Home » Toyota’s New CEO Gets Serious On EVs, Announces 10 New Models In Three Years

Toyota’s New CEO Gets Serious On EVs, Announces 10 New Models In Three Years

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A pleasant Good Friday to you all, and I hope it means some great driving weather is on tap for you this weekend. On tap for us here at The Autopian: the news, which never, ever stops. Today’s dispatch brings you a big electric vehicle announcement from Toyota; some very disturbing reports about Tesla’s in-car cameras; a contest on which plant will build the new Ram 1500 Rev; and what mattered from this week’s New York Auto Show. Let’s do this.

Toyota Goes Electric, Finally

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Vidframe Min Bottom

It’s a new day at Toyota. Akio Toyoda—the guy who got his family’s company through the Great Recession, the devastating Japanese earthquake of 2011, the global pandemic and subsequent chip shortage, and still managed to launch a bunch of rad enthusiast cars—has stepped down as CEO. He’s staying on as chairman, but former Lexus chief Koji Sato is stepping up to the main CEO role. And today in Tokyo, Sato announced a very aggressive push into electric vehicles.

Toyota has been accused by many (including this author) of being behind the curve on EVs. The company’s argument is that reducing carbon emissions will require many diverse powertrain solutions like hybrids and hydrogen, especially in developing markets where Toyota operates globally. All of that is true. But my counter-argument is that a lot of that was done to boost investment in H2 passenger cars that never caught on, that Toyota was known to actively lobby against EVs in America as a result and that the company’s few electric offerings lag significantly behind several competitors—Hyundai Motor Group and China’s BYD in particular. I’ll let you, a smart, extremely attractive person, make up your own mind there.

But you’d be a fool to think that when the world’s most powerful manufacturing apparatus decides to get serious about EVs, it won’t be a force to be reckoned with. That day has come. The new strategy outlined by Sato today calls for 10 new EVs by 2026—three years away, if counting’s something you have trouble with—including on a new platform than what underpins the bZ4x, Lexus RZ and others. (That platform will see improvements too.) Here’s Sato-san in his own words:

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Firstly, battery EVs. We will expand our current line up by releasing ten new models by 2026, which would amount to 1.5 million vehicles of annual sales. We also have plans to release next-generation BEVs entirely different from those of today―BEVs created by carmakers in 2026. This new generation of BEVs will double driving range by using batteries with far greater efficiency, While also offering designs and driving performance to set hearts racing.

I hope the last sentence holds true; Sato’s a gearhead too, but to Toyoda’s credit, he set that bar pretty high. You may remember that in late 2021, the automaker showed off designs for a whole array of new Toyota and Lexus EVs. Some of those designs were things we’d be interested in, like what’s very obviously an electric Tacoma/Hilux truck, an FJ Cruiser-looking thing, at least one sports car and some rad vans.

I really hope some of those designs see the light of day. I was especially partial to one called Micro-Box:

Yes! Justice for Micro-Box! Also, part of these plans call for a U.S.-built EV (a three-row crossover apparently) to take advantage of the new tax credit scheme. Makes sense. Remember, Toyota’s also doing a big battery plant in North Carolina slated to open in 2025.

But Sato’s not announcing some all-EV pivot. This seems like a more realistic and modern evolution of what Toyoda was arguing, with a mix of powertrains and a specialized use for H2:

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Next, plug-in hybrids. By increasing battery efficiency to extend the EV-mode driving range beyond 200 km, We will reposition PHEVs as “the practical BEV” and will work harder on developing this as another BEV option.

For FCEVs, we will pursue mass production centered on commercial vehicles. As indicated by the blue line on the left-hand graph, one feature of FCEVs is that the energy source, hydrogen, is lightweight, so even when traveling longer distances the vehicle is not as heavy as a battery EV, and less space is required.

Refueling is also much quicker. Taking advantage of these strengths, we will work with business operators to promote FCEVs by starting with commercial vehicles such as medium- to heavy-duty trucks. Additionally, we have started basic research on hydrogen engines for heavy-duty commercial vehicles last year.

For hybrid EVs, we will continue to improve our products with a focus on high quality and affordable prices, by accounting for local energy conditions and customer ease of use. We are also committed to becoming carbon-neutral with fuel options not only for new vehicles but also for vehicles already on the market which sum ups to 20 times more than the new vehicles.

Emphasis mine there because that’s a big shift, away from stuff that never caught on (like the Mirai) toward more commercial applications, which most experts I talk to say is the best use for H2 so far. Granted, Toyota has been working on this stuff for a while (look what it’s doing at the Port of Long Beach) but it’s interesting to hear this get so official. I’m also encouraged by the increase in efficiency for hybrids. Those are still a great way to bring down emissions right now if EVs don’t work for your situation.

There’s more to Sato’s remarks I’m still working through, but I’ll add this tidbit on reorganization from Automotive News‘ Hans Griemel in Japan. It’s about one of Sato’s top lieutenants, CTO Hiroaki Nakajima:

Nakajima, who now leads global product development, said production costs will be slashed by taking the famed Toyota Production System into a new era and with a radical expansion of automation, such as autonomous transport, connected technologies and automated inspections.

“We will completely transform the landscape of our production plants,” said Nakajima, whose in-house nickname is Bulldozer, for his hard-driving approach to product development. He said the way Toyota’s next-generation EVs will be made is “completely different.”

The Bulldozer! Get you somebody on your team named The Bulldozer. Sounds like he gets things done. Anyway, check out Hans’ dispatch here, as he’s been awake longer than I have and his Japanese is better, too. But this is a big shift from Toyota and it’s going to be fascinating to see where it goes in the next few years.

Tesla Cameras Reportedly Spied On Customers

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Each day, a Tesla Model 3 or Model Y becomes more of a screaming deal. But if you get one, maybe tape over the cameras on the car? Or park it facing away from your house? Either way, this report from Reuters is incredibly disturbing:

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But between 2019 and 2022, groups of Tesla employees privately shared via an internal messaging system sometimes highly invasive videos and images recorded by customers’ car cameras, according to interviews by Reuters with nine former employees.

Some of the recordings caught Tesla customers in embarrassing situations. One ex-employee described a video of a man approaching a vehicle completely naked.

Also shared: crashes and road-rage incidents. One crash video in 2021 showed a Tesla driving at high speed in a residential area hitting a child riding a bike, according to another ex-employee. The child flew in one direction, the bike in another. The video spread around a Tesla office in San Mateo, California, via private one-on-one chats, “like wildfire,” the ex-employee said.

[…] “We could see inside people’s garages and their private properties,” said another former employee. “Let’s say that a Tesla customer had something in their garage that was distinctive, you know, people would post those kinds of things.”

Tesla didn’t respond to a request for comment, obviously, because its top guy doesn’t believe in the concept of accountability. But about a dozen former employees are the source of this report, and if a lawsuit hasn’t been filed here yet I’m sure that will happen soon. Worth a read if you own one of these cars.

Who Builds The Ram 1500 Rev?

Ram 1500 Rev Frunk

The electric Ram 1500 Rev is a big deal for Stellantis’ truck brand. Naturally, it’ll be built in America for tax credit reasons, but where? Michigan makes sense but Illinois, home of an idled Jeep plant in Belvidere, wants it bad. This is from Crain’s Business (via Automotive News):

Multiple, independent sources with first-hand knowledge report Illinois has put on a major push for the facility, with talks intensifying and near-daily communication among officials here and in Stellantis.

Illinois’ prospects are said to have been improved by General Assembly approval in January of a major new incentive package for EV producers and part-makers. Included was the creation of a $400 million “deal closing fund” that gives Gov. J.B. Pritzker wide discretion in putting extra cash on the table to lure manufacturers.

Michigan’s recent decision to repeal its right-to-work law also may be a plus, because it equalizes the field between the two states on labor law. And officials in Boone County, where Belvidere is located, have signaled a willingness to consider property tax rebates, sources report.

Everybody wants those EV and battery plant jobs, understandably. Except for Virginia. They’re too worried about communism there. I mean, one day it’s battery factories, the next it’s collective farming and five-year economic plans, am I right? And then people might want things like sidewalks and public transit. Can’t have that!

What’s Good From The New York Auto Show?

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Photo: Patrick George

The 2023 New York Auto Show’s media days wrapped this week. Matt and I were there, wearing cool blazers and paying our respects to the cars. The show isn’t the driver of industry news the way it used to be—no crazy surprise concepts this time and all the “reveals” had been revealed days and weeks earlier—but a lot of important models are on display there now. And as I wrote for TechCrunch the other day, the major trends to watch are that future EVs will be big, crossovers are still a huge deal and nobody’s promising robo-taxis in like two years as they used to.

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Autoweek also has a great roundup of notable vehicles from the show. Some of the ones I liked are that Subaru Crosstrek Wilderness (which is silly but is like, Maximum Final-Form Crosstrek), the Genesis GV80 Coupe (also silly but it looks dope in orange), the Jeep Wrangler updates and of course, the Ram Rev.

What did you like from the show? Are you able to go during next week’s public days? If you can, you should; they have a bunch of EV test tracks there so you can try out several electric models if you’re at all curious there.

Your Turn

Toyota’s strategy shift: What do we think? The question I have is, can Toyota catch up on the EV front? I drove that Lexus RZ back-to-back with the Genesis GV60 and Hyundai Ioniq 5, and I’m sorry to say the Lexus isn’t even in the same galaxy as those cars (though it is nice.) And stuff like the two Hyundais, not to mention a game-changer like the Kia EV9, will be on a mid-cycle refresh or even a new generation by the time Toyota gets its competitive and modern EVs on the road. Can the world’s biggest car company pull this off?

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Stef Schrader
Stef Schrader
1 year ago

Can you really ever call an announcement “getting serious?” Like, Musk pulls things out of his rectum all the time with seemingly no plans to make it happen, so my new standard for seriousness in the EV era is “actually getting things to market.”

I know Toyota is FAR better at that than Tesla is, but also, we’re still waiting on that cool lineup of ideas from 2021 to come to pass. Justice for Micro-Box, indeed! Pitter patter. Stop talking and start building.

Last edited 1 year ago by Stef Schrader
John Riley
John Riley
1 year ago
Reply to  Stef Schrader

Getting things to market: how about _current_ models? When will the scarcity end?

Gee See
Gee See
1 year ago

I for one is looking forward to the competition.. basically Toyota is the underdog. They have been trying to catch up by hiring the Googler to deal with the software side but there is still a lot of institutional inertia. If they suceed even just able match Tesla, there will be bound to be another few business books / practicese as a result. For auto enthusiasts, what’s not to like? It is like Apple vs Microsoft all over again. It really depends how focus Toyota is with BEV.

Last edited 1 year ago by Gee See
Manwich Sandwich
Manwich Sandwich
1 year ago

Regarding Toyota’s strategy shift… sounds mostly good. But instead of trying to make hydrogen vehicles in commercial vehicles work, they should just shut the hydrogen shit down completely. Of course that won’t happen due to the new CEO not wanting the previous CEO to ‘lose face’.

In my view, if hydrogen vehicles like the Mirai can’t make it in the consumer space, there is even less of a chance of hydrogen vehicles succeeding in the commercial space because that segment is much more sensive to Total Cost Of Ownership.

And from a TCO perspective, hydrogen vehicles are greatly inferior to BEVs. Hell… they don’t even compete well with diesel-electric hybrid tech.

Chris D
Chris D
1 year ago

All Toyota needs to do is provide a solar water splitter/hydrogen accumulator to each hydrogen car buyer. They can either mount it on their roof or in their yard, or it could be part of the car itself. Add water to the water tank, it gets split, the hydrogen tank gets filled, and pure oxygen is released.
Larger scale facilities can be mounted in strategic locations along major roadways, just like gas stations.
Nothing to it!

MrLM002
MrLM002
1 year ago

can Toyota catch up on the EV front?

Yes, but only if they build the right BEVs. BEVs that catch on fire all the time because of the desire to maximize the range and minimize the charging times excessively is not the Toyota way. Since the Prius Toyota has been very conservative when it comes to performance and such, and honestly it’s a good blue chip strategy.

So for Toyota this means a BEV that’ll be built for L2 charging, have a very stable battery chemistry, etc. With those restrictions I’d recommend Toyota makes a new iQ but in BEV form. Its only competition in the US market would be the 500e coming in 2024 but the Toyota would likely be much smaller and turn much tighter than the Fiat while having a much better dealer network, so I think it would outsell the Fiat by a massive amount, and of course it would do well in Europe and Japan. It would have a very respectable range and good enough charging times. It’s not a highway cruiser or road trip vehicle, it’s a city car.

I want a new iQ bad. If does what the original iQ does, has AWD-e, uses a tire size you can get snow tires for, and it can tow 1000lbs+ I’ll buy 3 of them minimum.

Chris D
Chris D
1 year ago
Reply to  MrLM002

Electric Tercel wagon for the win!

Ben
Ben
1 year ago

can Toyota catch up on the EV front?

I think the answer to this question is obviously yes. Toyota has a ton of experience with electrified vehicles and when they put their minds to something it tends to be really high quality.

The real question is will they catch up. While they’ve proven in the past that they can build industry-leading cars, they’ve also tended not to bother. Their powertrains have lagged behind the competition for years, sometimes to an embarrassing degree. I’m not sure they’ll be able to get away with that in the EV space where things like range and charging speed are hugely important to buyers. If they think they can keep building disappointment machines like the Bees Forks and be competitive in the EV space I believe they’re sadly mistaken.

Torque
Torque
1 year ago

Toyota is taking a shotgun ‘let’s try all the things’ approach when it comes to their vehicle power sources to see which ones stick & then maybe they will focus on those? I understand they have a multi-10’s of billion $ reasons to stick as closely with ICE as possible and I recall reading they get an incredible amount of sweet sweet government cheese so to speak from the Japanese government for FC research/development.
Above said, even for a commercial vehicle focus, businesses would need to financially justify installation of hydrogen fueling infrastructure at their own facilities at least in the US bc there is basically zero hydrogen refueling stations available commercially.
Unless Toyota wants to go to the expense of setting up their own hydrogen refueling stations (unlikely) or partnering with commercial gas station chains to make hydrogen refueling commercially available which also seems like an expense they wouldn’t be willing to take on.
And on top of this Toyota is going to bring 10 brand new electric vehicles to market in 2-3 years from now? While I like the ambition and would like to see it, I will also believe it when I see it. GM Mary has been making Lots of promises too, talk is cheap, producing physical products (especially as these legacy & startup ev auto companies are finding out) is hard.

Ryanola
Ryanola
1 year ago

I could never buy a Subaru, having eyes and all. What a stupid looking dork box.

PaysOutAllNight
PaysOutAllNight
1 year ago
Reply to  Ryanola

I think the bigger problem with Subaru is the Stockholm Syndrome that the owners suffer.

I don’t know of anyone with a Subaru who didn’t have at least one expensive unscheduled repair before 120,000 miles, and some have had several, yet every one of them plans to buy another Subaru.

Crank Shaft
Crank Shaft
1 year ago

Just no surprise about Tesla spying. Elon Musk has been out of touch with reality for a very long time now and in this case, the rot for sure starts at the top.

Alex W
Alex W
1 year ago

Hey PG, glad you made it to Friday.

Greg
Greg
1 year ago

I’ve been meaning to ask, but wasn’t sure where….

Do you folks at the autopian run into issues with manufacturers not wanting to give you tests on new cars and things like that? I haven’t seen a ton of proof of that, but I’m curious as to how the auto industry treats the new kids on the block!

Spartanjohn113
Spartanjohn113
1 year ago
Reply to  Greg

They’ve mentioned before that PR teams for automakers keep leaving them off mass emails to outlets accidentally. As a new kid, they have to create new relationships to prevent that kind of oversight. I’m sure our guys and gals are working hard and I’m excited to see them continue to expand their first look access!

Greg
Greg
1 year ago
Reply to  Spartanjohn113

Thank you! Good info, must have missed those updates. I think they will be the number 1 car site soon enough and won’t be overlooked. The variety of topics discussed here is much more diverse than other car sites and I love it. Only so many new cars a year to cover.

Fuzzyweis
Fuzzyweis
1 year ago

It’s still fairly early in the EV game, and as a later-comer Toyota can take advantage, they haven’t as they can’t even get frickin’ wheels right, but they still may be able to.

Other than Tesla, the 2010-2020 cars were fairly compliance, the Leaf, e-Golf, even the Bolt had DCFC as an option, and even then not fast DCFC.

2020s I think we’re starting to see what a real competitive EV(to Tesla) looks like, near 300 miles or range, 800v architecture for faster charging, good performance, comfort, etc.

It’s a shame as they had the market with the Prius and could’ve done something like a Bolt EV, which with former ties to GM I’m surprised they didn’t even partner with them and make a rebranded one as a Yaris-E or something, but at least they’re starting to get their butts in gear.

The Tesla spying, is anyone surprised? I’m still thinking that tech Batman had to listen on everyone’s phones is too far off from what the NSA can do. I accept the risk, I even have an Alexa thingy in my office. Coming from a time not long after neighborhood phones were ‘party lines’, I do not understand the expectation people have of privacy with technology, if it has a connection to somewhere else, assume anyone can see/hear what it can. I’m sure Onstar is casually checking in on people too, this should not be unexpected.

Grey alien in a beige sedan
Grey alien in a beige sedan
1 year ago

Now that the cat’s outta the bag here, Toyota needs to sell an actual bulldozer… but it’s gotta be a PHEV prime model.

Frankencamry
Frankencamry
1 year ago

Depending on how loose you want your definition, they sell skid steers and blades for them.

Small, efficient bulldozers that can perform many other jobs seems on point for Toyota.

Torque
Torque
1 year ago

They (Toyota) do sell electric forklifts

Dinklesmith
Dinklesmith
1 year ago

If Toyota gives me a mid sized EV truck with a 6 foot bed for under 40k I’m buying it.

Battery prices have come down enough that EVs should be more cost competitive than they are. I’m guessing the high prices are due to R&D still. So hopefully next generation will be cheaper

Anxious John
Anxious John
1 year ago
Reply to  Dinklesmith

I wanted their Tundra with the hybrid engine so bad and then I saw their pricing for it which just made me laugh. I’m not spending $70K for a stupid truck. I’m right with you on a mid-size EV Truck under $40k.

Marc Miller
Marc Miller
1 year ago

Actually, today is Good Friday, the day that memorializes the crucifixion and death of Jesus Christ. Next Friday is Easter Friday!

I am beginning to think that Toyota may not want to “catch up” regarding EVs. Might they go a different path and stick to hybrids and hydrogen fuel cell vehicles? With the move the Germans made to slow the elimination of ICE vehicles, I think some manufacturers are wondering about the business wisdom of diving straight into EVs when charging infrastructure is going to take so long to develop.

Chris Stevenson
Chris Stevenson
1 year ago

Would there be any supplier crossover between electric vehicle production in Belvidere and the Rivian plant in Normal? Of course, there are plenty of suppliers in Michigan, but having EV parts already being made down the road could push this in IL’s favor.

Gee See
Gee See
1 year ago

There bound to be, but I think it will be all custom made. It seems Rivian is quite intent to do the single supply chain business like Tesla.

Drew
Drew
1 year ago

In my opinion, Toyota should have been making Prime versions of everything already, which would position them REALLY well for a push to electrified everything. They’d capture a lot of buyers who want EVs, but aren’t quite ready to give up gas, plus they’d be well-situated to pivot to full EV.
I’d argue they could still push out more primes now to capture the transitional demographic while they get their full EVs ready for eventual ICE bans. They might also be in better market position when/if those bans get pushed back if they are still offering a variety of PHEVs.

Greg
Greg
1 year ago
Reply to  Drew

Where I am, and how I use my truck I am not ready for an EV. But I would buy a plug in hybrid happily, just not for 70k like they are trying in the Tundra. So until then I keep my older truck that I can afford.

Spartanjohn113
Spartanjohn113
1 year ago
Reply to  Greg

Hoping Ford comes to this realization too. I’m very happy with my Maverick hybrid but if they make a PHEV version of it or the Ranger (which for some reason still doesn’t have a PowerBoost option), it’ll be very tempting.

Greg
Greg
1 year ago
Reply to  Spartanjohn113

100%! It’s still super rare to see a Maverick around here, local dealer has a couple but big markups for this area (5-7k).

Thevenin
Thevenin
1 year ago
Reply to  Drew

Agreed. I can understand Toyota’s hesitancy to pivot to EVs, but I’ve never understood their refusal to fully to commit to the technology they already had.

Less than 1 in 4 Toyota sold in the US last year was hybridized. Their PHEV models are notoriously low-volume (particularly in their base trims), and that’s one reason why I’m driving a Honda Clarity instead.

The grouchier side of me wants to point out that their 2023 Prius Prime is basically a 2016 Chevy Volt under the hood, but I’ve learned something about gift horses and mouths, and I’m mostly just thankful Toyota’s paying attention to that side of the market again.

ElectrifyAllTheThings
ElectrifyAllTheThings
1 year ago
Reply to  Drew

I still can’t understand how Chrysler, Chrysler!, has had a PHEV minivan for over 4 years!, and the biggest Toyota with a plug is the recent Rav4 Prime.

World24
World24
1 year ago

Belvedere wants the REV? I’m sure that any vehicle built in Illinois won’t end up having tons of issues. People bought the Cherokee’s because they’re reliable, right?!
Sarcasm aside, I’d imagine there’s something in the works for Belvedere. With 4 new platforms, and that new EV push for All-American EV’s, Belvedere will have plenty to work with. It’ll probably be STLA Medium cars for North America that’d get built there I’d imagine. Large is already a Canadian thing, and Small will probably be literally every other plant outside of N/A.

Dinklesmith
Dinklesmith
1 year ago
Reply to  World24

Lordstown thought the same way with GM announcing so many new products and got closed anyway. I know how nervous those belvedere workers are

Michael Beranek
Michael Beranek
1 year ago

I suggest an arm wrestling match between JB and the lovely Ms. Whitmer, winner gets the plant.

Grey alien in a beige sedan
Grey alien in a beige sedan
1 year ago

Says everyone from Illinois (where I grew up)… but to give the Michiganders a fair shot, why not make this a 100 yard dash? You could tempt Pritzker to give it his best by putting some polish sassages and italian beefs at the finish line.

Michael Beranek
Michael Beranek
1 year ago

100 yard dash? Might as well be a swimsuit competition.

Cerberus
Cerberus
1 year ago

I always assume that these cameras is being operated remotely. After all, there’s far more value in data mining/spying on people than the BS “safety” reasons they claim, like tiredness monitoring. But, yeah, it’s totally worth it to connect your car so you can get the newest emojis on your on-dash toddler tablet.

Gee See
Gee See
1 year ago
Reply to  Cerberus

Tiredness monitoring won’t work with their type of camera in most of conditions (basically you need ones that can catch the reflection of your retina)

V10omous
V10omous
1 year ago

If “being built differently from other EVs” and “doubling range” reflect a different battery chemistry or some other paradigm-shifting technology, then I’m cautiously optimistic.

500 miles of range at steady 80 mph in zero degrees F remains my threshold to purchase an EV; if Toyota provides that, so much the better.

If the statements are marketing jargon and BS, then I’ll pay as little attention to these new EVs as any others.

Last edited 1 year ago by V10omous
Dinklesmith
Dinklesmith
1 year ago
Reply to  V10omous

My gas car can barely get 300 under those same conditions

V10omous
V10omous
1 year ago
Reply to  Dinklesmith

Your gas car can add 300 more miles of range in 5 minutes at every freeway exit in America.

If that becomes reliably possible for EVs, then I’ll revise my range needs down.

Last edited 1 year ago by V10omous
Rabob Rabob
Rabob Rabob
1 year ago
Reply to  Dinklesmith

Don’t even bother arguing.

Even if they came out with a 500 mile EV, these same guys would just be like, “needs to have 1000 mile rage and I’ll buy it”. These dudes don’t even understand how far the distances they are talking about. 300 miles is Los Angeles to Las Vegas. You don’t have a spare 30 minutes after doing that drive?

Bring this up and they’ll just tell you that they do 500 mile canyon carving drives every weekend.

Last edited 1 year ago by Rabob Rabob
V10omous
V10omous
1 year ago
Reply to  Rabob Rabob

Lmao, you don’t know me or the driving I do. Comical in fact that you think a 300 mile trip is long.

I drive my family several times a year between Indiana and Minneapolis, which is 470 miles and is often in very cold weather, I have young kids that I don’t want to subject to long waits at chargers, and I’m not willing to compromise the manner that I normally do that drive in, which is one brief stop for food and fuel.

But I’m sure your smug attitude of knowing more than I do about what I value in a vehicle will pay a ton of dividends in getting people like me to change to EVs.

Rabob Rabob
Rabob Rabob
1 year ago
Reply to  V10omous

You could just say “i don’t want one” or not say anything at all. Instead of asking for physics-warping vehicles so you don’t have to wait 30 minutes once a year on the way to your ex-wife’s house for Christmas.

V10omous
V10omous
1 year ago
Reply to  Rabob Rabob

I don’t ask for anything my gas cars aren’t already capable of, but keep on making assumptions, I’m sure you’ll get it right eventually, big guy

Last edited 1 year ago by V10omous
Stef Schrader
Stef Schrader
1 year ago
Reply to  Rabob Rabob

I don’t think it’s physics-warping to ask for longer-range vehicles for the masses. It’s impossible to ignore just how terrible our charging infrastructure is in America, so something’s gotta give—either in more widely available fast chargers, or in range. Folks write off range as a dong-measuring contest, but giganto-range EVs seem to be coming along faster than, say, charging infrastructure in rural Texas. (Hell, basic infrastructure in rural Texas is still a big ask. We’ve got some third-world-lite kinda issues down here with stuff like internet and power. But I digress.)

Like, I’d love to have an EV, but I also know I’ve got an elderly parent who lives in a small town that has no places to charge it beyond a slow trickle from an extension cord from the house. The closest listing on PlugShare (a few towns away) is “there are some waterproof plugs on the light posts downtown that you can use,” lol. Most of the others listed in a 30ish-minute drive are on dealership lots, which, okay, but like…not ideal. Plus, maintenance of public chargers is bad all over, even in larger cities. We really need companies to get the uptime on par with gas stations, and soon. I can get a jerry can out to my car that’s run out of gas—running out in an EV ain’t that simple a fix.

This is all to say, the “haters” have some valid concerns here, and there’s no need to be rude about it.

Last edited 1 year ago by Stef Schrader
Goose
Goose
1 year ago
Reply to  V10omous

80 mph in zero degree weather sounds….. dangerous. That’s right at the temperature salt stops effectively melting ice if you’re state uses salt. “I don’t want to inconvenience my young kids by having them wait at a charger, but I’ll happily put them and everyone else on the road at risk to save some time.”

Last edited 1 year ago by Goose
Drew
Drew
1 year ago
Reply to  Rabob Rabob

I did some rough calculations, and found that my use put an Ioniq 5 at time parity with a 35 mpg vehicle, given the number of times I travel far enough to stop for a charge, the tested highway efficiency, and the number of times I would be gassing up for my local driving. Fuel spending, the Ioniq was way better (I’m in an area with a lot of hydroelectric).

My current PHEV wins on time and is close on fuel cost, and is not really up for replacement unless something great comes along or something bad happens, but I was curious (and will be replacing with a full EV when the time comes, most likely).

I told some folks. They weighted their time on road trips as much more valuable than their time driving locally. Personally, I’d rather not stop for gas after work if I can avoid it, and a few times driving 400+ miles straight have let me know I am no longer young enough for that.

Cars aren’t a logic-based purchase for most. They’re going to get what feels like it suits their purposes. I think what is going to change more minds than anything is seeing people talk about how painless a road trip with an EV was or how surprised they were at the capabilities. Unfortunately, we’re still in the stage where a lot of articles are about the problems people had finding working chargers or such. If we can get better at maintaining chargers, it’s going to be a lot easier to convince people an EV will work for them, because they will see it work for others. It will feel safer and more convenient, so whatever math they use to support that will ring more true.

Gee See
Gee See
1 year ago
Reply to  Drew

What I don’t get is why people want to do road trips like they are doing deliveries for AMZN 300-400 miles without a break? The government has wisely put chargers at roadside stops, that can actually be a big bonzaza for big chain restaruants etc. You have a bunch of captive audiences.

Chris D
Chris D
1 year ago
Reply to  Gee See

Some people resist change just to resist change. They likely also stuck with the bottle for longer than most preschoolers.

ElectrifyAllTheThings
ElectrifyAllTheThings
1 year ago
Reply to  V10omous

IRC, Toyota are heavily invested in one of the many startups working on commercializing “solid-state” lithium batteries. Solid-state batteries are significantly more energy-dense, power-dense, stable (aka less explody) than the liquid-electrolyte batteries EVs use currently, but so far have been very small & very expensive, limiting commercialization (e.g. aerospace & medical uses). I guess this statement hints at their confidence in said investment panning out soon-ish.

Nsane In The MembraNe
Nsane In The MembraNe
1 year ago

I’m having very conflicting feelings about the GV80 “coupe”. I think it looks amazing and is the best execution of this concept yet…but I don’t think there’s anything on the road that makes me angrier than the SUV “coupe” nonsense, or “SUCs” (sports useless coupes) as another commenter kindly educated us all on in the initial article. They’re some of the least practical, most wasteful vehicles on the road and they make me irrationally angry. If they make them electrified in some way I might hate them A LITTLE less.

Tesla did something shady and has a frat house culture? Wow. What are you going to tell me next? That healthcare in the US is obscenely expensive? Maybe that water is wet? Sheesh.

Toyota’s push here seems like a whole lot of buzzwords and ambitious goals they’ll struggle to meet in order to save some face. It’s high time they do a 180 on EVs but they’re so far behind at this point that I don’t think they’ll be able to have 10 models in the next 3 years…especially considering their first crack at an EV is DOA. That being said, at least they’re trying and they seem to understand that nothing about the BZ4X is worth keeping around since they’re already working on a new platform.

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