Home » The Cheapest New Motorcycle In America Is A $1,200 Bike That You Can Get From Amazon And Looks Suspiciously Like A Honda

The Cheapest New Motorcycle In America Is A $1,200 Bike That You Can Get From Amazon And Looks Suspiciously Like A Honda

Cheapest Motorcycle Ts

An inexpensive motorcycle is a fun way to enjoy the summer. There’s something liberating about being able to buy a new road-legal motor vehicle that costs less than some smartphones do. It’s also freeing when a low price means you don’t cry too hard when a botched wheelie results in broken parts. You, like me, might be tempted to find the cheapest road-legal motorcycle in America. I found it, and you can have it delivered to your house anywhere in America for $939 plus shipping. This is the X-Pro Vader 125 MC-N020, a tiny bike styled suspiciously like a Honda Grom that looks like a ton of fun for the price you pay.

For the past handful of years, Honda has had the market for the cheapest motorcycle in America from a mainstream brand on lockdown. The Honda Navi has been rolling down America’s streets since 2022, and at its original price of only $1,800, no other big-name motorcycle company could touch it. Today, the price has risen to $2,199 before a $300 destination charge and additional tax, title, and fees. Yet, even with the price hike, the Navi is still the cheapest name-brand bike for sale in America.

Vidframe Min Top
Vidframe Min Bottom

The Honda Navi has been a friend-shaped motorcycle gateway drug ever since its launch. It’s slow, forgiving of mistakes, and accessible to a near-infinite number of riders. People who might feel intimidated by a normal motorcycle might feel confident on a Navi. All of that is great!

The Honda Navi. Photo: Honda

But the unfortunate reality with all of Honda’s small motorcycles is that they’re sometimes subject to dealership markups. So, you’ll need $2,499 at minimum just to cover the Navi and its destination charge, then you have all of the other fees and potential markups. If you go to Cycle Trader right now, you’ll find countless dealers automatically applying a markup of $150. Normally, that’s not a lot of money, but it adds up when the base price is just $2,199. So, that’s a shame.

But what if you don’t even have $2,499 plus additional charges to spend on a new bike? What if you had not even half that in cash? Well, that’s where China comes in. While many of China’s motorcycle manufacturers are busy building motorcycles that can flirt with 200 mph, others are still cranking out diabolically cheap bikes.

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X-Pro USA

Bottom Of The Barrel

Last year’s cheapest bike was the X-Pro MC-N025 (below), which was so low-rent that its aggressive cheapness actually gave it a lot of charm.

It featured a classic pressed-steel body, drum brakes on both wheels, and a 154FMI-3 125cc air-cooled single-cylinder engine with 8.3 HP and 6.2 lb-ft of torque on tap. Specs like that are laughable today, especially the fact that it doesn’t even have a front disc brake. I cannot even remember the last time a name-brand sold a motorcycle in America with nothing but drum brakes. As readers note, some scooters still have dual drums, at least. But it was $800 plus $400 shipping on Amazon or $1,119.95 total with free shipping direct from X-Pro.

Belmonte Bikes

Reviews were all over the place, with some folks appreciating the bike’s stone-axe simplicity, cheap parts,  fun ride, and easy wrenching. Others hated how they were constantly broken down, shipped with missing parts, or failed in ways that basically no other motorcycle would be expected to.

Sadly, or perhaps thankfully, the MX-N025 has been discontinued. So far as I can tell, the cheapest road-legal motorcycle that you can get in America in 2026 is the X-Pro Vader 125 MC-N020, which is also sold as the Boom Vader BD125.

Img 3549 1024x1024@2x
Venom Motorsports

This one is interesting because these have been on sale in America for longer than I’ve been a motorcyclist. I remember seeing these for sale when I got my endorsement in 2018! Back then, they were $1,000 plus shipping. Honestly, it’s remarkable that, technically, they’ve gotten cheaper over the past eight years.

So, what is this bike? Well, it’s not an “X-Pro” or a “Boom.” China’s motorcycle industry is chaotic, with more than 200 motorcycle manufacturers cranking out bikes at any given moment. You only hear about China’s most famous brands like Benda, Great Wall Souo, Zongshen, Kove, or CFMoto. A lot of these companies have been making leaps and bounds in increasing performance and improving quality. I stand by my word when I say that my 2024 CFMoto Papio SS was built 95 percent as well as a Honda Grom, but with 100 percent better looks. It even had features that Groms don’t have, like a six-speed transmission and a better top speed. I was blown away by this because it was only in the late 2000s when CFMoto was cranking out trash. I would know, I used to wrench on those little piles!

175bc2c4 81fe 46d5 A90f F4c31a8da1d3.b508b3b6c13e73f1e69d3542e4d9d08b (1)
X-Pro USA

But not every brand has been on that path of constant improvement. It seems a lot of Chinese motorcycle brands are content with intentionally residing at the bottom of the barrel. Most Americans have never heard of the bulk of China’s motorcycle brands, and, honestly, I’m not sure it’s even possible to know all of them. Many Chinese motorcycle brands sell their motorcycles as white-label goods, so by the time you’re buying them, they have been slapped with a totally random, meaningless brand name. X-Pro USA is just a dealer slinging white-label motorcycles; it doesn’t actually make what its name is slapped on. Boom is just a random name.

This 125cc Grom-like bike has been one of the worst label-slap offenders. You’ll find these things sold as X-Pro, Boom, Venom, and other names I’m forgetting. If you’re not into this specific style, you can get a slightly different-looking Chinese Grom-like bike from Tao Motor (below), Icebear, HHH, SSR, Vitacci, and who knows how many other names.

6000000004
Howell Motorsports

Sadly, I could not ascertain which actual company builds the Vader 125 MC-N020. The real manufacturer of these may be DongFang, but it’s hard to say without looking at a certificate of origin. But I can tell you that there’s nothing particularly unique about it. This bike even sports the same 154FMI-3 single-cylinder engine as the X-Pro MC-N025 from last year, which is also housed in other Cheap bikes from China. The Chinese motorcycle companies that live at the bottom of the market share so many parts that the lines between them are as clear as mud.

China has also been building these “Grom-like bikes” since not long after the Honda Grom itself went on sale. As I said earlier, I saw these for sale back when I got my endorsement in 2018. I even came very close to buying a TaoTao Hellcat to add to my collection.

It’ll Force You To Be A Wrencher

Img 3552 1024x1024@2x
Venom Motorsports

What scared me off? Reviews of these bikes have always been interesting. Many folks seem to appreciate that these bikes are crazy cheap, fun to ride, easy to work on, and are built with parts that you can buy on Amazon for peanuts. Some owners even claim that these are faster than real Groms.

On the other hand, you also get what you pay for. Back when I got into Chinese clone motorcycles, I was taught that the first thing that you do when you get the bike is tighten and Locktite every bolt that you see. If you don’t, the thing will shake itself to pieces, and parts will fall off. You’ll also want to give it an oil change at just 100 miles in, because chances are you’ll find some fun stuff in the oil that you don’t want circulating around the engine.

It’s also wise to inspect the wheel bearings, replace the fork oil, and switch the engine mount bolts to a higher grade. While you’re at it, go ahead and upgrade common failure points like the starter, the CDI, the carburetor, the exhaust pipe, the petcock, and even the chain. Even after you do all of that, the bike may still break on you. Or, at least, that’s what it was like when I got into Chinese bikes in 2018. There has been an electric version for years, which is likely more reliable, what with not having an engine and all, but that one (below) costs about $2,000.

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Belmonte Bikes

It’s been eight years, maybe the quality has improved? If the Amazon reviews are anything to go by, the new ones are still rough. One person said their transmission failed at only 3,000 miles in, and they could not find parts to fix it. Then there’s this review:

The main problem I had with the bike is that it arrived with a broken speedometer. It is actually illegal for a manufacturer to ship a vehicle with safety components that do not work. The smart thing to do would have been to return the entire bike right then and there. But instead, I took in mind that I saved a lot of money on this purchase, and went ahead and contacted them and asked for a wiring diagram of the speed sensor. They didn’t have a wiring diagram, so I asked them to send a replacement speed sensor, and let them know the urgency because I cannot ride the bike without knowing what speed I’m going or I’ll get a ticket. It took them 2 weeks to send the speed sensor. They sent the wrong sensor. I then provided them a clear diagram of the correct sensor, they sent the wrong sensor two more times. The fourth time, which is now about 6 weeks later, they sent the correct sensor, and the speedometer still doesn’t work. So I asked for a new gauge cluster, as this is the only other component that could have failed. They sent me a carburetor instead (a full week later, of course). I then had to wait another full week before getting the gauge cluster. After installing it, the speedometer finally started working, however the speed reading is so far off, it’s completely unusable.

And after all this, I was still willing to write a good 5-star review, because otherwise the bike was doing just fine … However, on my way home yesterday, the bike suddenly died and it wouldn’t restart. Luckily I heard a weird hissing sound, looked down, and gasoline was draining out of the carburetor and onto the hot exhaust. I immediately turned the fuel valve off and was very lucky the gas did not ignite. When I inspected the carburetor, I found that the two fuel bowl bolts had backed out. When I inspected the bolts closely, there was no locking mechanism on the bolts, nor was there any Loctite or thread compound of any kind. Let me make this clear; the only two bolts preventing gasoline from spilling onto the hot exhaust had not been properly tightened, and had not been locked in place in any way. This bike has less than 30 miles on it. When I contacted them to let them know that their factory forgot to secure the bolts, they told me it was my fault for not checking them regularly, even though they know from our chat history that the bike is brand new and has barely ever been ridden, because of the speedometer issues.

Update: After only 140 miles, both motor mount bolts sheared off on my way home from work. Total and complete garbage.

Img 3558 53beffa7 D4bf 4b90 A22a 80234b635146 1024x1024@2x
Belmonte Bikes

Another reviewer noted that their bike shipped with a bad clutch and a hole in the seat. One person said that they never got their Manufacturer’s Statement of Origin. Another mentioned stripped bolts and a tweaked swingarm right out of the box. One review claims they’ve never even been able to get their brand-new bike started. Even the five-star reviews mention broken parts galore.

It’s a similar story over on a Vader Facebook group, where even the guys who rave about outpacing Groms still say they had to upgrade a bunch of parts. One dealer in that Facebook group reports a customer with over 25,000 miles on their Grom-like bike.

Still Amazing How Cheap These Bikes Get

So, that’s just a long way of saying that not much has changed from when I first saw these things eight years ago. Yet, I’m not at all surprised. The X-Pro Vader 125 MC-N020 is $939 before $400 shipping on the jungle site, or $1,179.95 directly from X-Pro with free shipping. That’s half the price of a Honda Navi, and you’ll get a bike that has more power, a higher top speed, and a real manual transmission. There are also “fancy” versions of this bike with better quality plastics, like the “Vader Gen III” that costs around $1,899, which is still much cheaper than a Grom.

Boom Vader (1)
Farhan Enterprises

But the big catch is that, speaking from my own personal experience, these bikes will force you to wrench. You will spend a ton of your free time fixing one of these, and you will likely even make some of your own engineering improvements along the way. If you don’t know how to wrench, you will end up learning how because these machines require constant upkeep. In fact, it was owning one of these Chinese clone bikes that led me to teach myself how to wrench on motorcycles. I learned how to disassemble carburetors, how to route hoses, how to remove and replace wheels, how to rewire a motorcycle, and more just from owning a cheap Chinese bike. Honestly, I found it a blast.

But it isn’t for everyone. If you want a bike that will start the second you take it out of the crate and won’t require substantial upgrading to be reliable, just buy a Honda. If you’re strapped for cash, just buy any used motorcycle from a known brand. You can still get Japanese bikes from the 1980s for about the same price as a Grom-like bike. Sure, it’ll probably have rough paint and a few missing parts, but it’ll run, have better performance, and will probably be as reliable as death and taxes. Really, the best reason to buy a Grom-like bike is to get a small motorcycle toy to tinker with while you’re bored.

But, should you? I think that’s going to depend on who you are. I can see owning one of these if you’re a moto masochist like I am. But I’ve also voluntarily owned two Volkswagen Phaetons, so my ability to pick reliable vehicles is suspect, at best. If you’re like me, get one of these, and you’ll probably have fun. If you like getting to work on time, run for the hills and buy pretty much anything else. Either way, I’m still impressed that $1,200 can buy you a brand-new road-legal motor vehicle in America.

Top graphic images: X-Pro USA

 

 

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Phil Ventura
Phil Ventura
2 months ago

my taotao 50 atm is 3 years old, the cheapest scooter on amazon at the time. i have replaced a brake lever and a carburater in it’s lifespan. both items were my fault. i forgot (too lazy) to drain the carb at storage time. a half hour repair. i have rebuilt these carbs in 15 minutes, the pilot jets are very tiny drillings and plug easily. it is no speed demon, but it does run. a spare carb, a spare cdi, sparkplug and coil cost me $30.
i bought the scooter because i’m retired and wanted something to tinker with. u haven’t done anything yet except ride it. one can build a serious scooter engine for less than the cost of a tank of gas in my truck.
some folk are users, some are tuners. guys like me just want to tinker.

Last edited 2 months ago by Phil Ventura
Lotsofchops
Member
Lotsofchops
2 months ago

Bikes are my life and I cannot ever imagine buying one of these. I wouldn’t take one for free. When a wheel bearing seizes or a brake fails and you get in an accident, all the money you saved will be going towards a hospital bill ten fold. There is no world where these are worth it.

John B Patson
John B Patson
2 months ago

Latest Made in China story going round our village. Chap bought a plastic watering can on-line, and first time he filled it up, it broke in two pieces….
Have to be suicidal to ride a motor bike from there.

Robert K
Robert K
2 months ago

I’d trust this like I’d trust those cheap e-bikes all over AliExpress not to burn my garage down while charging.

Christocyclist
Christocyclist
2 months ago

With something like a motorcycle I wouldn’t trust my life on this. Just not worth it. Tombstone would read “He died but at least he saved a few bucks”.

My motorcycle days are behind me and I now ride bikes- gravel, mountain bike and fat bikes. I have wheelsets that cost more than this bike. Not bragging but rather pointing to the fact that I just would never feel safe at speed on something so incredibly cheap. Maybe it’s just me…

Last edited 2 months ago by Christocyclist
Greg
Greg
2 months ago

Honestly, for 800 more, a Honda is 10000% worth it. They will work and never die with minimal maintenance. I had a Rukus 15 years ago in N.C., sold it to a friend out in CO, and he still rides it to this day, and I think maybe its had two oil changes if that.

CFMOTO is making huge gains around me for the last few years. Covid pricing from the usual OEMS were insane and there hasn’t been any real advancement for years in the off-road industry despite marketing lies. CFMOTO stepped into the hole and has delivered reliable enough results that people are continuing to buy them over Polaris and Honda. I am not a fan of China, but they have put real pressure on traditional leaders in power sports.

Last edited 2 months ago by Greg
Chris D
Chris D
2 months ago

It would be much wiser to buy a used Japanese motorcycle with the same money. There will still be the occasional repair to keep the wrenching urge satisfied.
A vehicle that does not function is not a vehicle. These things are unmitigated garbage. A copycat Grom is not a Grom, even if it might go a few miles per hour faster at top speed. They are cheap for the same reasons that lots of stuff from China is cheap, and none of those reasons are good. A motorcycle needs to keep itself together, because your life depends on it when you are out riding.

Buyers would be well-advised to save up a few bucks and buy something trustworthy, of good design and build quality. It’s like the wisdom of buying good quality tools, because the cheap tools don’t last, and you will then buy the good ones, and have spent more acquiring them.

JDE
JDE
2 months ago
Reply to  Chris D

sad part is much like small ATV’s, it seems like some of the Japanese firms have gone the same route and bought the basic stuff from Lifan or Dongfan and slapped there name on them.

Parsko
Member
Parsko
2 months ago

I always chuckle when you say things like “learn to wrench”.
I feel like I came out of the womb with a wrench in my hand, and can (brag??) that I never actually learned, I just did.

I r enigeer.

Shooting Brake
Member
Shooting Brake
2 months ago

I’m really done being impressed by how cheap a product is, especially if it’s complete trash.

RustyJunkyardClassicFanatic
Member
RustyJunkyardClassicFanatic
2 months ago

“hole in the seat”
They probably just ate Taco Bell

“Vader”

“Oh my, my this here Anakin guy
Maybe Vader someday later, now he’s just a small fry
He left his home and kissed his mommy goodbye
Sayin’, “Soon I’m gonna be a Jedi”
Soon I’m gonna be a Jedi”

Hugh Crawford
Member
Hugh Crawford
2 months ago

“the speed reading is so far off, it’s completely unusable.”

I wouldn’t take much faith in anyone who would write that.

If it said that the speed reading is so inconsistent it’s completely unusable.i would respect it.

Accuracy vs precision people!

I’ll take precision every time.

Space
Space
2 months ago
Reply to  Hugh Crawford

What if it was precisely wrong all of the time, it would be annoying still.

Hugh Crawford
Member
Hugh Crawford
2 months ago
Reply to  Space

My best light meter had a a piece of tape with +1/3 written on it and it was fine. All Kodaks pro films were a little off their box speed too.

Oh, cars. The instruments are usually off one way or another on them too. If it actually is important, a piece of tape to remind you works , but really it’s hardly ever important.

Or you by like my uncle and calibrate everything to a foot and recalibrate all day as the tires changed temperature.

Redapple
Redapple
2 months ago

just get the honda. you ll make back the $ at resale.

Hugh Crawford
Member
Hugh Crawford
2 months ago
Reply to  Redapple

I don’t get the obsession with resale value, but I tend to buy used if I can, and keep stuff until it’s trash, so maybe I’m an outlier. Also I always pay cash, which seems to freak people out.

Joe L
Member
Joe L
2 months ago

I’ll stick with the real Honda, even at twice the price of these ersatz bikes.

MAX FRESH OFF
Member
MAX FRESH OFF
2 months ago

Mercedes, you should get the electric version and compare it to the Zero!

Scott Ross
Member
Scott Ross
2 months ago

I got a chinese grom. I call it the chrom. It was so my wife could learn how to use a clutch. It is the biggest turd. Also only a 4 speed. And 4th gear is borderline useless.

B3n
Member
B3n
2 months ago

These are really the bottom of the barrel quality even in the Chinese bike universe.
A Lifan KP Mini or KP Mini EFI, especially an RPS Condor isn’t much more expensive but those last at least 2-3 riding seasons with less things going wrong. By the time you upgrade the parts on the Vader Grom clone, it’ll be just as much, if not more.
Even these can’t touch a used Grom’s quality but those -unsurprisingly- barely depreciate.

Angry Bob
Member
Angry Bob
2 months ago

If 40 years from now you need a piston and rings for a Grom, a Honda dealer will be able to order them for you.

That’s the kind of commitment I would need from a Chinese car or motorcycle company before I would buy their product.

Greg
Greg
2 months ago
Reply to  Angry Bob

That’s a bit much. Are YOU going to be riding that same moto in 40 years? Also, in 40 years your iphone will be a 6-d parts scanner and will print the piece you need for you. Parts suppliers literally won’t matter in 5-10 years, let alone 40!

Angry Bob
Member
Angry Bob
2 months ago
Reply to  Greg

I ride a 20 year old Honda that I expect to keep around for another 20 years, if I live that long.

Greg
Greg
2 months ago
Reply to  Angry Bob

Its nice to have parts, but I really think in the near future, we will be able to make our own. Scan something and send it to your local “print shop” or something. I know we aren’t there yet though.

Jb996
Member
Jb996
2 months ago

Seems appropriate to post this again.

Terry Pratchett, Men At Arms:

Sam Vimes’s ‘Boots’ Theory of Socio-economic Unfairness.

The reason that the rich were so rich, Vimes reasoned, was because they managed to spend less money.

Take boots, for example. He earned thirty-eight dollars a month plus allowances. A really good pair of leather boots cost fifty dollars. But an affordable pair of boots, which were sort of OK for a season or two and then leaked like hell when the cardboard gave out, cost about ten dollars. Those were the kind of boots Vimes always bought, and wore until the soles were so thin that he could tell where he was in Ankh-Morpork on a foggy night by the feel of the cobbles.

But the thing was that good boots lasted for years and years. A man who could afford fifty dollars had a pair of boots that’d still be keeping his feet dry in ten years’ time, while the poor man who could only afford cheap boots would have spent a hundred dollars on boots in the same time and would still have wet feet.

Tbird
Member
Tbird
2 months ago
Reply to  Jb996

Much truth in this, particularly for ‘old money’ types. That’s why they all drove Volvo and Mercedes 40 years ago. Spend more to buy real quality that lasts.

Hugh Crawford
Member
Hugh Crawford
2 months ago
Reply to  Tbird

Exactly.

Burt Curry
Member
Burt Curry
2 months ago
Reply to  Jb996

When I was riding my BMW R1200RT daily, I bought an Aerostitch riding jacket and pants outfit for roughly $1,000. It lasted over 10 years! I explained to an aquantance how good it was, he said the price was really high and stupid. I explained how that worked out to $100 a year, and I was riding way over 200 days a year, so think on how cheap that was per day!!

Canopysaurus
Member
Canopysaurus
2 months ago

These are OK to put on the road, but Kei cars are too dangerous?

Canopysaurus
Member
Canopysaurus
2 months ago

Couldn’t resist.

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
2 months ago

“The Honda Navi has been a friend-shaped motorcycle gateway drug ever since its launch. It’s slow, forgiving of mistakes, and accessible to a near-infinite number of riders. People who might feel intimidated by a normal motorcycle might feel confident on a Navi. All of that is great!”

You meet the nicest people on a Honda.

Ben
Member
Ben
2 months ago

Back when I was in college I was initially jealous when my brother bought a Chinese knockoff 50cc moped that would do 40 or 50 mph while my Honda was stuck at 31…downhill…with a tail wind…if I tucked.

Then it turned out he could almost never ride it because it was constantly broken. I think it eventually got left next to a dumpster when he moved out of college. Meanwhile, my Honda ran fine until the foam air filter completely fell apart because I was a stupid college student who didn’t know how to maintain stuff and never changed it.

The other anecdote I always keep in mind when looking at stuff like this is that a Chinese scooter is one of the only vehicles mustie1 was not able to get running properly, outside of stuff with catastrophic damage (and even some of those ran for him). If that guy can’t keep something like this running, I have no shot.

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
2 months ago
Reply to  Ben

“Meanwhile, my Honda ran fine until the foam air filter completely fell apart because I was a stupid college student who didn’t know how to maintain stuff and never changed it.”

So what happened to the bike after that?

Ben
Member
Ben
2 months ago
Reply to  Cheap Bastard

I’m actually not sure. By the time that happened I no longer owned it and I can’t recall if I ever heard whether it got fixed or not.

Cheap Bastard
Member
Cheap Bastard
2 months ago
Reply to  Ben

As far as fixes go that’s about as cheap and easy as they come. I hope whoever ended up with that bike replaced the filter.

Buy Colorful Cars Again
Member
Buy Colorful Cars Again
2 months ago

Other than their diminutive sizes, I do not understand the point of these. For <$3,000, the used market is incredibly robust, with real brands and actual manufacturing standards.

The risk with used bikes is component failures, but when a brand-new cheap Amazon bike can eat its own transmission in 300 miles.. the paranoia about large maintenance bills seems aggressively misplaced.

I don’t think I appreciate the continual hyping up of these rock bottom rigs when we all know the significant risks and shortcomings. These things are cheap because they’re cheap. There is no deal to be had! If Honda sold you a new Navi with a nonfunctioning speedo and a ticking time bomb underneath your seat, people would be smashing dealership windows.

When so much of the economy feels like a scam nowadays, it’s painfully ironic to me that people intentionally allow themselves to be swindled into buying junk by an attractive price tag. Sometimes you get what you pay for, and sometimes if you can’t afford to pay for “more”, maybe patience really is a virtue

Max Headbolts
Member
Max Headbolts
2 months ago

I agree with this sentiment. I’m also fairly active in several different audio communities, and the turntable groups are rife with people coming to them with no prior experience screaming for help with their new suitcase players that don’t work out of the box, or within weeks of purchase.

Crosley and their ilk are selling literal garbage that goes from a retail outlet to the trash with a brief stop on a consumer’s table top. These seem to be the same level of sales to trash pipelines. Same goes for most of the stuff sold on Temu, AliExpress, Shein, and at a lot of levels, Amazon.

Anoos
Member
Anoos
2 months ago
Reply to  Max Headbolts

Amazon has always wanted to be a garbage marketplace, it just took them time to find enough garbage.

I bought a bootleg full-series box set of The Sopranos on there before season 6 came out (2005ish). It was copied DVDs with printed labels. The front cover of the box had the caption ‘Family Rederined.’

It cured me of my notion that Amazon was any better than ebay or a guy selling things off a blanket near a bus station.

Max Headbolts
Member
Max Headbolts
2 months ago
Reply to  Anoos

Yeah Amazon is very much a buyer beware marketplace, with some level of moderate support in most cases. It was certainly the trend setter for other even cheaper platforms to find a business model in our current markets.

We all win in the race to the bottom! /S

Hugh Crawford
Member
Hugh Crawford
2 months ago
Reply to  Anoos

Amazon is a very good logistics company. They also sell stuff. They also let others sell stuff using the same logistics systems. It doesn’t take a lot of work to tell the difference, and Amazon is easier to get refunds on than Alibaba that may sell the same stuff for half the price.

Anoos
Member
Anoos
2 months ago
Reply to  Hugh Crawford

If I had paid attention, I would have noticed. I don’t know if non-amazon sellers were as easily identified at that time. I knew something was up since it had season five included which wasn’t available on DVD yet. It was cheap enough to just see what arrived. The mis-spelled box cover alone is worth what I paid.

RustyJunkyardClassicFanatic
Member
RustyJunkyardClassicFanatic
2 months ago
Reply to  Max Headbolts

Just curious, what do you think are some good brands of turntables? I’ve debated on getting one of those combo stereos w/ CD/tape/radio plus turntable but never got it- I’m guessing those aren’t the greatest

Max Headbolts
Member
Max Headbolts
2 months ago

I have a Fluance Turntable, which is a newer brand out of Canada made in China. If I had three to four times the budget I’d have a Technics. Audio Technica, Pro-Ject, and Rega are all good options otherwise.

Yeah the combo things are junk and not worth your time, the budget route is vintage on Marketplace or from a local HiFi shop if you like to tinker.

The sticky on r/turntables has a good guide and tips:
https://www.reddit.com/r/turntables/comments/nwdjiw/turntable_guides/

RustyJunkyardClassicFanatic
Member
RustyJunkyardClassicFanatic
2 months ago
Reply to  Max Headbolts

Very interesting…Thank you!

Anoos
Member
Anoos
2 months ago

It seems like the quality of these completely negates the cost savings almost immediately.

I like wrenching as much as the next person, but there is a wasted time pricetag attached to a riding weather day spent trying to get a brand new bike to start and idle.

Nobody enjoys fighting through manufacturer support phone mazes to waste weeks receiving incorrect parts. Regardless of the weather, that is just wasted time.

At least with Honda, I can find a local parts department.

Canopysaurus
Member
Canopysaurus
2 months ago

You forgot the DUI offenders whose licenses have been yanked and pretend these are mopeds to have something faster to get around on.

No Kids, Lots of Cars, Waning Bikes
Member
No Kids, Lots of Cars, Waning Bikes
2 months ago
Reply to  Canopysaurus

I think the top speed and/or engine size is too high/big to be DUI-cycles.

Canopysaurus
Member
Canopysaurus
2 months ago

You’re right, but that hasn’t stopped many from bolting a plate that says moped on the back and trying to get away with it.

Buy Colorful Cars Again
Member
Buy Colorful Cars Again
2 months ago

It’s not that I’m objecting to bikes of this size. I absolutely see the value proposition of a small bike.

What I can’t comprehend is someone in the target demographic deciding to risk their entire investment and their own health and safety over $1,000 difference in price tag. If you want a cheap bike, buy used, if you want a cheap but new bike, buy a Navi.

If you’re in the position where you cannot afford a Navi, then I think it would be more respectable to suggest this person buy a bicycle instead, until they can afford a Navi.

At bottom floor prices, something like the X-Pro MC-N025 just does not offer a value proposition, it offers being the cheapest thing on asphalt with the compromises and shortcomings baked in and the clock already ticking down

Stryker_T
Member
Stryker_T
2 months ago

I cannot even remember the last time a name-brand sold a motorcycle or scooter in America with nothing but drum brakes.

Doesn’t Honda still sell us the Ruckus? I wonder how much it is now if they do and if it’s changed from drums…*opens new tab*

Stryker_T
Member
Stryker_T
2 months ago
Reply to  Stryker_T

They do! as well as the metropolitan, both still with dual drums and like 800 more than I remember paying back in 08 or so.

I had a lot of dumb fun with that thing. I wonder where it ended up.

Last edited 2 months ago by Stryker_T
Stryker_T
Member
Stryker_T
2 months ago

I’m just as surprised as you that it seems they haven’t really updated it beyond adding different colors in over 10yrs.

Jay Vette
Member
Jay Vette
2 months ago
Reply to  Stryker_T

The Navi that is pictured in this very article looks to have drums front and rear as well.

Hugh Crawford
Member
Hugh Crawford
2 months ago
Reply to  Stryker_T

Drums are fine for stopping, slowing down or repeat stopping can be a less divine experience.

A dual or quad leading shoe brake feels great used correctly, and they take much less effort.

Badly made disks may be better than badly made drums, and service is probably easier.

Stryker_T
Member
Stryker_T
2 months ago
Reply to  Hugh Crawford

I don’t remember having any significant issues stopping/slowing in the ruckus, any spills were entirely my fault, lol

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