One of the greatest challenges in electric motorcycles is hitting just the right balance of performance, range, and price. There are so many bikes out there that are great, but just cost way too much for what you get. One company thinks it has found a decent formula. This is the HMP Flash, an electric maxi-scooter that you can buy right now from a company in California that has over 70 miles of real-world range, a top speed of 75 mph, and a price that’s around $6,000 for the better version.
Motorcycle companies that sell electric wares in America have found our market tough to crack. The limitations with present-day lithium battery technology mean that electric motorcycles that have the kind of range that recreational riders are looking for tend to cost over $10,000. My favorite electric motorcycle, the Zero DSR/X, is currently going for $20,495. Even my second-favorite electric, the LiveWire One, is $16,499. That’s a discount, too, because in the past, its price was nearly twice that. It’s no surprise that some electric motorcycle brands in America struggle to move inventory.
HMP Bikes of San Francisco, California, normally trades in low-speed electric bicycles and purely urban electric scooters that focus on last-mile mobility. But this month, it’s expanding into a new field. The HMP Flash is a genuine maxi-scooter with a large body and a top speed of 75 mph. But instead of piling batteries into this scooter and trying to market it to recreational riders, this scooter wants to be the ultimate urban machine. At $4,799 for the cheapest version, it seems attractive on paper, too.
A Startup You’ve Probably Never Heard Of
If you’re not a resident of San Francisco, you’ve probably never heard of HMP Bikes before. Even I had to do some research on this company. HMP Bikes was founded in Davis, California, in 2022 by mechanical engineer Peter Chu. This is Chu’s second business after he founded Muncho, a provider of self-service restaurant kiosks.
According to the Davis Enterprise, Chu started HMP Bikes after seeing a need for an affordable moped that could help people reduce their dependence on a car for short trips around towns that don’t have good public transit. HMP’s debut bike was a Class 2 e-bike with a lead-acid battery, a 20 mph top speed, and was built in China by Luyuan. While legally an e-bike, the machine is more of a moped with larger tires and a more substantial body.
Today, HMP sells these moped-style e-bikes as the Liva 7 and the Inno-A. Both of which go up to 20 mph, have lithium batteries, and have quoted range figures of 50 miles and 60 miles, respectively. Both mopeds are similar, but the Inno-A is marketed to people who ride scooters for delivery work.
Until now, the hottest scooter in the HMP lineup was the Lightning, which had a top speed of 56 mph and a range of up to 62 miles. The Flash is a step forward and is HMP’s first product that could be treated like a motorcycle or maxi-scooter.
In A Flash
HMP says that, when designing the Flash, it benchmarked the Honda PCX scooter. The little Honda was HMP’s target because, per HMP, it’s one of the best-selling scooters in America. It’s also a proven platform by the biggest name in motorcycling. So, HMP says it wanted to make a scooter that beat the PCX.
HMP is light on details such as the Flash’s structure, brakes, and suspension, but does say that the scooter sports a rear brushless DC hub motor that punches out 20 peak horsepower when the scooter is equipped with two batteries, or half that when equipped with one battery. Nominal output is eight horsepower. That motor is able to get you to 60 mph in the model with a single battery and a GPS-verified 75 mph in the two-battery version.
If you’re wondering why HMP chose a hub motor, which adds unnecessary unsprung weight, it was supposedly done for maintenance reasons. The hub motor means no drive belt or chain to maintain.
One highlight feature of the Flash is that, under the plastic, sits one removable 3.33 kWh lithium battery or, optionally, two removable batteries. These batteries weigh 40 pounds each and are designed to be hauled into an apartment for charging. The scooter can run on one battery, or use both at the same time. Meaning, if both are installed, both drain at the same time. HMP says that the batteries should go more than 60,000 miles without issues.
These batteries get their power from your choice of charger. The standard charger is an 840 W portable unit that plugs into any 110V outlet. That one takes four-and-a-half hours to charge a pack. Two packs would take nine hours. If you upgrade to the 2kW onboard charger, you get a J1772 plug and the scooter can charge from 20 percent to 80 percent in one hour with one battery or two hours with two batteries.
In terms of range, HMP says that you can expect to get 56 miles out of a single pack at a constant 37 mph, or 106 miles at the same speed with two packs. This range figure also assumes a 145-pound rider. HMP has done some real-world range testing around San Francisco and found that, with a single pack, the scooter should get around 40 miles of range and anywhere between 70 miles and 85 miles with two packs. HMP’s range testing was done with a 200-pound rider who spent 80 percent of the ride in the city and 20 percent on the highway.
The scoot is also tech-laden, and features a built-in dashcam, keyless operation, ABS, traction control, a large infotainment screen, Apple CarPlay, Android Auto, reverse gear, regenerative braking, optional heated grips, and a center stand. Apparently, this scooter was designed primarily for California delivery riders first, and as such, it has a rear platform ready for a storage box. If you’re not a delivery rider, HMP says you can put a child seat on there. I think I’ll pass on that last one.
All of this comes in at 299 pounds with a 31-inch seat height and a 377-pound weight carrying capacity. Storage on the scooter is minimal if you don’t use a rear box. You get 20 liters of space over the batteries, which isn’t enough to store a single full-face helmet.
HMP claims that it was successful in beating the Honda, given the Flash’s slightly higher top speed, ability to hit 60 in 3.69 seconds, claimed greater stability, and lack of need for engine maintenance. However, it should be noted that a Honda PCX can easily go twice as far on a tank of fuel and won’t need two hours to replenish that range. Honda also has a robust nationwide dealer network, while HMP is only in San Francisco. At least, HMP does say that if your scooter needs repairs and only HMP can fix it, they can send a tech to where you live.
HMP has published an unlisted video (embedded below, or click here) on YouTube where one of its representatives spends a lot of time comparing the Flash to the PCX. What’s interesting to me is that, to my eyes, the Flash looks Honda-ish, but it looks like the distant cousin of an ADV160.
Something that’s been curiously missing in HMP’s marketing blitz is who actually builds it. Previously, HMP has said that its mopeds and scooters came from the Luyuan Group, a Chinese company that’s been around since 1997. HMP has a whole blog post about how Luyuan spent nearly a decade developing the liquid-cooled hub motor that HMP uses in its other scooters. Notably, HMP says that Luyuan is “our manufacturer.”
Luyuan does not sell any scooter like this one, but does market itself as an “OEM Partner” that can manufacture vehicles for another company. I’m not really concerned about that. As I have written many times before, China has made strides in its motorcycle and scooter manufacturing sector. Luyuan’s scoots look even cooler than the HMP Flash does! But I do wish that HMP was a little more detailed about the production side of the Flash. The way the marketing materials are written, you’d think that the scooter was made in America. A writer at New Atlas already made that assumption in their coverage of this scooter.
One annoying part about HMP’s advertising is that the website has a section of “Real Photography” that shows “Real riders, real streets.” However, every image URL says “ChatGPT” on it, and the images do trigger AI detectors. The people in these images do seem real enough, so maybe ChatGPT was used to edit them?
Certainly, the image of the Flash near the Golden Gate Bridge (below) is AI-generated or at least has AI-generated elements. In the image, the Golden Gate Bridge’s cables are seen extending off-screen. In real life, the cables connect to the concrete anchors, which were ignored entirely by whatever AI generated this image. I also could not find a road like the one pictured. Finally, the scooter is pictured moving, but the wheels are still.
What’s baffling is that HMP has sold many real Flash scooters to the public, units have been reviewed by YouTubers, and it has even produced videos showing the thing. Why resort to AI? Through a lot more research than should be required, I have at least confirmed that the other images here should be real.
About That Pricing
The scooter’s biggest selling point is its price. A Flash with a single battery and the super-slow charger will run you $4,799. This is a launch price, and HMP suggests that the price could later be $5,199. If you want it with two batteries and the 75 mph top speed, that will run you $5,799. The version that has both batteries and the 2kW charger will run you $5,999. HMP claims that the non-introductory price for these scooters is $6,699 and $6,999, respectively. But the company gives no indication of whether or when the introductory price will end.
HMP even claims that its scooter is cheaper than a Honda PCX. Apparently, the company called around and found out that the out-the-door price for a new PCX in San Francisco can be around $6,500 after Honda’s required destination fee plus setup fee and other dealer fees. To HMP’s credit, it doesn’t load you down with fees. If you get the top-spec Flash, you pay $5,999 before tax and registration, but no hidden fees.
However, HMP’s claim that its scooter is cheaper is only true if you don’t have it shipped and you buy during the promotional period. The company charges $400 to ship within California or $600 to ship nationwide. Likewise, unlike buying a scooter from a dealer, you can’t negotiate with HMP. So, is this truly cheaper than a PCX? As my lawyer would say, “it depends.”
There is not a large market of electric maxi-scooters in America. There’s the CSC E-RT3, which is made in China and claims a top speed of 85 mph or a range of 124 miles for a price of $7,295. However, you cannot buy that new anymore because CSC Motorcycles recently closed up shop.
There’s also the BMW CE 04, which is faster than the HMP Flash and has roughly similar range, but costs an eye-watering $12,195. I suppose you could also draw a comparison to the Ryvid Anthem, which is faster than the Flash, charges much faster, and has roughly similar range, but runs $7,995. That one also has a motorcycle form factor.
Could Be A Barrel Of Fun In A City
I think, then, that the HMP Flash’s price isn’t that offensive. Yes, like many electric bikes, you don’t get a lot of range for your money, and this one can’t even be charged quickly. But if you’re in the market for something like a brand-new Honda PCX, it is theoretically possible that it’ll cost the same as a Flash. The keyword there is new, because the second you hit the used market, the Flash loses its edge. Used scooters often have low miles and cost half the price that the Flash does.
Still, challenges aside, I like what’s going on here. If you’re a purely urban rider, and you’re likely to be one on a scooter like this, I think both the performance and range are more than usable. Yet, it also has just enough speed to scoot down a highway for a mile or two as you skip through traffic. Apparently, HMP had more than 100 delivery riders test the Flash out in the months before announcing it, and the riders loved it. So, I guess if you’re in San Francisco and you do DoorDash on a scooter, this might be a good idea.
Personally, what I love the most here is the fact that there are companies out there trying to bring down electric motorcycle prices. Sure, the specs of this scooter won’t blow anything out of the water, but this is affordable enough that, so far as I’ve been able to tell, HMP has actually sold many of these to happy riders already. I wonder if the future of electric motorcycles in America is not $30,000 bikes with donut hole wheels and yet-to-be-seen solid-state batteries, but urban motos with price tags well below $10,000. I’m not sure, but I like this trend. But I do hope to see less AI slop.
Top graphic image: HMP Bikes
What a bad idea. Yes, companies can make something that is dangerous and will result in deaths and injuries, and we collectively don’t have the good sense to prevent it and protect the youngest and stupidest who will be the victims.
Isn’t that how it’s always been? It’s really hard to get stupid people to stop being stupid. At least with motorcycles they usually only hurt themselves.
This article reminds me of an idea I’ve had for ages. No one has tried to improve the basic spark plugs. With all the effort to go electric over ICE is it so hard to create electric spark plugs that you recharge instead of replacing? I would love that for my lawn mowers just to reduce that as a problem.And really is gravity fed gasoline not better than a fuel pump? It’s just these English trying to get us to use the devil’s modern inventions over tried and true methods.
I say time to return to the era where HP was provided by a damn horse not Satan’s fishing lures.
Yes sarcasm or humor for those that were unsure
You had me thinking you had done some serious lines or injections last night, until the last sentence.
From what I have been seeing in the news these things have become the motorcycle vs of the mustang. Antisocial riders, committing felonies, running from the cops leaving injured people in their wake because they can’t control the power.
I take it you need a motorcycle license for this, and obviously insurance.
IIRC, ICE scooters with 49cc don’t need a license, but looks like the PCX is 125-150 cc. Not sure how they regulate EV scooters though since it’s a totally different ball of wax.
I did some reading last night on the subject. As usual, the laws on the matter are a patchwork of such by the various states. Licensing, insurance, registration, required helmet use and age restrictions vary greatly. Chuck all those constraints into a blender and pick randomly, that’s how it’s all set up right now. This is the argument for universal federal laws and regulations. Keep it simple.
I disagree on your assertion that a federal law is needed here.
Everyone has access to the internet I don’t think it is hard to look up the law in your state before you buy one of these.
The benefit of a federal law is that it can be evenly enforced across the land. A patchwork of laws means that it’s very easy for these to be sold in a neighboring jurisdiction and brought over the line. Or in the case of Amazon, just deliver it to the end user because the municpiality doesn’t have the resources to enforce anyway.
Sounds like that’s the state/municipality problem for not enforcing their laws.
The county is too diverse to lump everyone together. Even a single state is too diverse sometimes. There is a suburban city near me that will absolutely impound unlicensed e-scooters. 45 mins away is a rural community of less than 5,000 people where you can pretty much drive anything if you stay off the highway.
If you asked the people of those communities if they would switch they probably wouldn’t and that’s OK.
What you describe is enforcement discretion at the local level – AKA not enforcing their laws. Not a legal framework. The reality is that it’s unrealistic to fund law enforcement to enforce every single thing.
We now live in a world where these vehicles are easily available and do cause problems across the land. Sometimes broad laws are important for the public good even if there is some discomfort around the edges. Any anyway, just get licensed and insured. It’s not that big of a deal.
I would argue that the enforcement discretion at the local level is an example of laws being too broad. If a large majority of people in a 5000 population town want unregulated E-bikes (and UTV’s) then they should be allowed to set their laws that way in that town. It’s a sign that something is wrong with our current framework of laws.
Same way we regulate e-bikes. More than 750W motor and a hand operated throttle = motorcycle.
This thing has a motor bigger than 750W, so it’s a motorcycle.
Did that ever get rolled out federally, or is it still state by state?
“Affordable scooter “ paired with “$6,000” made my eye twitch. I guess Mercedes and I have a different definition of affordable
“Used scooters often have low miles and cost half the price that the Flash does.”
There’s your “affordable”.
It’s over $2K bit cheaper than the Vespa Elettrica 45 – which maxes out at 45mph.
A San Francisco based electric motorcycle company?
You’re bringing up sad memories of Alta-BRD and their fantastic RedShift motocrosser. That bike was pretty much the opposite of this one, all off-road performance and no range, even for its time (15 years ago?) I wouldn’t be surprised if some of the talent behind Alta were involved in this effort.
One day I applied for a job in a CNC machine shop and the owner of the shop was the guy behind BRD. He wasn’t hiring but he was just giddy to show me the early CAD drawings of what later became the Alta. First he made me pinky swear not to tell anyone what he was cooking up, of course.
“The scooter can run on one battery, or use both at the same time. Meaning, if both are installed, both drain at the same time.”
Unless there is an engineering limitation, I don’t see the benefit of this. I’d rather have to lug one 0% battery to the charger than two at 50%.
“In terms of range, HMP says that you can expect to get 56 miles out of a single pack at a constant 37 mph, or 106 miles at the same speed with two packs.”
Two batteries (in parallel) provide the same voltage but add their capacity (amp-hours.) Thus two batteries = more range (and weight.)
Now, there’s a bit of a taboo against mixing batteries with unequal states of charge; the one battery will just become a source for the other until they equalize, not contributing much to the working load.
I’m now at my limit of battery knowledge so I won’t speculate on how this problem can be managed with a Battery Management System (BMS), but I would avoid putting a full battery in there with a halfway discharged one… just seems cavalier.
You could absolutely keep one on the charger and one in the bike and just swap them in and out every 50 miles. I think that’s what you were getting at; why keep two in the bike if you’re just puttering around?
But start out with 2 charged ones with only one connected and switch over and put the MT one on charge. The big issue is the charger and charging speed. Can you haul the charger or maybe have 2, one at home one at work? Will the dead one charge up fast enough to swap when the 2nd one dies? Will any of them burst into flames? You know the usual EV basic questions
Two batteries, in parallel. Each one provides half the current at the same voltage.
Right. But it can also run on one alone. So you could keep the second one as luggage until/unless you need it (to avoid having two half-charged batteries that both need to be topped off). My point is, why not build a switch into the circuitry to give you that option?
Waste of money, better off with a quick disconnect reconnect when you leave the first battery to recharge when you leave. Need to cut out that connection
Extra circuitry adds expense and complexity. Keep it simple, cheap and reliable.
I don’t imagine an automatic switch would add very much cost or complexity. It sounds like a pair of solid state relays (no moving parts) would be the most expensive part at $20 or so.
This is like a restaurant with 2 pots of coffee. If you keep pouring out of both when you run out you need to make one pot then another and by that time you got another 2 empty pots. But you pour out of the oldest pot then when MY start brewing a 3rd pot while using the 2nd pot. That way less likely to run out and less likely to have old coffee when it slows down. Ask a friend in the restaurant business if you doubt me.
If you can only connect one at a time just like an electric drill. Use one then when dry hook up the other one and put the first one on the charger so can keep on the road full time charging times, availability etc depending
There’s a food delivery driver in Los Angeles who did a pretty good video review of this scooter on his YouTube channel:
This Electric Scooter is a GAME CHANGER!
If this had existed, I might have bought one instead of my ADV 160.
I’ve been keeping my eye on used Livewire prices, as a 2nd bike. The ONE is weird in that it can only do Level 1 or Level 3 charging. You can use a Level 2 charger, but it only provides L1 speeds. But I’d probably mostly charge at home anyways.
If they were around $6k that’d be an easy sell. This scooter, not so much for me. But if the quality is decent and warranty claims actually work, I can see the appeal of the HMP. I live in the ‘burbs, but this does seem like a solid city runabout.
If you can only charge at home the two separate batteries are not an improvement over an EV bike and buying 2 batteries to swap.
It has that Chinese mix of Yamaha and Honda style. It’s not a horrible price the range and charging is probably enough but not sure the price compared to the random Chinese imported e whatever. The support is nice but that’s what all the importers trying to get top dollar say. Then they close shop and you are left where you started from just paying more then you would have elsewhere. In my experience its better to deal with a dealer that sells lots of different brands China bikes. They are likey to stay around longer and might have some insight if you can’t find an answer otherwise.
Jianhao makes a similar looking bike. But it could easily be any number of other manufacturers as they typically just go buy parts from local suppliers and make it work.
Gas is going to have to go way up to want me to choose that over say a brand new Navi.
Have you driven a Navi? It’s a collection of entry level scooter parts pieced together into a non-scooter frame. The Grom is worth every penny over the Navi. And even then, neither of them have the scooter form.
Oh, and a Navi can hit like 50 mph, maybe 55 mph. So you likely wouldn’t want to use it on the highway at all.
I have, it actually look like a scooter underneath all that plastic, and yeah it is pretty terrible compared to a Grom, but maybe a little better than say a 50CC Ruckus. still it was priced just a pit over 2K new. and indeed managed to get to 50MPH with my big butt on the seat, though I will guess I was exceeding the vehicle max weight limit. Honestly it felt like Honda Express with a Tuned DG Pipe on it. I do have a gripe about it being considered a motorcycle, but I feel the same about what they are pedaling in this article as well.
Y’know, I think that the current crowd of kids zipping around on e-bikes, legally or not, is really going to drive the electric scooter and motorcycle market it the US. And something like this could really be the next step for those riders, when they decide to be legal commuters.
I don’t think they will ever do gas. They probably don’t want to shift. Or deal with much maintenance. Just plug in check the tires and go. Plus much kike the kids of the 60s and 70s that went into bigger jap bikes as they aged. These kids are China riders. They will probably always be on a Chinese bike.
My daughter is looking at the spare Harley’s and asking for one. But I showed her a Triumph Scrambler and she is now in love. they are cheap, basic engine setup is pretty long lived so most issues are ironed out and she being 5 foot 3 and change, she felt comfortable holding it up. just had to be careful of the upswept pipes.
Before China bikes were really around I put my ex wife on a rebel it seemed to be one of if only in the US that really worked for her at 5’2 ish that wasn’t a sports bike at the time. I know some 4’11 girls that ride those and rebels. They used to laugh at the choice between the two.
It seems like global markets have made more bikes available to fit shorter people. The China bikes run small. The Indian bikes can also run small especially Hero and Bajaj. Between Bajaj influce and triumph doing well in Thailand where many are made plus wanting into developing markets. It makes sense to make a smaller bike. I just don’t know that choice in gas bike market is the issue any more.
I’m not sure most of the 12 to 18 year olds riding around on the e scooters and ebikes will want to go to gas. I guess you never know. Some of the iPad kids are buying flip phones and digital cameras. Along with absolutely no tech cars. It was always assumed they would be good a tech and embrace it more then other generations. Maybe some of these ebike kids will want carbs in hope they aren’t stupid enough to want points.
my soft tail deluxe has a 30 inch seat height. it was often purchased by women because of that. but it is a lot more bike than I would feel comfy about here starting out on. I did have the yamaha equivalent to the rebel around in the back of the garage a while. little 250 Virago. it seemed to pull harder than the 250 suzuki or honda, while still looking sort of nice because of the V-Twin design. I would say a lot of the 15 year old 250 CC things might be ok too.,
I think most of the Asian 350 and below are small enough. Rebel 500 seems like a decent bike they were smart to make something with a more power. Now they have the 1100 that’s also sort of marketed toward women.
I know some guys that made or modified frames and built a lower seat bike or got a chopper and modified the forks back to a bobber or something similar. But they were truly ate up as were their wives. They wouldn’t ever buy a non American bike. I think the buells were sort of going after that demo too they just missed the mark. Royal Enfield sometimes are low enough too. You see women on them sometimes in Asia or India. The 4’11 women I know that ride sports bikes I asked why they didn’t ride a rebel or similar it’s just they for better on the sports bikes. Normally ninjas. You see that sometimes in Asia too. Maybe lower mass and they can just lean.
250 Ninja will make you feel like a cornering hero if you are small and don’t mind wrapping them up to 10,000 rpm.
If the current crowd of kids zipping around are anything like the ones around me, they probably going to all Darwin themselves before they have a chance to take that next step.
Seriously, I watched three grade-school aged kids on electric bikes, without helmets, in the left turn lane of a 55mph speed limit road waiting to “turn left” this summer while cars just flew past them. And I watched another teenager pull up to a stop light and try to egg me into racing him. He took off from the four way stop and was doing at least 60 as he was still pulling away by the time I (gradually) got up to speed. At least he had a helmet, but that’s not going to help you if you wipe out at 60 in shorts and a tshirt.
These ebikes cannot possibly be safe at the speeds kids are riding them, and they absolutely should not be on roads.
Modern version of minibikes.
Gonna drive it to extinction unless someone teaches them how to behave
That’s a pretty attractive price for an electric scoot. Very tempting, honestly.
I know that it’s an apples-and-oranges comparison really, but it always seems odd to me that something like this is considered a bargain at $6K, while there are a variety of more-capable entry-level regular new motorcycles that cost that much or even less.
I know you don’t need an M1 or M2 license to ride the EV scooter (right?) and there’s no clutch to futz with (which probably makes it more appealing to some folks, including those who never learned how to use a manual transmission). But to me, $6K still seems like a fair bit of change for an around-town electric scooter that might/could hop onto the freeway for a few exits if you dare.
At least in the US this would require a motorcycle endorsement to ride–it’s well over the power level of a moped and every state regulates it as a standard motorcycle.
Of course… this didn’t occur to me. Thanks for clarifying Jack. 🙂
The vast majority of gas scooters use CVTs so there isn’t a clutch anyway. They also sound terrible imo, as that’s just the nature of a CVT. So this is MUCH quieter, cleaner, less maintenance, and I’m sure a little zippier just due to the nature of electric motor power delivery.
I love the noise and physicality of riding a “proper” motorcycle, but I also totally understand the appeal of something like this.
I remember being surprised years ago when I learned how many gas powered scooters use a CVT, going back decades. TBH, I think that’s not the wrong idea: a ‘true’ automatic would add weight and complexity, and a clutched manual would require a bit more effort/training/confidence from what’s likely to often be a new/commuter-type of rider.
I remember when the Subaru Justy came out with AWD and a CVT. There were even magazine and TV (I think, or am just imagining) ads for it. It’s the first car with a CVT that I can personally recall. I also remember test driving various cars over the years with CVTs and not really liking any of them: Nissans, Subarus, even an Audi A4 I think. The newest CVTs (like Toyotas, with an actual gear for first) are improvements, but the best they can hope for is adequacy, and to be as unobtrusive as possible. I still prefer actual, traditional automatics, like Mazda keeps using in an effort to avoid CVTs and appeal to buyers/drivers.
But CVTs are a good choice for scooters IMO. I’ve had a Chinese Vespa knock-off with a lead-acid battery, and that Lee Iacoca/EV Global Motors E-bike, also with a lead-acid battery, as well as my Suzuki Vanvan 200 (clutched) which I waited too long to start riding. Given my aching back and joints, most of my motorcycle/scooter/bike days are probably behind me, but I’d still like to have something like a SuperCub (which has a semi-automatic transmission with actual gears, not a CVT).
Thinking about it a bit more, $6K for the HMP flash really isn’t too much to ask at all, given what it can do. I hereby revise my opinion. 🙂
That’s definitely Lincoln road around the north side of the presido. IDK if it’s heavily edited or just generated with asking for those kinds of photos, but Lincoln has those cable-post fences all along that side.
That is definitely possible. I just can’t find a single part of Lincoln that replicates this camera angle. Something I haven’t considered is that the road could be real, and then AI added in a fake bridge. Either way, I don’t mess with AI imagery in my posts.
This looks very close to my Xmax in terms of design (the front turn signal location is basically identical to the Euro-spec Xmax pre-refresh where they added the digital dash and moved it to the mirror housings). Seat design and rack also look like it’s using the Xmax design. Manufacturer maybe had a bunch of pre-2022 shells left over? Power and weight put it right around Xmax specs too, though I have a top speed of 90mph and enough space under the seat for two helmets. Still though, this isn’t a bad option for around town or in-city use.
How do you like the Xmas? I’ve been eyeballing that gen of Xmas for a while now. Might be time to step up from my Genuine Hooligan.
I used to tinker with Chinese e-mopeds, and this looks like they raided an Aima or Xiaodao parts bin. Not necessarily a bad thing, and makes sense given their Luyuan connection. Hub motors are a great choice for low power ebikes, I hear CFMoto Zeeho riders moaning about snapped belts, but hubs in China mostly die from bad bearings or water ingestion (or both).
I’d be concerned with switchgear quality and ergonomics, Chinese e-mopeds offer great specs and tech but tactile feel and rider position just isn’t that dialed in yet. Ninebot and NIU do better but there’s still room for improvement. (NIU’s N-GT rides great, Ninebot feels like you’re perched on a squat toilet)
If this is for delivery riders, seems like a good use case for battery swap kiosks like I’ve seen in various Asian cities. The top mounted contacts and 40lb battery weight make that more difficult though.
As a former PCX rider, I love this. Even the single battery range would have been enough for any trip I ever did on mine, and never having to stop for gas or do an awkward oil change (the drain plug was just low enough and close enough to other major structure that none of my normal oil collection containers would fit) would be perfect. I’ve been wishing for an electric PCX for years now, and although I think one exists, they don’t sell it in the US.
Sadly, I no longer live in a location that is urban scooter friendly so I won’t be picking one of these up, but if I did I’d probably already have a deposit down.
I have it as a guideline to not overly trust any product that
The one thing I trust even less, is any product that is a two wheeler while claiming to be the result of deep thought and research into solving a transportation problem.
It’s a damn chinese electric scooter. That’s it. Anyone who could have their dependency on cars solved by a scooter already has one. Maybe they’ll get that one the next time over, maybe not. Could be it’s not even that bad. But it’s not novelty, it’s not change, and it doesn’t add anything.
RIP the Tata Nano. 🙂
So did you take the iQ’s 3rd party cruise control off ??? 🙂 🙂 🙂
I did! Didn’t make a difference. Oh well.
Blast…
Them replacement coils that you installed – genuine Toyota or something else?
“It’s a damn chinese electric scooter. That’s it.”
Not quite:
“HMP says that, when designing the Flash, it benchmarked the Honda PCX scooter.”
So (presumably) it’s designed in America by an American for Americans to ride in America built to those American specifications in China.
That’s different from a bike designed in China by a Chinese person for Chinese people to ride in China built to those Chinese specifications in China.
Many Americans have different physiques, different laws, different expectations of quality, different driving styles, live in areas with different city layouts, etc than Chinese folks and the design of the bike should reflect this.
Is that pronounced hmph or hump?
It’s the Hemp Scooter, only legal in certain states.
I really wish they’d do range estimates at a few different weights and speeds to give people a more thorough picture of what is going on. As someone 80 pounds heavier, I would expect a decrease in range, but how much? And it can go double the speed, but for how long? If I get on this and get it to 70 mph, am I limited to 25 miles with 2 packs? 20 minute ride, then a couple hours of charging.
I am pretty sure that an electric motorcycle/scooter isn’t really in the cards for me, but it would be nice to see the numbers to verify that. It’s also hard to justify any electric motorcycle when Royal Enfield makes a compelling product at such a great price, of course.
“Muncho, a provider of self-service restaurant kiosks.”
It’s hard to tell from their website, is this just a weaksauce Automat?
Damn I miss Automats.
Hurts to see a scooter that doesn’t have the standard pet carrier that’ll fit, at least, a full-face helmet.
As an urban/suburban runabout, the lack of storage would limit its practicality and a topbox becomes mandatory.
Makes me miss the Honda PC800 a little bit, or a nice set of coordinated hard bags on a VFR750/800.
I was always mad that the luggage on my FJR1300 wouldn’t fit my helmet AND (insult to injury) Yamaha elected to not put a helmet lock anywhere on the bike.
Should be some sort of law – if you have hard luggage, it must fit a full-face, size Large helmet.
The PC800 was well ahead of its time.
But on a FJR? That’s a severe oversight. I agree. Yamaha should know better.
Even a small hook under the seat needs to be mandatory for all bikes as a helmet lock. But sadly missing on many.
While price parity is improving on electric scooters and motorcycles compared to their ICE counterparts, they are still will behind cars. This seems like a nice offering, but I’d way rather have the PCX at the lower price end. At the higher end, I’d rather spring for a SR GT 400 or Xmax.
Things are improving, but we just aren’t there yet unless you meet the somewhat narrow use case where the electric version of a scooter is a huge advantage to you.
Exactly. In this case, the use case is purely urban riders, or, supposedly, delivery riders.
Which even then isn’t a slam dunk. For urban deliveries, something like a PCX is getting through the work day on a single tank of fuel.
And even if you burn through the PCX’s tank, you aren’t sidelined for two hours.
I wonder if your best strategy would be to have one battery inside charging, running a single, and then swapping them once the one in the scoot dies. Seems like a viable strategy for the delivery driver. Not viable for the urban commuter unless you want three batteries (one at home, on in the scoot, and one at work). But that’s a pricey proposition.
The most viable use case for this to me seems like the commuter that can make the entire round trip on a single battery (or can charge at work). That keeps the upfront costs down the lowest.
For deeply congested cities, where it takes a long time to cover a short distance, EV’s are great delivery/rideshare vehicles because they don’t burn any energy sitting in traffic and will use maybe half their range in a day’s work.
BYD’s are hugely popular with Uber drivers in Rio de Janeiro for that reason, they start the morning with a full charge from any wall plug and don’t need to stop anywhere or spend any money on gas/energy throughout the day. They definitely spend some energy on the A/C, but never/rarely to the point of running out before the day’s over.
Another consideration is that scooter delivery is most common in hot countries, where it’s really nice to not have a hot engine under you.
Markets where they are built many have reached parity. In Vietnam for instance an vinfast is about parity sometimes a little cheaper then a new domesticly produced ice bike. China is probably close to parity and has been swinging closer to ebikes favor but they are often slightly different form factor. The Ebikes often are a little smaller vs a 50cc.
If you look at dirt bikes in the US market China e dirt bike vs Japanese ice dirt bike. It’s pretty close to parity. Maybe slight edge to the ebike. On the lower end the e bikes have the ice beat. You can get China 250cc dirt bike specs or better out of ebike that’s maybe 1/3 cheaper.
The Chinese liked to stay around 250cc or more like 229cc. Every once in a while they would build a 300 400 maybe a 450. But the price was never right. You could normally find a deal new Japanese bike for the same or cheaper. It seems like the same thing is happening with ebikes. On the lower end tons of deals at price parity and then some. Where on the upper end it’s not great. But the middle is greatly improving with ebikes. They are getting 450cc performance maybe a little more depending on what you are doing out of some of these ebikes that cost between about $3k to $5.5k.