Electric Era. Then The Wheels Fell Off
-
The Chevrolet Bolt EV Has Once Again Been Recalled Due To Fire Risk, But The Cause Is So Much Weirder Than A Battery Short
-
Ford Holds Its Horses With A Stop-Sale Order And Recall For Its Mustang Mach-E Electric Crossover
-
The Tesla Model S Gets Recalled For Weird Overheating Problems
-
Ford Is Trying To Get Its Shit Together
Got a hot tip? Send it to us here. Or check out the stories on our homepage.
What have we done to deserve such things.
Regarding ‘a new car’s bumper cover falling off after driving through a puddle’… well I had the front bumper of the 2000 Saab 9-3 I had fall off one time when I had to hit the brakes hard.
And here are a couple of Nissans where the same thing happened:
https://cdn.carcomplaints.com/complaints/images/f71c3a84-1ce6-1034-b743-4c3114d2dee3.jpg
https://www.reddit.com/r/Wellthatsucks/comments/k2v5xs/my_bumper_fell_off_while_driving_home/
And when it comes to defects, I can cite numerous ICE vehicles that have lots of defects that make the recent issues with BEVs look good. I disagree with the premise that the defects found on BEVs are somehow worse on average.
Building all-new cars on all-new platforms with all-new powertrains is hard regardless of what powertrain/tech they have.
I’d argue that Club Car and Yamaha make some very reliable electric vehicles, however I did spend half the summer troubleshooting a Club Car that ultimately needed a new speed controller as half the MOSFETs had blown up.
My PHEV Volt is doing just great and is built like a rock (TM). Full on EVs are a weird waste of money and resources for people who rarely need the full range of the vehicle and could get by with a small battery and a fuel efficient backup motor. VOLT FOR LIFE. ITS THE PERFECT POWERTRAIN FOR EVERYDAY BORING CAR STUFF PROVE ME WRONG /rant
This makes me wonder what’s the experience of EV drivers in European countries – such a Norway – which have much higher EV uptake, as a percentage of all auto sales. That is, are they seeing as many issues with their cars and their charging infrastructure as here in the US?
Can anyone explain why plug-in hybrids are so much more expensive than ordinary hybrids (and, for the most part, BEVs)?
You are basically purchasing two full drive trians in a plug in hybrid. One needs all of the bits of a full electric and bits of a full gas car, short the starter motor to make it run.
As you said, every car has issues, these types of issues are not unique to EVs, plenty of ICE engine issues, things most folks would have thought were figured out a long time ago.
The funny thing for me, is that other than the battery recall on my Bolt (which was a pain, not because of what it was, but how poorly it was handled by chevy corporate and dealerships, took 2 trips to different dealerships 200+ miles away to get it done right), most other issues have been with the normal parts of the car- infotainment screen that freezes up, aux port that stops working randomly for a day, windshield wipers that just decide to stop working in snowy conditions, charge door that occasionally pops open while driving, blind spot sensors that were missing film from the factory. Almost all of the problems are things that are not related to an EV, and should be well beyond mature tech by now. Since I bought the first model year of the first of a new type of vehicle, I expected to have some issues with the EV part of the car, but was not expecting that most of the issues would be with the normal parts of the car.
One challenge for consumers is that All legacy auto manufacturers and most new ev startups is that they all rely on 2nd tier (& 3rd tier) auto suppliers.
When something goes wrong due to a part defect, the manufacturer doesn’t give a shit bc why would they? As long as the failure rate is below some XX% all the manufacturer has to do is issue a tsb to their dealers. And only if the risk of consumer lawsuits (& occasionally regulatory risk) is expected to exceed the cost of a recall do they actually issue a recall (Fight Club was right).
For nearly all auto manufacturers ((that I know of) except Tesla), their business strategy is one designed by MBAs for a product that is extremely mature and therefore the manufacturer has decided on a strategy of maximum outsourcing.
What value do they actually add themselves? Their skills lie in Design (including engineering of the initial design), marketing and financing. From their own vehicle design, What do the manufacturers actually manufacture? The body/shell and for their ICE cars maybe the engine block (though not always) and that’s it. For their EVs? All they manufacture is the body shell. Everything else is catalogue engineering, ie they pick the parts (including battery packs, battery contontroller, BMS, electric motors, gear reduction/transaxle/transmission) as well as the interior, 12v electrical system come via specs. from thousands of 3rd party suppliers. The only two manufacturers that are takkng a business strategy of more vertical integration and actually are manufacturing at least their own battery packs and electric motors are Lucid (who certainly are having a hell of a time scaling) and the best example of verticL integration is Tesla.
Given electric vehicles (in relatively modern times – ie the past 30-40 years) have advanced at an incredible pace, especially driven by Tesla and the Chinese auto manufacturers in the past 10 years, in such a scenario maximizing vertical integration makes sense. By striving as a value to maximize vertical integration, these companies are setting themselves up so that they can be the most Agile, which is highly advantageous with an ev tech. advancing so rapidly. It is the companies that can move the fastest & respond to change the fastest that will win.
Thwre are a handfull of other examples of highly vertically integrated auto manufacturers in Remac and Koenigsegg, in each case allowing them to be highly agile and unique in the market, of course both are tiny companies by comparison with no (current) intention of selling mass market vehicles
Even considering how BEVs compare to ICE vehicles in terms of TSBs and recalls, wouldn’t the more direct comparison (for the most part…) be to compare new launch BEVs to new launch ICE?
The criticism of BEV quality is certainly warranted but this piece isn’t framed well, editor’s note or not.
+1
Launching an all-new vehicle on an all-new platform using an all-new powertrain is hard regardless of what powertrain/tech is used.
I can think of many 1st year ICE vehicles that were complete disasters and make the issues cited here about BEVs look like nothing.
1st year cars (or 1st year of a major redesign) like the Vega, Fiero, Audi Allroad, Morris Marina, Ford Windstar, Ford Taurus, FWD Lincoln Continental, Omni/Horizon, the botched 2020 Ford Explorer and many MANY others.
If the current EVs on the market make you wary about quality control and dependability, just wait until the Vinfast and the Chinese EVs hit the road. Get out the popcorn, ’cause you ain’t seen nuthin’ yet!
‘is worth highlighting given how important these cars are to these automakers, especially at this moment in auto history. ‘
If you think they’re important now just wait till 2035.
I see it like this; what are the least reliable components of a standard modern vehicle? By standard I mean a gas ICE with an automatic, either 2wd or awd. The electrics! So when the entire car is electric don’t be surprised when there’s constant gripes!
Must…resist…urge to make…Jaguar joke…
A few months ago I chased down the owner of a British roadster to let him know his brake lights didn’t work.
His response: “Huh, they worked last weekend.”
Lucas, the gift that keeps on giving.
This is the issue with over the air software updates. Just look at the video game market for reference. It’s “the get it out the door and patch and fix it later” mentality. Making the customers the guinea pigs for a new product instead of spending the time and money to get it right from the factory. It’s like they don’t even drive them before production.
If there were recalls in the Model T times, it would’ve looked similar to today’s EVs. Early brass-era cars were exceedingly unreliable, with Victorian-age technology and metallurgy and only a casual understanding of electricity. I mean, how reliable is your car if you have to hire a mechanic to ride with you? This is why Carl Fisher started the Indy 500, to give automakers a proving ground and marketing avenue.
I’d say that most consumer products- from VCRs to microwave ovens to victrolas- were plagued with design and manufacturing issues when new. But after a few design cycles, they figure it out.
I was going to ask for an article on all the internal combustion cars currently available that also have recalls and issues with them, but of course there won’t be any ICE cars to list since the car industry has been making them for 100+ years and surely they’ve ironed out all the issues by now. With over 100 years of experience every single ICE car rolls off the manufacturing line in perfect, flawless form.
Right? ….Right?
let me google that for you
https://www.axios.com/2022/07/29/electric-vehicle-recalls-evs-gas-cars-suvs-trucks
I think you replied to the wrong person.
Jokes about British cars and electronics are not only “a bit cheap”, but are also not necessarily relevant to the Jaguar I-Pace. It is built in Austria by Magna, a Canadian company.
Built by Megna…
Designed (including catalogue engineered) by Tata > Jag
eHypermania.
Working at a GM dealer in 1981, I personally witnessed frequent new Chevette door windows falling out, alternators dropping out the bottom of the car on test drives, and headlights barley hanging in place. A Pontiac 2000 had the whole dash shake and fall right off after start-up. Buick Skylark windshields would crack on a moderately warm day (87ºF). There’s a ton more that I can’t recall. Ecars are no worse, minus the whole explode in flames thing, but the 1st gen Fiero was good at that too. I had the fortune to watch one burn on side of the highway; good times!
Missed the Hyundai Kona 1st gen complete main battery recall on all units I believe, from the first couple of model years.
I wonder how much of these issues are because they’re EVs or because they’re entirely new platforms, and at least have completely new drivetrains.
Like the Leaf, the battery company probably said they’d be fine without liquid cooling, after all look at all those Prius batteries that did fine without it.(while being a completely different composition). Now Nissan(and EVERYONE) knows better.
This is like figuring out the best valve configuration for early engines, and the troubles with that, sidevalves were really reliable, overhead had some teething problems but then became the standard, even with interference designs. Some makes are still having issues with making quality engines/transmissions
But yeah, they have been having some major trip ups, and Tesla’s just going the Microsoft route, quality isn’t a factor as long as people are buying it.
Eh.. Hyundai took decades working on the Theta engine and still couldn’t make bearings that don’t eat themselves, and had to recall MILLIONS of cars and deal with class-action lawsuits. Again, basic ICE engines, not brand-new EV tech causing less than 10,000 cars to be recalled across all the brands listed here.
It just makes for a good headline, gets the clicks etc.
This is completely false information. Offensively wrong and ignorant, and you should be absolutely embarrassed to be propagating it.
The issue with the Theta engines was always process fuckups. Which have nothing whatsoever to do with component quality. Absent a machining process that leaves metal in the oil galleys, the Theta is an extremely stout engine.
the issue is the company did not properly vet the process and the metal you speak of did get into the engines. Design is only so good if you cannot build it properly to last.
Here’s a link to help you out:
https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/cars/news-blog/report-engine-issues-will-cost-hyundai-and-kia-2-billion-in-q3-44497178
Here’s another about how they got a record fine because they knwe about the issue and didn’t fix it:
https://www.safetyresearch.net/hyundai-kias-billion-dollar-engine-problem-that-broke-the-nhtsa-civil-penalty-barrier/
There’s more out there a quick Google search would show you.
As far as why exactly this happened, I’m sure every one of these owners cares deeply about it when their engine drinks a quart of oil per 1k miles before seizing on the highway. Again, this is not a brand new engine, the first ones came out in 2007 AFAIK.
That is why I decided we probably aren’t buying any Hyundai/Kia vehicles anytime soon.
I guess same could be said for GM and the dreaded DFM and 8 speed shudder, or the Triton Ford cam phasers and later coolant eating ecoboosts with the power shift DCT that was a massive failure. Let’s also not talk of the hybrid maverick with it’s leaking Ice engine (causing fires under the hood) or the Ice 2.7 Broncos with the same failing oil seals on the engine…that has passed to the Raptor R now as well BTW.
I have no love for EV’s, but I can certainly say the recalls lately are not all EV. but since EV’s are still such a small percentage and also volume of what is sold, they should be a lot better.
Yeah, why should we even expect decent quality anything eh?
This is fine.
I heard from a reliable source (Facebook and confirmed on Twitter ) that the manufacturers are doing this on purpose. This way the dealers get a lot of service business. Then the dealers invest a bunch of money upgrading their service departments and on site charging. Then the manufacturers make extremely reliable cars and the dealerships go bankrupt. Then the manufacturers buy all of the former dealerships for pennies on the dollar, buy off the politicians to get rid of franchise laws, and they get to sell directly like they really want. It’s perfect!
From Facebook and Twitter… so… from UNreliable sources then…
So… here’s a thought I just had…. wouldn’t EV battery quality improve overall with economically feasible battery recycling technology?
I mean if the monetary cost of manufacturing a bad cell is reduced (ie, if the materials can be recovered and re-used cheaply), then they can afford to have higher QC standards, right?
Numbers. Would be great to compare the number of recalls for all clean-sheet automobiles and light trucks introduced in the last, say, five model years, and then break out ICE, hybrids and EVs. This article focuses on EVs recalls, which is fine, but without context the article is a demonstration of perceptual bias or motivated perception.
I think a more wholistic view of recent clean-sheet vehicle recalls would result in the headline, “This Giant List Of Defects Proves That The Entire Automotive Industry Has Trouble Building
ElectricCars”This article is less about the hard numbers, and more just highlighting that damn near every EV has suffered from some kind of significant defect at a time when a) EVs are under the magnifying glass more than ever and b) These automakers are trying to establish themselves as compelling EV manufacturers, in some cases in their very first effort. And they’re blowing it.
But I am an engineer, and love numbers. And I do agree it would strengthen the article. As such, I’ve added a quote from Axios. It includes the numbers you’re looking for, and it backs up the article.
Thank you for your feedback, by the way. We appreciate that around here. Also, we love EVs around here. Hell, we love all cars around here. I want that to be clear!
Thank you.
Those numbers still don’t “prove” much – but it at least is the kind of information people here love.
I think that many people are also so used to bad-faith bullshit arguments about EVs (like this crap: https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/21606960/find-my-ev-with-no-batery/) where the conclusion is usually “Welp, guess electric cars are BAD!” And I can assure every reader here that this isn’t the case with us.
As David said, we’re all pro-EV around here, and certainly for reducing emissions from transportation so our kids will have a better future. But there is value in pointing out the common issues the industry is facing as this tech becomes more widespread, especially for buyers who will want to know this stuff. None of that should be taken as an argument against EVs; not at this place, anyway.
Thank you David and Patrick for your thoughtful responses. The additional information from Axios provides context to round-out the article.
The reader-author interaction I see here is one of the reasons I keep returning. Thank you!
It seems a bit disingenuous to place Rivian and Toyota/Subaru on the list for suspension and unintended wheel release issues. Is this something that is due to it being an EV, or a new clean sheet design? This doesn’t really answer the question posed in the title. I think we can all agree that new cars are not really living up to the promise of amazing quality (I’m looking at you delaminated Bronco roof).
Came here to say this. Not to defend EVs but to point out that the automakers of the world are increasingly foisting over complicated garbage on us. There are fewer cars that are as blatantly bad as in years past, but I think this is just masking the fact that a lot of them are poorly designed and built junk. I don’t think any of the automakers are concerned with making a product that will actually last, and while planned obsolescence has always been a part of this industry, now more than ever it seems like automakers are taking the tech approach of filling intending for the consumer to be forced to replace their product within 5 or so years.
Given the way this industry is going, it’s hard to get excited about cars in general, let alone EVs with no soul. But it’s not fair to say they’re any worse than the crap that already exists.
But according to the numbers, they may be (for now).
it also would be skewed a bit. their are just far fewer EV models and QTY of each so far. in theory the low volume high price nature of the majority of the EV market should ensure higher build quality, but it does not it seems. GM learned on the Bolt and it is seeming pretty trouble free now, but the Hummers are all on hold in a lot due to potential water in the battery issues and the Celestiq is also super low volume (1000 in a year) due to quality issues.
Toyota is right 😀
EV tech isn’t mature yet, and even Toyota can’t make a good one yet. It will be awhile before an EV has the reliability people expect from Toyota.
It’s a mind-numbing own goal on Toyota’s part to have gone from lug nuts to wheel bolts for the first time on the Buzzy Forks/Ask Your Doctor About Solterra. Building a first EV is a big enough undertaking without throwing in a new system entirely unrelated to electric propulsion.
I have wondered if some of the EV problems have to do with an attempt to shove every kind of electric device and technology into the cars? I am fine with stalks to signal turning but no got to electrify that experience. I know radios are electric but the human interface doesnt need to be. Dials and buttons are intuitive and beloved. Nope gotta electrify them son of a bitches. People like a decent entertainment screen performance. Nope we need a 60 inch screen in there with 1080 dpi, and about 2 dozen speakers. Hey how about a Roomba automated vacuum system? Comes out and cleans your car when parked. Frankly cut out all the unnecessary BS would probably get you another 50 miles of range.
100% agree. We LOVE our Kia Niro EV, but that thing’s learning curve was stupid. We came from a 2019 Kia Niro Hybrid to the 2023 Niro EV, and it was going from a bicycle to a motorcycle. Plus, it really sucked since we had the first batch and there was nothing out there for the 2023 regarding materials. The videos, guides, etc. were all based on the 2022, and so no menus, buttons, etc. lined up until a couple months later. Even the dealer didn’t know 99% of what the car could do. Not great, since we were first time EV buyers and had zero idea what we were doing.
They went from the rotary phone to an iPhone 14, and forgot the Razr.
I like this take a lot. In an EV, I want nothing more than for Jeep to yank the Pentastar V6 out of a manual Wrangler, and drop a similar performance motor in its place. A proven drive train with a good known chassis. Don’t change anything else, it already works!
I guess I’ll beat the dead horse and point out that a vehicle named after lightning causing fires is not, in fact, ironic.
Irony would be if you named such a car after a *firefighter*.
“Ironically, the Ford F-150 Deluge of Suppressing Foam edition has been hampered by self immolation issues.”
“Ford has pledged to resolve all quality issues in the new F150 Halon edition.”
“… uh, sir, about that …”
“GODDAMNIT.”
How the heck did this get posted while my commented always get blocked.
Design team: How about giving us a way to report spam like this? Thanks!
Ford will soon announce that the F-150 King Ranch Edition will be replaced by the F-150 Lightning Red Adair Edition. It’s prescribed especially for owners of Kia and Hyundai models that are particularly susceptible to spontaneous combustion.