Good morning, and welcome to another Shitbox Showdown! Today, as promised, we have two vehicles that both run and drive just fine, and both have manual gearboxes. First, however, there is the small matter of yesterday’s busted cars to finish:
Yep. Transmissions are marginally easier to swap than engines, so that makes sense.
Now, I can tell by the low vote total and comment count that yesterday’s matchup was a bit of a flop. Not quite a Cop Rock-level flop, but a flop nonetheless. That’s okay. Nobody gets it right every time, and what’s interesting for me to write about isn’t always something you all can get behind. I’m still trying to figure out a way to allow reader submissions; we’re just not there yet. Until then, if we have a slow day, I’ll just try something different the next day.
Like these two, for instance. Two five-door hatchbacks, arguably the most convenient automotive form factor, both equipped with five-speed manuals, which feels like the right number of forward gears. Three or four leaves too many gaps between ratios, and six can sometimes get confusing. Even better, both of these five-door five-speeds are five-by-five mechanically. Let’s see which one you prefer.
2004 Chrysler PT Cruiser – $2,850
Engine/drivetrain: 2.4 liter dual overhead cam inline 4, five-speed manual, FWD
Location: San Mateo, CA
Odometer reading: 105,000 miles
Runs/drives? Great!
The first PT Cruiser I ever saw looked exactly like this: pearl white, with a five-speed manual. It was at a dealership in Illinois, and the window sticker carried a markup higher than the price of this one. There’s a lesson about patience in there somewhere, I think.
These days, PT Cruisers are a dime a dozen, but that’s not a bad thing. The styling may not be to everyone’s taste, but it’s a practical little wagon that, with a manual, is actually kind of fun to drive. It can carry a ton of stuff, it gets decent mileage, and parts are cheap and plentiful. Get past the jokes and the old-person stigma, and embrace the funny-shaped little wagon life.
This PT is in great shape, and is only a little past a hundred thousand miles. It has the basic naturally-aspirated 2.4 liter engine, the aforementioned five-speed, and a really cool shifter with a simple round white ball for a shift knob. The seller says it runs great, just passed a smog test, and everything works. (The ad reads like a William Carlos Williams poem for some reason, but we won’t hold that against the car.)
The inside is tidy, the ouside is essentially straight, and the paint is still shiny. Obviously there are plenty of things that should be checked out before purchase, and I’d ask when the timing belt was changed, but this looks like a good deal to me.
2008 Saturn Astra XR – $3,450
Engine/drivetrain: 1.8 liter dual overhead cam inline 4, five-speed manual, FWD
Location: Vallejo, CA
Odometer reading: 165,000 miles
Runs/drives? Sure does!
Saturn made their name with homespun tales of honest little cars, venturing forth from their factory in Tennessee to take on the big world. “A different kind of car,” they said. But as the years went on, Saturns became less different from the rest of GM’s lineup, hawking badge-engineered Chevy vans and slightly modified Cobalts. Towards the end, however, Saturn replaced the dull and weird Ion with something a little more special: a rebadged German Opel called the Astra.
In sharp contrast to the PT Cruiser’s retro pastiche, the Astra is sleek and modern, at least by the standards of fifteen years ago. Even now, it looks pretty good, but that might say more about today’s over-styled cars than anything. The Astra is a popular car in Europe, but it never caught on in the US; Saturn moved fewer than 20,000 Astras here.
Which is a shame, because by all accounts, it’s a great little car. I’ve never driven one, but I once spent a week driving its little sibling, the Opel/Vauxhall Corsa, all over England, and thoroughly enjoyed it. The Astra’s sole engine in the US was a 1.8 liter four, and while it was of course available with an automatic, this one has the correct number of pedals.
This Astra is in good shape, with only a few signs of wear inside, and mostly clean and shiny paint outside. The front bumper shows some fading, and it looks like the drivers’s seat could use some spot remover, but otherwise it looks pretty good. The seller says it runs well, and like the Cruiser, it also just passed a smog test. It has a few more miles on it – 165,000 – but it wears them well.
There’s no reason practical everyday runabouts can’t be fun. All it takes is a manual gearbox, a tight zippy chassis, and enough room to carry whatever needs carrying. We have two styles for you to choose from: a hot-rod throwback, or a sleek modern European. Which flavor do you prefer?
(Image credits: Craigslist sellers)
Strangely, this was a harder one than I thought it would be. I actually don’t hate the PT – if you can get beyond the jokes and the stigma, it’s a very useful vehicle at the core. This one’s in the kind of shape that you’d expect from someone who hasn’t driven it much (AKA – older). The Astra doesn’t stir me much, but it can do much of what the PT does. Mileage and front bumper aside, it has one major thing going for it that the PT doesn’t….alloy wheels. Yes, this highly superficial concern is the thing that pushed me over to the Saturn. By the time you try to shed the stigma of a base level PT – ostensibly the cheapest version of the cheapest car – by putting wheels on it, you’d be over the price of the Saturn.
Astra, immediately.
The answer is always whatever is against the PT. Joyless trashmobile that is a severe pain in the ass to work on.
I’ve riden in several Astras, with smallers and bigger motors. The 1.8 should suffice for some engaging drive, it is a very competent handler and it still looks good. That’s where my vote went.
The PT is pretty nice too, with the 5sp, but I doubt it’s as engaging to drive as the Astra. It got extra points for the Williams Carlos Williams reference.
If it weren’t for the social stigma, I might pick the PT Cruiser just for its low price and pristine condition, but the Astra is actually desirable. Two winners.
I love Saturn. All my homies love Saturn. It’s the Astra by a country mile. Not only do you have cool European underpinnings but you have a cool American badge as well. This is a room temperature take in enthusiast circles but it bears repeating: Saturn didn’t deserve to die the death that they did. They were way ahead of their time pretty much across the board and it sucks that they got unceremoniously GM’d.
Also my grandma drove Saturns until the day she passed. Other than a period where she briefly had a Cadillac Catera she always had a Saturn sedan as far back as I can remember. I have fond memories of being schlepped around as a kiddo in them…and probably being yelled at and being told to stop being a weird little ping pong ball of energy with my cousins. Saturns are love. Saturns are life. Make economy cars cool again, goddammit.
I owned three consecutive Saturns. I was swayed by their simple packaging (analogous to Honda in their “We Make it Simple” days), good quality, inexpensive upkeep, and — this is very important — EXCELLENT dealer sales & service experience.
I’m for the Astra, especially if the price could be haggled down a bit. Having driven both a manual Astra and its Corsa kin, I think it’s a better proposition than the PT.
In this case, looks like either one would be good. The Astra chassis is better, though. And I have a thing for hatchback sedans that the Cruiser doesn’t quite satisfy.
This is so easy for me. I have never been a fan of the PT’s looks and the Astra is downright good looking by comparison. Astra all day.
I’ll chime in to up the comment count for Mark. Was all set to vote PT since I actually like the design, and with a joy stick it looks doubly good. But I don’t think I have ever seen an Astra, and why not try out new things.
I’ll never pass up a clean PT Cruiser, unless it’s for something cooler.
A Euro-special Opel that’s no SL2 is not cooler. Especially with a sunroof.
PT all day!
Actually, I think it’s a Vauxhall, but that still doesn’t change my opinion on a badge engineered Saturn.
Loved my 95 SL2 and wanted the Astra when it came out. Voted for it based on nostalgia, but reality is the PT is the better choice for parts and support, and probably usability.
Chose Saturn as I hate PT Cruisers. The PT was a joyless, soul sucking experience.
The Astra is fucking awesome, and a MUCH better car! Also, it has that huge sunroof too 😀
At the time, it was the smallest and cheapest car to offer such a cool sunroof.
Too bad we never got the Saturn Astra Redline aka Opel Astra OPC, Vaxuhall Astra VXR with the 2.0T that GM uses a lot. But it can probably be swapped in pretty easy 😉
These are both good options, and I don’t have the ‘butt of the joke’ attitude about PT Cruisers that a lot of the Online Car Community does.
I don’t like PT Cruisers because they’re Chrysler products and one of the first wave of re-categorizing passenger vehicles as trucks to cheat emissions requirements.
If both options are equal otherwise, I’ll go with the non-Chrysler.
(If you must know, all the Chrysler products I have owned have broken down inconveniently and expensively.)
I came in expecting to vote for the Saturn but the stick on the PT fixes a lot of what sucks about it, and I have to imagine parts are way easier to find vs. an Opel that was brought over for a couple years. PT for me.
I’m not digging the Astra’s higher price, higher miles, or the crotch-area stains on the driver’s seat. The PT Loser pulls a rare upset today!
The idea of paying 3.5k for a 15 year old Astra is absolutely insane from where I’m sitting in the UK, but it’s not a PT Cruiser, so it’s got that going for it.
Ad Astra
I spent 2 years living in Europe from 2005 to 2007. For a whole year I drove that exact Opel Astra, and I LOVED IT! I even did a “spirited” drive with a group of enthusiasts around the Alsace region for France, it was amazing. There is just something about driving a car with the pedal literally floored in 5th gear on the Autobahn bouncing off the rev limiter for miles and miles and miles. Just amazing. It just would not go any faster.
There’s no doubt that the Astra is a better car; European DNA will almost always trump something that is based on a Neon.
But in the here and now, this PT is a little cleaner and has 50% less mileage. It also has parts availability that the Astra can’t touch, especially considering that Saturn sold so few and there was no Chevy or Pontiac version.
Gotta go with the PT since this one could keep going for a very long time.
I disagree, the Opel Astra with it’s weak little 1.8 (100ish HP) is not the best choice. They only brought those to America in very small numbers for 2 years near the end of Saturn. the Massive globs called headlights date the appearance really badly. However if the 21 and newer front end would swap out on this old Saturn I would say it would be desirable.
The PT is older, and the 2.4 Global Motor has plenty of issues too, but with only 100K on the clock and a 5 speed, it would probably be the superior family hauler for a while.
I would not consider buying either though I suppose.
The Saturn Astra made 138hp from the 1.8, which was on par with the competition at the time (Civic, Corolla, Cruze, Mazda3 2.0, etc.). The PT actually made more at 150hp, but it’s still wrapped in the hate/love retro body and a product of Chrysler.
What do you mean by “Global Motor”?
Am I mistaken? Is the 2.4 not the World Gas Motor from the 2000’s?
Chrysler has used no less then 3 different 2.4’s.
The original 2.4 (it’s name is up for debate tbh) debuted in the mid-1990’s. It was used it the Cirrus/Stratus/Breeze in the beginning. Eventually, it found its way into the Wrangler, Liberty, Caravan, & PT Cruiser, where it lasted until 2010 in the PT Cruiser.
The 2nd 2.4 is the World engine, originally found in the Caliber/Patriot/Compass, of which the 2007-2014 Sebring/200/Avenger and Journey also got.
The 3rd one is the Multi-Air/Tigershark FCA uses to this day, although this is likely it’s last year.
Astra all day long. NO ONE wants a PT…
Or a Saturn unless it is a redline and convertible roof, or three doors and a supercharger. The Sporty version of the Ion trumps this lump all day every day.
I’ll take the Saturn, please. IMO it looks much better and – despite having more miles on it – is arguably in better shape (with the exception of the e-brake boot).
Actually the Saturn would get my vote anyway because it is not a PT Loser. I had one of those as a rental car (automatic) and it was not pleasant to drive despite being nearly new. When I left the airport in it, I was driving very cautiously in an unfamiliar area. After I had my bearings, I started to put my foot down a little more, and…
Nothing happened. The accelerator was basically a volume control: more pedal generated more noise but no more oomph. Maybe the 5MT would be better but I’m not willing to take that chance [in this completely hypothetical debate].
You would probably hate this Opel too with an auto, just saying
That PT doesn’t stand a chance
Believe it or not, there was a time when I was legitimately interested in buying an Astra new or lightly used. The European hatch styling was eye-catching and it seemed like a good value too. Overall, I’d say it’s appearance has aged decently and I’m not aware of any major drivetrain faults, especially with a five-speed. It’s better than the gawky PT all day and every day of the week.
The stickshift Astra wagon is cool and all (very cool in fact, almost enough to make me vote for it), but a stickshift PT is #1 on my list for potential Chumpcar/Lemons builds.