Home » Ford Probably Can’t Build Maverick Trucks Fast Enough

Ford Probably Can’t Build Maverick Trucks Fast Enough

Ford Maverick Tmd
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Sorry, you delightful, compact pickup-loving sickos. Ford’s adding shifts, hiring employees, and apparently doing all it can to keep its small Maverick truck on dealer lots. It’s not working.

I’ve definitely contemplated trading my family Forester for a Maverick, especially now that you can tweak them to run super fast, but the availability hasn’t been great. I shopped some local dealers to see what they had and, while trucks were available, limited supply and high demand has sort of cut into the extremely reasonable prices.

Vidframe Min Top
Vidframe Min Bottom

While we’re on the topic of deals, Chinese suppliers say they’re getting a raw deal in Tesla’s price war, we may be dealing with a charging war for ten years, and an RV company is trying to close the deal with its own customers.

NOOOOOO FORD MAVERICK NOOOO!!!

Maverick 1 1024x576

The good news is that Ford’s boosting production of the Maverick at the same Hermosillo Assembly plant in Mexico where it also builds the Bronco Sport. In fact, the supply chain issues that have made it difficult for companies to prioritize affordable vehicles have started to wane a bit, and production is slowly rising.

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The bad news is that it’s probably enough given all the pent-up demand. Ford Authority was paying attention during Ford CEO Jim Farley’s annual shareholder call and caught this important tidbit:

“Yeah, we’re going to have a capacity increase in July at the plant,” Farley said while speaking during the automaker’s annual shareholder meeting. “That’ll help. Unfortunately, we completely under-called the demand for Mavericks. So, I’m not confident even with the capacity increase that we’re going to have a lot of Mavericks available to everyone. We still have – look, we have a ten day supply of the vehicle. You can find Mavericks. The capacity increase will help, but clearly, the vehicles hit a really positive nerve, especially with the U.S. consumer. And we’re doing everything we can to increase, especially our supply chain, to increase the production.”

I mean, you coulda just asked me. I’d have told you it would be super popular. He’s right, though. You can find a Maverick if you’re willing to pay a premium. It may not be until 2024 or 2025 until the trucks become affordable.

Also, if you own a Maverick Hybrid, congrats, there’s another recall (or if you own a hybrid or PHEV Escape). Here’s the report from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration:

Ford Motor Company (Ford) is recalling certain 2020-2023 Escape, 2022-2023 Maverick, and 2021-2023 Corsair vehicles equipped with 2.5L HEV or PHEV engines. In the event of an engine failure, engine oil and fuel vapor may be released into the engine compartment and accumulate near ignition sources such as hot engine or exhaust components, possibly resulting in an engine compartment fire.

Oh the fun of early adoption. In addition to getting Ford Mavericks on dealer lots, Farley has previously pledged to clean up the automaker’s iffy quality record, which can be seen pretty clearly here in this NHTSA graphic:

Screen Shot 2023 06 06 At 8.57.41 Am

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That’s a lot of Ford. Currently Ford has the top spot among manufactures in the Untied States when it comes to most open recalls with 27. GM, which makes more cars, only has nine open recalls by comparison.

Chinese Suppliers Say They’re ‘Blood Donors’ In Price War

Hydrogen 1
The pretty face of hydrogen: the Changan Shenlan SL03 hydrogen sedan.

We’ve written a lot about the Tesla Price War, and not much has changed lately. Prices are still extremely low and I’m still begrudgingly encouraging friends who want EVs to cross-shop the Model Y because the deals are too good.

You know who the deals are not good for? Chinese suppliers.

It’s easy to think that, say, Chevy, builds an entire Camaro. That’s not how it works, though. Chevy may design and assemble the Camaro, but a new car is just an amalgam of OEM-built and supplier-provided parts. A car’s wheels, tires, transmission, seatbelts, airbags, seats, glass, catalytic converter, headlights, and battery all could come from a supplier, just to name a few parts.

For years the Chinese government heavily subsidized both the production and purchase of electric vehicles in a (successful) strategy to make the Chinese the leaders in electric mobility. Now that those subsidies are disappearing, automakers in China are doing what they can to keep prices low for consumers who have been trained to assume EVs are affordable so they don’t have to drastically cut back production. The easiest way to do that? Squeeze your suppliers!

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There’s Reuters story about it today and it’s interesting to see how the suppliers are working the refs. Ultimately, China is a state-controlled economy, and suppliers are appealing to the authorities to give them some relief. A letter was sent to the authorities and somehow it leaked:

Reuters confirmed with two supplier sources familiar with the matter that the letter addressed to Changan’s procurement department was sent to the company.

One of the sources said the amount by which Changan was asking suppliers to reduce their prices varied, with some bigger suppliers asked to absorb cuts of less than 10%.

[…]

In the letter, the suppliers said they wanted Changan to reverse the decision, which they said was prompting other automakers to follow suit and ignored the companies’ years of work to support the auto industry.

Over the years, suppliers had become “blood donors” to efforts by Chinese automakers to compete using a low-price strategy, they added.

Bleak.

Wingamm US Wants To Kickstart Its Investment

20230118 123838

One of our most popular stories from the Tampa RV show earlier this year was this Mercedes piece on the Wingamm Oasi 540.1, an adorable little Italian-built van with a high level of design that can squeeze into a small parking spot.

Currently, the company is taking deposits (it says it’s taken about 200 at $14,500 a pop). Mercedes and I spoke with the CEO of Wingamm USA Tony Diamond last week to find out the status on bringing the vans here. He said that the plan is to send U.S. federalized/approved chassis to Italy and have them built there and then sent back, with the first arriving later this summer.

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This is less capital-intensive than trying to federalize the Italian chassis, according to Diamond, but it’s not inexpensive. The company’s solution? It’s doing a public raise using Start Engine (it’s like Kickstarter). So far, about 159 people hav invested $259,430.56 at $5.25 per share.

In our conversation, Diamond admitted the capital markets are tough and it’s not easy to raise funds, so why not try and to take advantage of the public buzz? We’ll keep an eye on it as Wingamm does have a unique product in the space that’s price competitive (if it can keep its costs down) and lots of other startups are facing challenges raising cash.

How Long Will The Charging Wars Last?

Niro S60 Charger

I’ve already put my marker down and said I’d like to see everyone adopt Tesla’s superior car charging standard, but it’s probably not happening anytime soon.

Here’s an analysis from Reuters that has a couple of key points I think it’s worth highlighting:

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Holding back EVs has been a weak CCS charging infrastructure that many complain is inefficient or sometimes inoperable, leading prospective buyers to fear becoming stranded on the road with nowhere to charge.

This is essentially conventional wisdom at this point. Charger uptime, anecdotally, feels like it’s improving, but it’s far from as reliable as the Tesla network. We already talked about the pressure this puts on charging startups, but then there’s this:

“We are now probably locked in to having two separate charging standards co-existing for the foreseeable future,” Consumer Reports senior policy analyst Chris Harto said.

FreeWire CEO Arcady Sosinov said his company plans to offer NACS connectors at its fast chargers by mid-2024, while Aptera Motors CEO Chris Anthony said the U.S. government should invest in the Tesla network if it becomes the predominant standard.

“Because of this announcement … there’s going to continue to be a standards war for a decade or more,” Sosinov said.

For a decade or more! Ouch.

The Big Question

How long will it take for Ford Maverick prices to come back down to normal?

Photos: Ford, Changan, Mercedes Streeter, Matt Hardigree

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Scott
Scott
9 months ago

How long will it take for Ford Maverick prices to come back down to normal?

Sadly, not soon enough for me to buy one.

Two yearly price bumps and now the additional/extra $1,500. to get the originally-standard hybrid drivetrain pushes the once $21K trucklet up to about $26K before dealers pad the MSRP well into the $30Ks. I read everything I could find about it before release, and actually set aside all the cash needed to buy an XL hybrid outright, but was unable to actually purchase one at anything resembling MSRP, so: no Ford Maverick for me.

Given how much over list price most folks paid for them, and the subsequent price increases, I expect that even used Mavericks will remain too expensive for years, which is sad, because it really fit my needs and I was willing to put up with its issues (Ford recalls, cheap plastics, etc…).

As a possible alternative, lately I’ve been looking for a small old (probably Japanese) trucklet instead, but the MPG they manage around town isn’t that much better that the 16 MPG my old Volvo XC90 gets. So, I’m not sure whether I’ll actually be driving an 80s Toyota pickup anytime soon, since the Volvo is safe and comfortable and only marginally less economical (to fuel, not to maintain, though I’ve been pretty lucky in that regard so far).

Last edited 9 months ago by Scott
ScottyB
ScottyB
11 months ago

I have a feeling getting tons of Mavericks (the name still leaves a sour taste, imagine a smaller, more economical junior Mustang at the same price) isn’t Ford’s top priority when they have so many other things they can price gouge more seriously on. Despite the aggravation over the name, I’m sure glad Ford decided to offer this only as a frumpy four-door, had there been a 2-door standard cab option I’d probably be hellbent on buying one.

Last edited 11 months ago by ScottyB
Zeppelopod
Zeppelopod
11 months ago

Okay, but hear me out on that Changan’s design. I like it.

I may be biased because that rear is giving serious 1st-generation Volt vibes, though.

Six
Six
11 months ago

If Ford thinks the Maverick is selling well, imagine what they could do if they sold cheap & cheerful cars too.

Chris with bad opinions
Chris with bad opinions
11 months ago

Define “normal”.

Nlpnt
Nlpnt
11 months ago

The situation that will happen once Maverick has more competition.

Eric Davis
Eric Davis
11 months ago

This is the normal for Mavericks. They either knew this would happen or very quickly figured it out. If anything, they’ll probably go up another couple thousand with the mid-model refresh.

Dodsworth
Dodsworth
11 months ago

The Maverick prices will never come down because Ford will never make enough to meet demand. They never intended to make enough and they never will. I hope I’m wrong but I think I’m right. I’m still flabbergasted by them telling customers in waiting to change their orders to more highly optioned vehicles to help insure delivery. Bait and switch much?

GhosnInABox
GhosnInABox
11 months ago
Reply to  Dodsworth

I should have known. As cars become closer to being gadgets, automakers are approaching production more like Nintendo and Sony.

Pretty soon you’ll have to break a pool cue in half like The Joker and let the winner leave the 6 month pre-order deposit.

Mitch
Mitch
11 months ago

Hopefully Ford sees the light. Despite what F150 numbers suggest, many Americans DO still want smaller, affordable vehicles.

Kill the Escape and let the Bronco Sport take it’s place, and bring us the Puma/Puma ST. Please.

RataTejas
RataTejas
11 months ago
Reply to  Mitch

The Escape and Bronco Sport are the same. Bronco Sport just has it’s Butch skin on.

Mark Tucker
Mark Tucker
11 months ago

Give it a year, maybe two. Then you’ll get sick of seeing them everywhere. The good news is that used Mavericks will be a dime a dozen in the 2030s and 40s. Here’s hoping they hold up.

RootWyrm
RootWyrm
11 months ago
Reply to  Mark Tucker

Here’s hoping they hold up.

<just points at the pie chart>

GhosnInABox
GhosnInABox
11 months ago
Reply to  RootWyrm

Ford + Mexico + Cheap = Ay, caramba!

Parsko
Parsko
11 months ago

The little answer: 420 days?

Gubbin
Gubbin
11 months ago

Wingamm sounds like they have the right idea, dumb as it is to ship a Ram-Fiat twice across the Atlantic instead of using a Fiat-Fiat. I dream about doing the same thing so we can get a nice compact horse-van.

RootWyrm
RootWyrm
11 months ago
Reply to  Gubbin

No, the smart idea would be to have Fiat build them Federalized chassis in Italy, ship them down the street, and then ship them to the US. The problem with that is that it is also the expensive option. Because Fiat is not going to build them Federalized cars without them paying Fiat’s cost to Federalize. Which is going to be extremely expensive. (Altered from original process is ENTIRELY different from OE.)

Really, the smartest thing in some ways would be to just do the whole Federalizing process over in Italy, since in their case, it’s probably fairly minor. (NHTSA is absolutely fucking terrible and hasn’t updated eligibility petitions since 2021.) The problem is that then instead of being able to certify the process of Federalizing? They have to certify the car as a manufacturer.

Even though they’re basically manufacturing an entire car, they’re not a ‘manufacturer’ if they do the Federal conversion over here. But if they do the same thing over there, they’re a ‘manufacturer.’

Yes, the entire thing is a ridiculous Kafka-esque nightmare of complete and utter bullshit.

Gubbin
Gubbin
11 months ago
Reply to  RootWyrm

I would guess they’d have to ship enough Federalized components from MX that the thing would be nearly a CKD anyway.

MrLM002
MrLM002
11 months ago

Anyone at Ford who thought A pickup with 1500lbs of payload that gets over 40 MPG with arguably Ford’s most durable and reliable current production drivetrain for under $25K needs to get their head examined.

Unless the Maverick is a Loss Leader I really don’t understand why Ford doesn’t just convert the Hermosillo plant into making nothing but Maverick Hybrids.

Ford needs to team up with Toyota to make an AWD-e Maverick Hybrid to replace the Ecoboost and Ford needs to build a BEV Maverick that is range and cost competitive with the Nissan Leaf. Such a BEV Maverick would be bought enmasse by Auto Parts Stores, municipal Governments, etc.

Gubbin
Gubbin
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

They’re selling the crap out of Broncos too, from the look of the roads around here. It’s a nice problem for them to have I guess.

MrLM002
MrLM002
11 months ago
Reply to  Gubbin

Bronco Sports? I’ve hardly seen any of them in person, tons of Mavericks though relative to how few are being delivered.

BolognaBurrito
BolognaBurrito
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

See loads of them around my place; certainly a lot more than I do Mavericks.

Brian Ash
Brian Ash
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

Yeah I see many Bronco Sports everytime on the road, usually driven by a middle to late aged woman. I fathom the purchase was influenced by the husband who dreamed about the impossible to get & super exp full Bronco. My question is how many Bronco Sport owners know its made in Mexico?

Nsane In The MembraNe
Nsane In The MembraNe
11 months ago
Reply to  Brian Ash

Hear me out: I think the Bronco Sport rules. It’s enough off-roader for probably 95% of people. It’s surprisingly small. It’s pretty efficient in the grand scheme of things…and maybe most of all it’s honest. It’s unpretentious. It’s cheerful. It’s not threatening and it comes in fun colors.

It’s the car that almost everyone who wants to cosplay as an off-roader actually needs…a lifted hatchback that looks cool. I hope they keep selling well. They’re a damn good product. I saw an anniversary edition in robin’s egg blue the other day and it was like a little jolt of serotonin. They’re little SUV’s with big imaginations, and that’s okay…because that’s all off roading actually is to most people, a fantasy.

Brian Ash
Brian Ash
11 months ago

It seems to get decent reviews and is semi capable off road. If it wasn’t named Bronco Sport I think my view of it would be more positive. The OG Escape was very popular with…. women. I don’t think I have seen the Bronco sport driven by anything but ordinary females. A Bronco Sport to me is a 2 door or short WB version of the big Bronco. Its really the new Escape and the Maverick is the Explorer sport-trac. I’m not one for name games, which is what Ford is all about these days, Mustang Mach-e is the worst.

Turkina
Turkina
11 months ago
Reply to  Brian Ash

‘Females’… are you a Ferengi?

Zeppelopod
Zeppelopod
11 months ago
Reply to  Turkina

I’m glad you mentioned that; it’s what comes to mind when someone unironically says “females.”

Gubbin
Gubbin
11 months ago

I think the 2-door ones look really good. Too bad everyone gets the 4-door ones.

Andy Individual
Andy Individual
11 months ago

But 95% of people don’t buy what they need, they buy what they want to look like they need. 😉

Turkina
Turkina
11 months ago

I have a friend who takes her Bronco Sport to the beach, with a couple of modest modifications. Although it shares a platform with the Escape, the offroad bits do the job for certain tasks.

Pappa P
Pappa P
11 months ago

Definitely sounds like they don’t salt roads where you live.
An Escape/Bronco sport is probably one of the worst purchase decisions you can make in the Toronto area.
Around here those vehicles have a 5-7 year lifespan before corrosion plus mechanical failures send them to the shredder.
The Robin’s egg blue is sweet though.

Ray Finkle
Ray Finkle
11 months ago
Reply to  Brian Ash

Guessing not many! Here in the midwest Ford & GM = American/UAW and everything else is “foreign”.

I was parked behind a new Blazer a few weeks ago with a “I love my American made vehicle” license plate cover.

Greg
Greg
11 months ago
Reply to  Brian Ash

my MIL traded her 2014 1500 sierra for a 2021 bronco sport, maybe a 22, whatever year they first came out, and paid $32 for the pleasure. The sport is basic, but it ticks all her boxes, is easy to get my kids in and looks pretty good!

The truck was my FIL’s before he passed, and this was her first car new she ever picked out herself. So basically the exact opposite of your stereo type ha!

Last edited 11 months ago by Greg
DadBod
DadBod
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

Bronco Sports are super popular in my outdoorsy area, they are giving Outbacks a run for the money

BOSdriver
BOSdriver
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

Bronco Sports are everywhere. Partially skewed by the fact that a house around the corner from me has 3 of them in the driveway.

MrLM002
MrLM002
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

*Anyone at Ford who thought A pickup with 1500lbs of payload that gets over 40 MPG with arguably Ford’s most durable and reliable current production drivetrain for under $25K *wouldn’t sell well* needs to get their head examined.

Dean Reimer
Dean Reimer
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

I knew something was missing, but wasn’t sure what exactly. It could’ve have been “…was a good idea…”

MrLM002
MrLM002
11 months ago
Reply to  Dean Reimer

It’s a race against time to edit before someone replies and the edit button magically disappears -_-

I need to proofread more

Ranwhenparked
Ranwhenparked
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

The absolutely ancient Ranger, with a 1990s body on a 1980s chassis, sold 70,000 units in its last full year on the market, the modern Maverick is a successor to that (since the current Ranger is really a size class larger). How Ford didn’t realize what the market would be, especially now with even less direct competition, makes no sense to me

MrLM002
MrLM002
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

(Replying to myself because apparantly the Bronco Sport is hugely popular and I’m the only one who hasn’t heard and I don’t want to have to reply to tons of people individually)

Seems like all the more reason to make an AWD-e Drivetrain For the Bronco Sport and Maverick Hybrid.

Turkina
Turkina
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

The e-AWD system makes perfect sense for the Maverick Hybrid. It’s the missing piece for world domination.

Njd
Njd
11 months ago

I’m very surprised by some of the comments here regarding the Maverick. It’s a great vehicle that people want to buy and intentionally limiting supply doesn’t really do anyone any good at the level we’re seeing. The dealership I got mine from thinks they could sell 50 a month if they could get them which is way more worthwhile than selling one or two at a markup (fwiw I paid MSRP for mine since it was ordered). And correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t see how marked up prices benefit Ford at all since that all goes to the dealer.

Suggesting that it cannibalizes their own sales is also silly to me. Even though it shares an architecture with the Bronco Sport and Escape, it’s a very different form factor and I’d be willing to bet that most buyers who want one are not going to cross shop either of those two models. The only thing available to cross shop that’s similar is the Santa Cruz and I’m quite confident that Ford would rather sell someone a Maverick than have them go to Hyundai.

I fully believe that they got hit with a combination of some of the suits underestimating the demand, supply chain problems, and not having a lot of competition so buyers are looking to them. Selling more cars is better than selling fewer cars and they put too much effort into this to consider it a compliance car. This isn’t Ford’s first botched release in recent memory either.

Sivad Nayrb
Sivad Nayrb
11 months ago
Reply to  Njd

Paid MSRP for ours from Dealer inventory in April ’22 – no Market Price Adjustment BS.

And FORD Financing for 36 months at 0.9%

Njd
Njd
11 months ago
Reply to  Sivad Nayrb

I didn’t get in until MY2023, delivered about a month ago. If I could’ve seen the interest rate future I would’ve ordered a year earlier!

RataTejas
RataTejas
11 months ago
Reply to  Njd

Got ours at dealer invoice. Lariat Hybrid, ordered in Sept, delivered in Feb. Wife loves it.

Fuzzyweis
Fuzzyweis
11 months ago

I thought I read for every Maverick Ford sells that’s 1 less Escape or Bronco Sport due to them all being the same platform, so thinking it’s more of a, let’s make the more expensive ones instead of a ‘oops, we just didn’t make enough cheap ones you all want.’

If so that’s really disingenuous and bundles the brand in with their price gouging dealerships, it’s all a hustle.

So when will the Maverick’s prices drop? When Hyundai puts a hybrid in the Santa Cruz or Chevy starts selling a Montana here, competition is the only thing that can snap Ford back to reality, right now with the Maverick they have none.

Outofstep
Outofstep
11 months ago
Reply to  Fuzzyweis

If Hyundai makes a hybrid Santa Cruz or even better a PHEV Santa Cruz I will buy one and say Maverick who? I’ve had 2 Hyundai’s in a row. If they make either of the aforementioned Santa Cruz’s it will be 3 in a row. For now a Maverick hybrid or PHEV is at the top of my list. I’m not planning to seriously start looking for a new car until 2026 so we shall see what the future holds.

BOSdriver
BOSdriver
11 months ago
Reply to  Outofstep

Agreed. The PHEV drivetrain in my ’16 Sonata was trouble and drama-free for nearly 80k miles. I am sure the newer ones are as good or better.

Brian Ash
Brian Ash
11 months ago
Reply to  Fuzzyweis

I have been confused on the Bronco Sport vs Escape, thought the Bronco Sport was a replacement for the Escape. That they were just going to capitalize on the “Bronco” name popularity to sell more “new” escapes. The Bronco Sport looks like previously Escapes while the new Escape definitely does not. Also the Maverick is basically the Explorer truck that was popular and discontinued. Either way Ford is just cannibalizing it’s own sales, so of course they want to find a way to drive up prices and profits on them.

Drew
Drew
11 months ago
Reply to  Brian Ash

The Bronco Sport is a way to sell more Escapes. Now you can buy the sleek one or the rugged one.

Brian Ash
Brian Ash
11 months ago
Reply to  Drew

LOL, I’m shocked they didn’t do 20 special and limited editions like the full size Bronco to sucker people out of $10-20k more. No Raptor Bronco Sport Black Canyonero Trail version coming?!?!?

Fuzzyweis
Fuzzyweis
11 months ago
Reply to  Brian Ash

The have the Heritage package so they’re coming, don’t you worry!

DadBod
DadBod
11 months ago
Reply to  Fuzzyweis

There are a couple of the blue and white Heritage Bronco Sports in my town and they look pretty awesome, I have to admit

Drew
Drew
11 months ago
Reply to  DadBod

Heck, I think the Bronco Sport looks pretty cool in general. It’s like the Escape stayed boxy instead of getting sleek.

Jack Trade
Jack Trade
11 months ago
Reply to  Drew

Interestingly, the curvy Escape (which I disliked when it debuted but have been reevaluating now that the Bronco Sport is out) is actually getting fairly carlike. Parking next to one the other day, it’s only a few inches taller than my Focus.

I wonder if in like 5 years, the Escape will basically be a hatchback car.

Outofstep
Outofstep
11 months ago
Reply to  DadBod

I saw a Heritage edition in blue for the first time on Sunday and thought that it looked clean. If I was in the market for a Bronco Sport that’s the one I’d get.

LTDScott
LTDScott
11 months ago
Reply to  Brian Ash

Bronco Sport is putting your Escape in an Otterbox case. I still think they’re cool.

Nsane In The MembraNe
Nsane In The MembraNe
11 months ago
Reply to  LTDScott

As I said in my above comment…I’m here for the Bronco Sport. I love it, in fact. In a sea of angry greyscale blobs it’s a cheerful little pop of fun that doesn’t take itself too seriously. Who cares that it’s not Rubicon worthy…almost everyone buying RUGGED TRUCKS never actually takes them on anything more than a gravel road anyway.

The Bronco Sport is honest. It has the look but underneath it’s just a normal crossover, which is exponentially easier to live with for most people than a BOF truck. It lets folks have some fun and let their imagination run wild without having to commit to a bunch compromises…and I’d rather folks who want to cosplay as off-roaders drive a small, relatively efficient lifted hatchback then buy goddamn 4Runners to take to the mall and back.

And you know what? If you’re one of the 3-4 people that actually do want to get their feet wet off-roading the higher spec’d ones are more than adequate. They’re capable enough to let you mess around on some light to moderate trails or get you to the campsite in comfort.

Last edited 11 months ago by Nsane In The MembraNe
Jack Trade
Jack Trade
11 months ago

And it’s the same basic concept as the original Bronco II from the ’80s, just in a waaay more safe setup.

(which is why I’m sad Ford is dropping smoke metallic, as it’s a nicely modernized version of a typical color in which you’d see the II, back in the day)

TurboCruiser
TurboCruiser
11 months ago

I’ve already put my marker down and said I’d like to see everyone adopt Tesla’s superior car charging standard

This was a bad take and you should feel bad

JaredTheGeek
JaredTheGeek
11 months ago
Reply to  TurboCruiser

This is a bad take and you should feel bad.

TurboCruiser
TurboCruiser
11 months ago
Reply to  JaredTheGeek

Yeah I remember you from last time, simping for the Tesla standard lol

Nlpnt
Nlpnt
11 months ago
Reply to  TurboCruiser

Biggest problem with the Tesla standard is Tesla. It may be technically superior but it’s hard for the legacy automakers to risk adoption when Elon could pack up his ball and go home at any point.

GreatFallsGreen
GreatFallsGreen
11 months ago

No doubt they’re milking every dollar they can out of it going by the price increases. But, playing devil’s advocate, it’s very possible Ford underestimated demand, because they thought it would generate interest in the rest of the lineup. A typical person might find the $19,990 Maverick neat, but then think “oh an enclosed cargo space makes more sense, and I really want pushbutton start and this and that feature” at which point it’s a $30k vehicle…so what about an Escape. Or a Bronco Sport, which I have been seeing a TON of. Or a Ranger, but that’s still more expensive so doesn’t seem likely

The mid/upper $20k range used to have a lot of sedans and a lot of those buyers switched over to Escapes, RAV4s, CR-Vs – so not an impossible idea to think people that didn’t have a truck before might stick with what they were familiar with when it came down to it. I think the Civic was one of the most common conquests for the Maverick in the end, and it’s looking to be more of a gateway vehicle to truck ownership for people, which would also be potentially good for Ford if they could actually get them in people’s hands.

Unclesam
Unclesam
11 months ago

Honest question: Are buyers asking for push-button start? Is this a dealbreaker feature for a statistically significant number of people? TIL, i guess…

V10omous
V10omous
11 months ago
Reply to  Unclesam

I personally will never buy a keyed start again and don’t think it’s even close.

Push button ignition is one of the great automotive advancements of my driving life, no sarcasm.

Stig's Cousin
Stig's Cousin
11 months ago
Reply to  V10omous

I’m curious as to why you like push button ignitions so much? I have one vehicle with push button ignition and the rest use keys; I don’t dislike push button ignition, but I don’t see it as a major improvement over keys.

MrLM002
MrLM002
11 months ago
Reply to  Stig's Cousin

I like the security of a physical key, also for that matter a manual transmission.

Ben
Ben
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

Hyundai/Kia would like a word about your “secure” physical key. 😛

MrLM002
MrLM002
11 months ago
Reply to  Ben

That’s where the “also” bit comes into play. How much you want to bet that over 99% of those stolen Hyundais/Kias had automatic transmissions of some sort?

Last edited 11 months ago by MrLM002
MAX FRESH OFF
MAX FRESH OFF
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

I have a push button start with a manual transmission car. I also had a 1989 Camry with a physical key and the cylinders were so worn down by the late 90’s that the doors could be opened and the car started by any vaguely key shaped object like a screwdriver.

RataTejas
RataTejas
11 months ago
Reply to  MrLM002

You are aware that there’s no physical ignition anymore. You just turn a key that activates a switch instead of pushing a button that activates a switch.

Salaryman
Salaryman
11 months ago
Reply to  Stig's Cousin

Personally, I can keep the keyfob in my pocket the entire time. My wife can keep one buried deep in her purse. It’s one less thing to worry about.

Stig's Cousin
Stig's Cousin
11 months ago
Reply to  Salaryman

Makes sense. For me, though, I have had trouble misplacing keys with push button vehicles. This typically involves the keys falling out of my pocket while getting in or out of the car. This isn’t a bit deal since the keys usually stay in the car and I notice when I get out and try to lock the vehicle. However, I did have one incident where the passenger had the keys to the car in his pocket (it was his car and I was driving for some reason). I turned the car off a few minutes later and couldn’t turn it on again until he came back. I guess for me, if I have to start using the key I at least know where it is.

GreatFallsGreen
GreatFallsGreen
11 months ago
Reply to  Stig's Cousin

Not a new issue though, I think most cars are starting to work in additional warnings because that was especially common when it was a ‘new’ feature. I worked for a bit as a valet in college ~2009 when smart keys were becoming more commonplace – most newer luxury cars had them and some new non-lux at least in upper trims. That was a frequent warning amongst ourselves to make sure. What was also frustrating was people would slip off just the fob and keep the key part with their other keys – understandably, but then you had a fob you couldn’t really hook on the key rack.

Speaking of – though it’s a keyless system, my VW has a switchblade/flip out physical key. I find the key tends to pop open in my pocket in the most obscure position or halfway open, and then I have to wrestle it out – more of an issue than with the still-bulky integrated key fobs.

Brian Ash
Brian Ash
11 months ago
Reply to  Stig's Cousin

Keys are 2 tech generations old, FOB wireless push button and app based start, you could even throw key card in the mix. Most of my cars are keyless sensing entry and push start, have 1 car with key & remote button entry and another that is key entry & start, it always is so weird in those. Never taking anything out of the pocket is so great like mentioned. Keyless everything is almost two decades old, how isn’t it the standard minimum now. Key provides no security benefit, just ask Kia Hyundai.

Pupmeow
Pupmeow
11 months ago
Reply to  Stig's Cousin

The key fob is attached to a clip deep in the bowels of my purse. I almost never have to take it out. And it saves me about 7,234,029 instances of losing my keys per year.

Stig's Cousin
Stig's Cousin
11 months ago
Reply to  Pupmeow

I can see where a fob would work well for you. For me there is nothing I consistently take with me when I drive aside from my wallet. I think I would like a key fob that fits in my wallet (maybe a key fob shaped like a credit card?). Since I have to consciously remember to take my keys with me, I prefer keyed start since I always know where to look for the keys.

Brian Ash
Brian Ash
11 months ago
Reply to  Stig's Cousin

Tesla started the keycard in your wallet trend, now many lux cars have the option. I have it for one vehicle but never use it.

AC2DE
AC2DE
11 months ago
Reply to  Stig's Cousin

I had an unfortunate twist on the key vs fob question. My Harley has a fob, which is usually very convenient. But, when the fob gets left in the winter jacket (hanging right next to the bike in the garage), it will let you start up and ride all the way to work. Then, it’ll casually inform you that you don’t actually know the “oops, I forgot my fob” code, and you can only make one guess every 5 minutes. I had a coworker give me a ride home.

V10omous
V10omous
11 months ago
Reply to  Stig's Cousin

Others have already answered, but for me:

-Never taking the keys out of my pocket or my wife’s purse.

-No fumbling with keys while wearing winter gloves.

-No sharp keys poking me through my pocket, and a generally smaller key ring.

-The ability to leave the car running, take the keys with me, and lock the doors. This is extremely useful when running errands with sleeping kids for example.

Brian Ash
Brian Ash
11 months ago
Reply to  Unclesam

I can’t believe how many cars are still made w/o push button start. Parents had a rental Camry last year and when I had to move it was like a Camry still has a key?!?! All my cars have had push button start for 15yrs now.

R Rr
R Rr
11 months ago
Reply to  Brian Ash

I got a rental Camry at PHX and not only did it have a key, but also NO ANDROID AUTO!!!

That one was really maddening when doing a lot of driving for the week I was there. I mean the most basic Nissan or VW has had AA/CarPlay for years.

GreatFallsGreen
GreatFallsGreen
11 months ago
Reply to  Unclesam

I cited that one specifically because you can only get it on the top Lariat trim, not even the middle XLT trim. At least at intro IIRC, unless MY2024 frees it up more. I have no research on the matter, nor do I think Ford is losing sales because of it either way, it’s just relatively unusual. Nissan having it since 2007 on Altimas without even having standard ABS is more of an outlier, but many other cars have had it standard starting at least 1-2 trims above base for several years now.

At this point it’s just fairly commonplace to the point many base model cars have push-button start even if they don’t have keyless access (i.e. you still have to click the fob to lock/unlock the doors). I don’t think you can buy a new Honda now with a keyed ignition, for example.

Martin Ibert
Martin Ibert
11 months ago

Tesla builds cars for CCS2 charging stations today. Teslas sold in Europe come with the standard CCS2 charging equipment that is by now in almost universal use here.

TurboCruiser
TurboCruiser
11 months ago
Reply to  Martin Ibert

Yeah most manufacturers use CCS(2). Why on earth would anyone be in favor of a standard that literally only one manufacturer uses. I get being upset with 3rd party charging stations being poorly maintained, but that is a horrible reason to want to switch to a proprietary standard because this one manufacturer has well maintained charging stations.

JaredTheGeek
JaredTheGeek
11 months ago
Reply to  TurboCruiser

NACS is not proprietary and is being made a public standard. It consolidates L1 and L2, is easier to manage and use than CCS. Doesn’t fix the other issues with CCS though.

JaredTheGeek
JaredTheGeek
11 months ago
Reply to  Martin Ibert

Except we don’t use the same CCS as Europe, they have a mennekes plug and we use J1772. CCS is not now almost universal. If you go by install base Tesla is in use by a wide margin. Charging equipment and vehicles.

Canopysaurus
Canopysaurus
11 months ago

Maverick prices will drop and availability will rise when Santa Cruz sales overtake Ford’s as frustrated potential buyers move to the competitor whose prices don’t look bad in comparison anymore and who can deliver a new vehicle now and not a year from now.

Vic Vinegar
Vic Vinegar
11 months ago
Reply to  Canopysaurus

If there was a Santa Cruz hybrid, sure. But I’m sure part of the appeal of the Maverick to many is the hybrid’s fuel economy. The 22 mpg the Santa Cruz offers is not very impressive.

Nsane In The MembraNe
Nsane In The MembraNe
11 months ago
Reply to  Canopysaurus

I don’t think that’s going to happen until they address the powertrains in the SC. The base hybrid Maverick appeals to a lot of people. The base engine in the Santa Cruz is a dog that isn’t even great on gas and the upgraded engine has the car pushing 40 grand and is inexplicably linked to a complicated DCT.

If Hyundai wants to steal sales I think they’d need to move the hybrid engine from the Tucson/Sportage over and offer a very barebones trim with it in the 20s….and since their midsized SUVs are such cash cows I can’t imagine that they’ll want to do that.

Man With A Reliable Jeep
Man With A Reliable Jeep
11 months ago

Ford Probably Can’t Won’t Build Maverick Trucks Fast Enough Because Profits

I know it’s lazy posting, but here’s the obligatory “fixed that for you.”

Last edited 11 months ago by Man With A Reliable Jeep
Arch Duke Maxyenko
Arch Duke Maxyenko
11 months ago

“How long will it take for Ford Maverick prices to come back down to normal?” Probably around Trucktober 2024

Nsane In The MembraNe
Nsane In The MembraNe
11 months ago

I’m not buying this “oops!” bullshit from Farley and Ford. They absolutely knew the Maverick would sell. They’re just doing the same bullshit every manufacturer is doing…limiting supply to drive up demand and prices. It’s a win for them. It’s also a win for their dealerships, who get to keep raking in that sweet sweet markup cash. Really the only people it’s bad for are the consumers…and at the end of the day that’s just how end stage capitalism works. Regular people have to prop everything up with their suffering while a small handful of folks at the top hoard the rewards.

I don’t believe a goddamn thing any of these companies are saying right now. In the eyes of most governments the pandemic is over. The supply chain nightmare is more or less being resolved. It’s not that they CAN’T make the cars people want, it’s that they don’t want to. There’s a big difference, and when the bubble eventually pops they’re going to be in a world of hurt…and there’d better not be any goddamn bailouts this time.

That Guy with the Sunbird
That Guy with the Sunbird
11 months ago

Agreed. And I’m sure the Maverick’s quality problems won’t be exacerbated at all by them supposedly rushing the factory/factories to get them out the door and onto lots faster.

DadBod
DadBod
11 months ago

I’m still pissed at the $40K Lightning bait and switch, fuck Ford

Jack Trade
Jack Trade
11 months ago

Agree and think Ford and others saw the pandemic and related issues as a way to subtly pivot toward a lower-volume-with-higher-profits strategy, hopefully in a way that people didn’t notice/get upset about.

Worked for a bit as a lot of people were still sitting on unspent money from years of depressed services consumption, but that’s ending real fast, so I think those here who’ve guessed it’s a matter of time before they ramp up production and lower prices are right.

Sensual Bugling Elk
Sensual Bugling Elk
11 months ago

The Maverick exists so that Ford can still meet CAFE targets while selling as many up-trimmed F-150 and F-250 commuter trucks as possible. That’s it.

Jim Farley and his underlings take home a slightly more obscene paycheck if Ford avoids CAFE penalties by selling three Mavericks at a slight loss instead of one Mach-E at a big loss, so that’s what they’ll build more of.

Last edited 11 months ago by Sensual Bugling Elk
Drew
Drew
11 months ago

I believe that they thought they could upsell people to Rangers and F150s by limiting supply. Instead, people are waiting for their orders and they can’t make them fast enough. I think they made assumptions about people buying off the lot that aren’t true these days, especially when ordering exactly what you want is reasonably easy.

Still within their control to make enough for demand, but I do believe that they were surprised they couldn’t move people to higher-profit vehicles.

Max Poodling
Max Poodling
11 months ago

I agree with all of these takes except the supply chain being “more or less resolved.”

I work for a consumer packaged goods (food) manufacturer, and while we certainly can *get* our raw materials now, that doesn’t mean they cost a normal amount or come in a normal amount of time – and we’re a major player in our category. The supply chain fluctuations from COVID are going to take years to iron out, and we are only barely beginning to see any improvements now.

Pupmeow
Pupmeow
11 months ago
Reply to  Max Poodling

I was going to type a very similar comment, except I’m a lawyer in the auto industry. Not only are pricing and availability still daily painful battles, but there is no longer any sense of partnership or being “in this together.” Everyone wants to sue everyone else every damn day.

LTDScott
LTDScott
11 months ago

While I can’t disagree, I have been very surprised by how successful the Maverick has been. For years there’s been a lot of talk from keyboard warriors about the lack of compact trucks on the market, I didn’t think all that many people would put their money where their mouth is on a FWD-biased unibody pickup with a 4-banger and hybrid option. I’m glad I’m wrong, I think they’re cool.

I work in the off road suspension industry and maybe I’m just jaded by the many Pit Viper wearing douchebros in this segment who still think if it doesn’t have a V8 and leaf springs it’s not a real truck.

Ben
Ben
11 months ago
Reply to  LTDScott

Keep in mind that the Maverick is also (I believe) the cheapest vehicle Ford sells anymore. The fact that it is also a truck, however compromised, is icing on the cake.

I’m still not sure there’s a big market for smaller trucks that cost almost as much as bigger trucks, but a truly cheap small truck is a pretty easy sell in this country.

PaysOutAllNight
PaysOutAllNight
11 months ago

I get what you’re saying, because it would take a complete idiot not to see the demand for a $19,995 hybrid 4 door truck that gets good gas mileage.

But I don’t agree with what you’re saying because I do think that Farley and Ford management really are complete idiots.

The Maverick is absolutely no surprise to anyone who knows anything about the consumer automotive market and has paid attention to anything at all about it. People have been bitching about the price of four door trucks and their excessive size and poor fuel economy since four door full sized trucks were introduced. And even more so since they’ve become so popular.

Not seeing the demand for the Maverick is almost as dumb as cancelling Coca-Cola in favor of New Coke. The only remaining question is if Ford can recover from failure as successfully as Coca-Cola did.

GreatFallsGreen
GreatFallsGreen
11 months ago

I don’t think Ford expected it to be as popular to truck buyers though. It was tilted more toward people who “didn’t know they needed a truck.”

Sure, then it’s still a value priced entry offering, no compromises against a compact car – sit up high and get 40 mpg! We know people want a more utility-type vehicle given the choice for the price. But then I think it’s more likely that as others also mentioned, Ford kept production low to divert any parts to building more Bronco Sports, which is some $7k? more expensive and has actually outsold the Escape in Q1 this year (granted the Escape is amid a facelift/changeover too).

I can’t blame only Ford for that, since Honda dumped base trims for a lot of models going into the model year and brought them back later, seemingly as a move to keep more parts going to the more profitable trims.

rctothefuture
rctothefuture
11 months ago

The charging standard war is an interesting one, because unlike VHS vs. Beta, HDDVD vs. Blu-Ray and other famous wars it’s one that offers benefits on both sides of the table to “win” the war.

Tesla’s connector offers the most compact size and ease of use. The CCS standard allows you to use any crappy level 1 EVSE up to a full speed DC charging station. Chademo is the standard of Japan and with the pervasiveness that Japanese vehicles have here, it could be argued to be a standard as well.

I think adapters will just be the future for EV owners. Having a Tesla to CCS, CCS to Tesla will be the tool kit of every driver in America in the next 5 years. Companies won’t want to admit defeat and I’m sure there’ll be lots of palm greasing to use each plug type going forward.

Last edited 11 months ago by rctothefuture
NewBalanceExtraWide
NewBalanceExtraWide
11 months ago
Reply to  rctothefuture

But Betamax was better… then again, I’ve also been a proponent of minidisc and Zune, so I probably shouldn’t be listened to. But Betamax was a wider tape with more information. They just wouldn’t let home porno movies on their tapes.

Dinklesmith
Dinklesmith
11 months ago

I loved my Zune HD. I hated that Apple didn’t let you transfer music files back off of your iPod. Their weirdness around permissions made me an android person too (after flirting with a Windows Phone)

NewBalanceExtraWide
NewBalanceExtraWide
11 months ago
Reply to  Dinklesmith

Hah, I was also a Windows Phone user for years. The People Hub is still something I miss.

rctothefuture
rctothefuture
11 months ago

They did let porno on their tapes lol. VHS was more popular due to its longer length, which was appealing to most video producers, including porno.

Paul E
Paul E
11 months ago
Reply to  rctothefuture

Of course — the adult entertainment industry is all about the length.

Last edited 11 months ago by Paul E
Col Lingus
Col Lingus
11 months ago
Reply to  rctothefuture

That’s what she said?

TOSSABL
TOSSABL
11 months ago
Reply to  Col Lingus

If this little exchange isn’t COTD, then there’s a fix in.
I mean, the morning thing is scatalogical; COTD should be allowed to be pornographic, right?

DadBod
DadBod
11 months ago

Zune HD was awesome, I wish I never got rid of mine

Last edited 11 months ago by DadBod
Sean O'Brien
Sean O'Brien
11 months ago

Here’s a good video series on why most of the common myths about why Betamax was better and why it lost the format wars are wrong:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLv0jwu7G_DFUrcyMYAkUPODENwP4gYCmf

Drew
Drew
11 months ago

VHS could offer a full-length film first and opened up their licensing. People wanted to watch movies at home as affordably as possible. VHS won on the things that sold VCRs.

JaredTheGeek
JaredTheGeek
11 months ago

Betamax was not better; people always say this because there was a commercial standard called betacam. Betamax had much shorter recording time and quickly shifted to try to get the same recording duration and its “better” video quality was nonexistent. It also was not that they did not allow porno, there was porno on Betamax. VHS was just more popular because Sony was very strict with licensing the format to other manufacturers, so the price of a Betamax device was much higher than VHS. Porn followed the money and did not define the technology in use. They were actually pretty late to the market.

The major home use driver was the ability to record a football game on one tape, and then the home video market and watching full length movies at home on a single tape really pushed it. By then Betamax has fallen out of favor and their attempts to slow their tape to elongate the duration of time available on it was for not.

PaysOutAllNight
PaysOutAllNight
11 months ago
Reply to  JaredTheGeek

I’ve had both when they were new to the market. Betamax was far superior in picture quality at introduction, and for many years after. Even most “shot on video” VHS productions were done on Betamax and then transferred to VHS during final production and duplication.

Eventually VHS caught up enough in picture quality (S-VHS) that there was little difference. But that was many years later.

Betamax lost because of a wide variety of licensing, pricing and convenience issues like recording length per tape, but provided far superior recording quality when comparing units available at the same time.

JumboG
JumboG
11 months ago

It was all about range. Betamax tapes were always trailing way behind VHS in length of time you could record.

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