It’s sometimes hard to write about the Chinese car industry without highlighting comments that can sound a little Sinophobic. China has long since replaced Russia as the only comparable military and economic power in the world, but it’s also a major trading partner. Western automakers made billions of dollars selling cars in China and now, faced with the threat of Chinese automakers selling cars outside of China, are begging for tariffs and restrictions.
The Morning Dump is going to be a little more focused on this issue today, as Chinese President Xi Jinping is coming to Washington, D.C. soon and will potentially be bringing leaders from Chinese companies like BYD and Xioami, which are both essentially banned from selling cars in the US. The reasons for concern are real, of course, whether it’s about security, labor, or unfair pricing. Both former military leaders and current executives are expressing their desire to see Chinese automakers not sell cars here, even if President Trump seems open to the idea of Chinese car factories in America.
Congress may soon pass a bipartisan bill that heavily restricts which companies can sell in the US, though the automotive bill that passed first is actually about AM radio.
Xi Reportedly Might Bring BYD, CATL, And Xioami To The US
I’ve gone for a drive with BYD Chairman and founder Wang Chuanfu and found him to be a very personable and extremely intelligent guy. Chinese President Xi Jinping bringing him along on a trip to another country in order to represent the country’s manufacturing industry makes a lot of sense to me. I haven’t taken a drive with the heads of Xioami or CATL, though I assume they’re also pretty chill company.
However, I’m not sure that I’d bring them to the United States given all the concern, and proposed legislation, to keep Chinese companies out of the country. Reuters has multiple sources saying that Xi might be planning to do exactly that:
Washington and Beijing are finalising a group of Chinese business leaders to join President Xi Jinping’s upcoming visit to Washington, three sources familiar with the matter said, potentially including companies facing US regulatory scrutiny as they seek greater market access.
Final invitations will go out to companies in the coming days, the sources said. The State Department is expected to green-light US visas for the delegation, one of them added.
Leading Chinese electric vehicle manufacturer BYD, opens new tab, smartphone maker Xiaomi, which has also expanded into EVs, battery giants CATL, and Gotion, consumer electronics manufacturer Hisense, automotive parts supplier Wanxiang Group and state-owned Bank of China, and agriculture conglomerate COFCO Group are among companies under consideration, two of the sources and five other people briefed on the matter said.
President Trump has already said that he’s open to the idea of Chinese car companies building plants in the United States, which puts him at odds with most of his party. Americans are also not as interested in Chinese brands, though once they drive one their tune often changes.
When Trump went to Beijing he brought with him leaders of businesses that the Chinese government has issues with, so maybe this is just tit-for-tat. If that’s all this is, it’s completely reasonable in the course of diplomacy to have conversations, even with potential adversaries. Open dialogues are better than closed fists.
Whether you see it as a weakness or a strength, Trump has a flexibility when it comes to his positions, and has historically been persuadable. There is a growing concern that President Trump might be convinced that the jobs that Chinese automakers bring outweighs the risks. Leaders of car companies have been notably hesitant to critique the President, so it’ll be interesting to see their reactions to the White House embracing Chinese carmakers.
[Ed Note: Maybe we force a joint-venture system like China did to western automakers? -DT].
Generals: ‘There Cannot Be A Defense Industrial Base Without A Commercial Industrial Base’
A bipartisan group in the US Congress is close to getting through the Connected Vehicle Security Act, which would make it much harder for Chinese-owned companies or Chinese-built cars to be sold here.
SAFE is a nonpartisan group of former military and business leaders operating a lobbying group focused on “transportation, energy, and supply chain policies” in the United States. They’ve got a letter out in support of the bill, writing that “There cannot be a defense industrial base without a commercial industrial base.”
Modern vehicles are increasingly software defined, collecting large volumes of information through cameras, sensors, internet-connected components, and onboard software. Chinese companies are subject to PRC laws requiring cooperation with intelligence authorities, creating a risk that the Chinese Communist Party (CCP) could gain access to geolocation histories, travel patterns, driver information, and information about surrounding critical infrastructure.
The legislation would also help preserve the commercial manufacturing capacity on which military readiness depends. U.S. industrial supply chains have been eroded for decades by state-backed Chinese competitors, undermining essential defense production capabilities. Domestic auto manufacturing creates critical domestic demand for steel, aluminum, batteries, semiconductors, and other advanced components—supply chains and capabilities the U.S. military cannot sustain alone
That’s the ex-military view, what about current business leaders?
Hyundai CEO Jose Munoz: Tariffs For Thee, But Not For Me
Talking to a Retuers reporter, Hyundai CEO Jose Munoz warned that not imposing trade barriers on Chinese companies was extremely risky:
Munoz said Chinese vehicles are 30 percent to 40 percent cheaper than rival models in some markets, including Italy, Spain and France. That’s despite trade barriers including tariffs or minimum pricing commitments that the European Union imposed on Chinese-built electric vehicles after concluding they benefited from unfair state subsidies.
Britain, which left the bloc in 2020, has not introduced similar tariffs. “The U.K., which in the past was a very profitable, very strong market, has become like China,” he said in San Jose, California. “All the top sellers are Chinese because there are no barriers.”
“So, I think we could expect similar things to happen in the U.S., at different levels, unless there are certain conditions,” he said, referring to measures such as the EU’s tariffs and other market-access requirements.
This is the other type of argument against Chinese automakers that’s fairly common, which is that they receive unfair state subsidies and therefore can charge unreasonably low prices and disrupt any markets they enter.
The House Of Representatives Passes A Bill To Save AM Radio
There’s been a move to discontinue AM radios in cars, which has drawn the ire of legislators. A bill passed on Tuesday would require all automakers to keep AM radio in their vehicles.
“Tens of millions of Americans tune into broadcast AM radio every day,” House Energy & Commence Committee Chairman Brett Guthrie said on the House floor, according to a press release. “Farmers use AM radio for weather forecasts, local information, and crop reports, while older Americans rely on it for local news and programming.
“AM radio is a critical tool for emergency communications. When a disaster hits and a broadband network goes dark, AM radio can continue providing critical emergency information to communities,” said Guthrie, a Kentucky representative.
If this passes the Senate and is signed into law, it would impact automakers like Tesla and Rivian, which don’t offer AM radio across all their vehicles.
What I’m Listening To While Writing TMD
I think you could do worse than a dive on Vine, but “Hollywood” by Marina and the Diamonds is a bop.
The Big Question
What do you listen to in your car? Or are you like David and just listen to silence?
Top photo:
We’ve already let Toyota, Honda, Hyundai/Kia, BMW and Mercedes (and others that don’t readily come to mind) build factories in the US and hire US workers. Built here, sketchy labor laws likely won’t be an issue. The US is actively deporting anyone willing to work cheaply without documentation. My 2001 Jetta was assembled in Mexico and the only costly things that broke and repair were made in Germany.
We like to think we’re pro-capitalism here. So, sure. Why not let the Chinese in. It’s like a same-model race series. Who has the best engineers and assemblers employed? Iron sharpens iron as the Bible says in Proverbs 27.
Perhaps I am naive, but what security threat are cameras and sensors hoovering up intel as I tootle around Tacoma or up and down I-5 to visit family in N California? Maybe some of those sharp engineers become whistleblowers if they see something nefarious in the software. Perhaps we make them use geofencing when near military bases.
There are smarter minds than mine in the industry. Edumecate me.
Whether we like it or not China is our adversary. We’d be giving them more money to build weapons and aircraft carriers while becoming more dependent on them for something as important as transportation.
What do you think happens to Chinese cars here if/when China invades Taiwan? The cars will be connected to the internet.
We will all get videos showing how happy the Taiwanese are to be reconnected to the motherland.
I listen to my little Honda’s engine.
Sirius/XM, mostly the classic rock stations, Conan, and NPR. Underground Garage is my favorite. What other station plays Led Zeppelin, The Monkees, Bob Dylan, Jackie DeShannon, and Vanilla Fudge back to back?
The only ways Trump opens up on Chinese cars will be if:
A) Xi invents a new highest state honor of the PRC, that comes with fancy gold regalia, and presents it to Trump
B) BYD and Xiaomi make a large donation to the new East Wing construction fund
C) China presents him with the gift of a new presidential yacht to replace USS Sequoia, which will permanently retired to the Trump library in 2029
D) Mary Barra and Jim Farley make some comments that can be loosely interpreted as being at least mildly critical of something Trump did
Or, a combination of two or more of the above
I frequently listen to NPR, specifically Wait Wait… Don’t Tell Me, Fresh Air, and All Things Considered. I truly miss Car Talk with the Tappet Brothers (Click and Clack), who I am certain would have an interesting take on Chinese vehicles being sold in the USA at prices likely to undercut domestic automakers.
My wife and I enjoy our Saturday afternoon drives with Wait, Wait, Don’t Tell Me.
You can still get Car Talk through the NPR app. They occasionally post new content along with the old reruns.
TBQ? For my commute,Sirius XM, usually Deep Tracks, Grateful Dead Channel, Tom Petty Channel, Real Jazz, BB King’s Bluesville, etc. For road trips, I’ve got over 1K CDs ripped to FLAC that can be crammed onto a micro SD card for my phone.
I do occasionally listen to AM and FM, mostly for baseball and traffic and weather reports. But all my favorite FM stations, except for the publicly owned jazz one and NPR, have bitten the dust or changed format. Another area that’s been turned into blandness by large corporations.
Right now it seems like half the known universe is made in China. As mentioned elsewhere, let them sell cars here, just put in restrictions on them AND everyone else about data collection. Though I wonder if that genie is too far out of the bottle.
Western/Non-Chinese brands were required to have a JV partner just to operate in China for the longest time. Tesla and Hyundai are the only 2 I know of going solo. Why can’t we just do the same and require they partner with US manufactures to operate? JVs are also how China got so good building cars – they were taught by the best. We could learn a thing or two about batteries and software stacks…
TBQ:
In the new car, it’s Sirius FM until the freebie expires. Usually The Boss Station but also Beatles. Wife preset a lot of stations, and the Deep Cut stations (Classic Rock and new Wave ones) all the way up in the 200’s or 300’s didn’t make the cut, ironically.
In my hand-me-down (from wife): I bring my iPod (still works!) with my favorites, until I go into town (The Valley and over the second hill); then it’s KROQ2. Always some good cuts no longer found on regular KROQ or my local Santa Barbara station (KTYD), which I listen to when I head west (and which I could also listen to anywhere via my phone).
I will be repugnantly not surprised when the orange menace fully allows Chinese vehicles to not only be made here, but sold here even when made in China as all they have to do is present some gold trinket, grandious promise, or just flash the cash, and he will give them anything they want. Should never happen, but with this clown in charge, I won’t be surprised when he does it. Sheesh.
I listen to my local community radio station via the internet through my phone. A local radio station staffed by volunteer DJs 24/7. If you don’t like what they are playing, wait a couple hours and another DJ will come on for a different show. No one tells any DJ what to play or not play (they do comply with FCC rules). Music of the world, voice of the community.
TBQ. CD’s. Lately Florence + the Machine. But since I went into a French rabbit hole musically 20 years ago a lot of Zazie
TBQ? The Pacifica Radio Network.
I’m big on having my tunes going in the car. I have a fairly broad appreciation for music so specifics can vary.
TBQ: I deeply love the sound of the M113 in my ratty-ass Benz, but when I want other tunes I gravitate toward recent melodic stuff. Andrew Bird, Father John Misty, Mitski, but lately I’ve been on a jazz kick. HORACE F**KING SILVER! My word. “Song For My Father” is such an amazing piece. He deserves a wider listenership. Miles and Coltrane are like Jesus and the Holy Spirit. I blast Charles Bradley on the rare occasions I’m happy and don’t care who knows it. Frank Ocean. Tyler, The Creator. Other Odd Future stuff.
On the downbeat I go ‘90s British: Portishead, Radiohead, PJ Harvey (hot take: “4-Track Demos” is her best stuff but a hard listen for the unprepared).
On the more obscure side (and also downbeat) I love Arab Strap (got started on them with The Red Thread… you’ll need to learn Scottish) and the not-so-intertwined bands Okkervil River (the most New York Texan act imaginable) and Shearwater (“Jet Plane and Oxbow” fits right in at a Radwood meet).
One last thing… the demo version of Elvis Costello’s “Green Shirt” might be the best driving music in the world.
Did I screw up by giving what amounts to a playlist? Yeah, everyone’s tastes differ but that seemed to be the point of the query, and the goal of asking “What are you listening to?” rather than the extremely boring question “What do you listen with? I fired off that response without reading the room and then scrolled a bit to see what other people like and got “Sirius” or “Spotify” or “my iPhone with a USB-C cable.” For real? That’s like responding to the question “What do you drive?” with “a car that has four wheels.” C’mon people. Open up. This is a pretty friendly space. I come here to learn stuff.
Alright I’ll play. On a recent trip into the city I took a break from my usual satellite radio to tune into the local FM alt rock station, where they were playing an old 80’s synth pop song I recognized but couldn’t quite place the artist. Turns out it was YAZ, of all bands. So I pulled out my phone and went down the Yaz rabbit hole, where I learned that Yaz went by Yazoo everywhere but the U.S., and that Yaz was actually a Vince Clarke vehicle (Vince Clarke of Erasure, who I am not embarrassed to admit I loved in high school and went to several of their shows). That’s where I also learned that Vince Clarke was a founding member of Depeche Mode (what??) and was actually their lead vocalist in the original incarnation of the band. When they hired another frontman and changed their name to Depeche Mode, Clarke left to start another band, but not before he wrote their first hit single “Just Can’t Get Enough.” Even with all of his multi-platinum success with Erasure, he was inducted into the R&R Hall of Fame not as Erasure but as a member of Depeche Mode. Fascinating!
So…Sirius, then FM, and now Carplay, where I’ve been on an Apple Music streaming bender for the last week listening to Yazoo and Depeche Mode.
Oh, and the “upgrade” Bose sound system in my Mazda must really suck if it can’t even make fluffy synthesizer tunes sound good.
I was super late to that party. I first heard Yaz(oo)’s “Only You” in an episode of The Americans and immediately got a copy of Upstairs At Eric’s.
Since we’re talking software and hardware, I also use Apple Music, but through my phone and an aux cable. Your Mazda’s stock stereo can’t sound any worse than the double-DIN aftermarket units retrofitted to my cars. More than anything else, they taught me to hate touchscreens in cars. Knobs and buttons, please.
When you daily a car with over 350K on the odometer, you listen to nothing but that car because you need to know what new and exciting noise is the NEXT thing you’re gonna have to fix.
Amen brother
Insert “did we just become best friends?!” gif here
TBQ: mostly silence, sometimes music on my Zune.
We do exist. There are dozens of us… Dozens!
Pick one option from column A, and one from column B. No substitutions.